Dave-R Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 2 minutes ago, Jas10 said: I think a much better version, more consistent & an upgrade, on Barkely should massively help us… Buendia? Sure… But I am still concerned about the status of our midfield… it’s a bit of a mess atm. We only really have Nakamba and McGinn available and of adequate quality, John needs to step up and be better & more disciplined this season. I was hoping Sanson could push him and take his place potentially but he’s still working his way to fitness. None of the youngster are readily or suitable, including JJ, imo. But yes, I would still like a DM. Names? Sangare, Anguissa or Kamara. See I think if we hold the ball better in the final third in our upcoming season, I do believe pressure will be taken off midfield and beyond. Survival season and becauseof a breakdown in midfield and wingers we were flooded, last season because we couldn't retain the ball better near opposition land our CDMs and midfield seen more action that the defence, why is that??? I believe it's because while we had difficulty retaining the ball, intercepting it higher up the pitch we still did it a fair bit better than the survival season. I think it all has a knock on affect and we do things better up the top, then we won't be so flooded in the rest of the pitch. We just have to bring in better players to play further up field. Buendia and Jack and someone else to accompany them and we should keep the control furth up field muchuch better Jas. Watkins as well I'd another reason why our defense is not flooded as much anymore, his style of play and hounding defenders doesn't give them so much time on the ball before they see pressure. Basically we have to be getters of that ball once were in the final third, if we don't got the ball we have to go get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 14 minutes ago, Jas10 said: Well, Terry had no experience of being a coach or manager. That’s the role we’re looking to fill? Someone who can offer something but also learn on the job. Mellberg has coached/managed.. I’m not sure, but Laursen may have completed his badges (as JT did on the job with us) and has openly expressed a desire to return to the club… Both excellent defenders, leaders, inspirational figures. Could teach and pass on a few things to our defenders… Petrov has done his badges and I’m sure would be happy to return to us… Doesn’t have to be a former player but if they fulfil the criteria, why not? Cahill could give us short term CB cover and have the same experience & take up the same responsibilities as JT did, if he is so inclined… Maybe Young could do the same… Plenty of candidates out there… respect and admiration for certain past players could help our players to listen, learn and improve from them… It’s not purely out of sentimentality, they need the right attributes and to fit the role but maybe an avenue worth pursuing… We have a great manager and an experienced assistant already… JT has been with us 3 years....we have grown, with him and his name alone is high profile. our defence has improved with him as coach, but we can't wait another 3 years for an ex player to come good like John. I think its a blow, if I'm honest and not easy to replace, if in fact that is their plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 4 minutes ago, TRO said: JT has been with us 3 years....we have grown, with him and his name alone is high profile. our defence has improved with him as coach, but we can't wait another 3 years for an ex player to come good like John. I think its a blow, if I'm honest and not easy to replace, if in fact that is their plan. Not feeling very positive TRO? We have targets lined up, deals take time… Who knows, most of them could be signing toward the very end of the window… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 5 minutes ago, TRO said: JT has been with us 3 years....we have grown, with him and his name alone is high profile. our defence has improved with him as coach, but we can't wait another 3 years for an ex player to come good like John. I think its a blow, if I'm honest and not easy to replace, if in fact that is their plan. Fair point… but there are suitable replacements out there. Maybe we don’t even need another with Shakespeare and Cutler taking on more involvement and varied responsibilities… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 6 minutes ago, Dave-R said: See I think if we hold the ball better in the final third in our upcoming season, I do believe pressure will be taken off midfield and beyond. Survival season and becauseof a breakdown in midfield and wingers we were flooded, last season because we couldn't retain the ball better near opposition land our CDMs and midfield seen more action that the defence, why is that??? I believe it's because while we had difficulty retaining the ball, intercepting it higher up the pitch we still did it a fair bit better than the survival season. I think it all has a knock on affect and we do things better up the top, then we won't be so flooded in the rest of the pitch. We just have to bring in better players to play further up field. Buendia and Jack and someone else to accompany them and we should keep the control furth up field muchuch better Jas. Watkins as well I'd another reason why our defense is not flooded as much anymore, his style of play and hounding defenders doesn't give them so much time on the ball before they see pressure. Basically we have to be getters of that ball once were in the final third, if we don't got the ball we have to go get it. I think your point about Ollie is right Dave, no issue with his off the ball work.....but the 2 wingers on a given day , don't do much in terms of stopping the opposition....that leaves midfield. Emi B might make a difference, I will have to see. I still think Midfield lacks a general. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 2 minutes ago, Jas10 said: Not feeling very positive TRO? We have targets lined up, deals take time… Who knows, most of them could be signing toward the very end of the window… Yeah positive in some ways, but not others....I do feel confident, that without a midfield signing of the quality and type, I am seeking, our lofty ambitions will be pie in the sky......happy to put my hands up, if I'm wrong. Its like looking at a beautiful garment with a flaw in it.....the garment is great.. to make it better, the flaw needs fixing. If I am being honest, I don't think Dean see's what I see, so it won't be fixed....Thats not me, putting myself on his footing, no contest....but I do think David Moyes and Brendan Rogers, do see, what I see. We will just have to ......wait and see. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vreitti Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 2 minutes ago, TRO said: If I am being honest, I don't think Dean see's what I see, so it won't be fixed....Thats not me, putting myself on his footing, no contest....but I do think David Moyes and Brendan Rogers, do see, what I see. You should have applied for the position of head coach! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 11 minutes ago, TRO said: I have been concerned about our midfield for some time, sure we have games where it is not as prevalent as others and you get by....Liverpool at home was a perfect example of it not being an issue, but you can't base your season on a game like that. over 38 games, I think I can see, why midtable is a much as we can expect, unless we strengthen the middle of the park. I hear all the deep lying playmakers malarkey, I just disagree with the notion of thinking we can blow teams away by buying better wingers and the like....We kept 15 clean sheets last season, magnificent, but if you was honest with yourself, Emi M was hugely instrumental in that....we have a decent defence, but we defend too deep in too many games....the theory that the better quality forwards can keep the ball, is for the birds, sure it helps, but all teams lose the ball, the better ones less granted.....but you can't allow teams to just ride roughshod through the middle unchallenged and it happens and it wil happen again next season ,too many times...mark my words. unless some unseen business is about to happen, that I don't expect. 9 minutes ago, Dave-R said: See I think if we hold the ball better in the final third in our upcoming season, I do believe pressure will be taken off midfield and beyond. Survival season and becauseof a breakdown in midfield and wingers we were flooded, last season because we couldn't retain the ball better near opposition land our CDMs and midfield seen more action that the defence, why is that??? I believe it's because while we had difficulty retaining the ball, intercepting it higher up the pitch we still did it a fair bit better than the survival season. I think it all has a knock on affect and we do things better up the top, then we won't be so flooded in the rest of the pitch. We just have to bring in better players to play further up field. Buendia and Jack and someone else to accompany them and we should keep the control furth up field muchuch better Jas. Watkins as well I'd another reason why our defense is not flooded as much anymore, his style of play and hounding defenders doesn't give them so much time on the ball before they see pressure. Basically we have to be getters of that ball once were in the final third, if we don't got the ball we have to go get it. I don’t disagree with better forward players also helping out, but TRO always has a point when referring to that central midfield… We saw again, later on in the season, how easily outmuscled and overpowered it can be. Our midfielders all seem a bit slight, small and lightweight. They have their qualities and when we are on it as a team, we press well and can be quite tenacious. When it worked, it wasn’t just against Liverpool. I thought we were flying at the start of the season, everyone stepped up. We destroyed Arsenal and went toe to toe with Leicester too, at their place, and won the game in the end (cracking goal by Ross). We looked good against other “big” teams too such as Chelsea and Manure… Until the Covid outbreak, we looked one hell of a team (let’s not forget that, it was really quite pleasurable at times A massive change and upturn after our “skin of the teeth” survival). What I think is, each player was performing well within their assigned role. Ross was the CAM, even the SS at times, and making a major contribution. Linking up wonderfully with Jack and Watkins, even Targett at times. Working hard and giving us attacking strength and power. That long range shooting is a great weapon to have too or late runs into the box… Doug & McGinn had to be extra disciplined. McGinn in particular wasn’t given as much license to roam and get forward so often (still occasionally did and contributed) but the attacking onus was on Ross and for him to help out our forwards… Doug was getting support and not being outnumbered at DM… the defence was getting some protection… Unfortunately, after the Covid outbreak within the club/team, our momentum was halted… Admittedly, we looked wonderful in that first half against Burnley… but that was the LAST TIME we saw THAT team… Jack got injured, Ross got injured. Upon his return, Ross was absolutely useless and couldn’t regain any semblance of form. So maybe McGinn’s thinking was, I better get up there and help out. Leaving Doug outnumbered, overpowered and outmuscled… And we were forced to play a kid in Ramsey who displayed no outstanding attributes. Just for energy and legs… McGinn’s form went off a cliff too. Slow, sloppy, sluggish, loose and careless in possession. Ollie had barely any service but his relentless attitude, determination and workrate got him a few goals. Eg, dispossessing Holgate to score against Everton. Jack returned, we played Nakamba who was fresher and better at tackled and interceptions than Doug (who was probably burnt out by now) and we finished the season well… Ross, nowhere to be seen. Farewell… So… hopefully it will be a much different story this season. The Covid season was crazy, hopefully things will be much more settled this time around… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas10 Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 15 minutes ago, TRO said: I think your point about Ollie is right Dave, no issue with his off the ball work.....but the 2 wingers on a given day , don't do much in terms of stopping the opposition....that leaves midfield. Emi B might make a difference, I will have to see. I still think Midfield lacks a general. Buendia is going to be awesome TRO. You will love him! Just wait and see… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 1 minute ago, vreitti said: You should have applied for the position of head coach! Typical. maybe its all the rest of his good work, I would struggle with. only you could respond like that.....predictable. just because you are a good manager, doesn't mean you can see everything.....I didn't agree with everything Steve Bruce did, despite contrary comments.....but I wouldn't be silly enough to challenge him either. I am a spectator, who watches the games, I am entitled to have my opinion on a managers view, without the silly comment you have made. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vreitti Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 3 minutes ago, TRO said: Typical. maybe its all the rest of his good work, I would struggle with. only you could respond like that.....predictable. just because you are a good manager, doesn't mean you can see everything.....I didn't agree with everything Steve Bruce did, despite contrary comments.....but I wouldn't be silly enough to challenge him either. I am a spectator, who watches the games, I am entitled to have my opinion on a managers view, without the silly comment you have made. You certainly are. Just as I'm entitled to call out the continued arrogance of your opinions. You aren't merely a spectator are you? You claim to know better than the manager. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 9 minutes ago, Jas10 said: I don’t disagree with better forward players also helping out, but TRO always has a point when referring to that central midfield… We saw again, later on in the season, how easily outmuscled and overpowered it can be. Our midfielders all seem a bit slight, small and lightweight. They have their qualities and when we are on it as a team, we press well and can be quite tenacious. When it worked, it wasn’t just against Liverpool. I thought we were flying at the start of the season, everyone stepped up. We destroyed Arsenal and went toe to toe with Leicester too, at their place, and won the game in the end (cracking goal by Ross). We looked good against other “big” teams too such as Chelsea and Manure… Until the Covid outbreak, we looked one hell of a team (let’s not forget that, it was really quite pleasurable at times A massive change and upturn after our “skin of the teeth” survival). What I think is, each player was performing well within their assigned role. Ross was the CAM, even the SS at times, and making a major contribution. Linking up wonderfully with Jack and Watkins, even Targett at times. Working hard and giving us attacking strength and power. That long range shooting is a great weapon to have too or late runs into the box… Doug & McGinn had to be extra disciplined. McGinn in particular wasn’t given as much license to roam and get forward so often (still occasionally did and contributed) but the attacking onus was on Ross and for him to help out our forwards… Doug was getting support and not being outnumbered at DM… the defence was getting some protection… Unfortunately, after the Covid outbreak within the club/team, our momentum was halted… Admittedly, we looked wonderful in that first half against Burnley… but that was the LAST TIME we saw THAT team… Jack got injured, Ross got injured. Upon his return, Ross was absolutely useless and couldn’t regain any semblance of form. So maybe McGinn’s thinking was, I better get up there and help out. Leaving Doug outnumbered, overpowered and outmuscled… And we were forced to play a kid in Ramsey who displayed no outstanding attributes. Just for energy and legs… McGinn’s form went off a cliff too. Slow, sloppy, sluggish, loose and careless in possession. Ollie had barely any service but his relentless attitude, determination and workrate got him a few goals. Eg, dispossessing Holgate to score against Everton. Jack returned, we played Nakamba who was fresher and better at tackled and interceptions than Doug (who was probably burnt out by now) and we finished the season well… Ross, nowhere to be seen. Farewell… So… hopefully it will be a much different story this season. The Covid season was crazy, hopefully things will be much more settled this time around… who can argue.... We have to remember Jack Grealish is one of the best players of his kind in the division, probably Europe, its understandable that we would miss him, his ball retention is a massive filip and it could be argued, he inadvertently papers over the cracks in Midfield. Many folk can have their theories and I ahve mine......but in too many games last season we surrendered midfield and in some games we didn't.....thats ok if you want to finish mid table. my point is, if we want to improve, its one area, we need to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fruitvilla Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 I'm not an expert here but here's some data: Ok it would be nice to concede fewer goals, but the issue to me seems to be not scoring enough goals Simplistic I know. I suspect if Villa were more successful in attack, that would take the pressure off the defence. Missing big chances, woodwork, average goals scored, lots of shots but little success. Just some thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Lerner's Driver Posted July 26, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 26, 2021 5 minutes ago, vreitti said: You certainly are. Just as I'm entitled to call out the continued arrogance of your opinions. You aren't merely a spectator are you? You claim to know better than the manager. I reckon Tro is pretty humble. Verbose, but humble and often right. I share his anxiety about our soft midfield and the potential for it to reappear in the upcoming season. Hope I am wrong. We have lots of other attributes, but it was horrible watching us give the ball away and be overrun again and again in the second half of last year. And yes, sure there were reasons, but we need to have an answer if those reasons recur. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post TRO Posted July 26, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted July 26, 2021 3 minutes ago, vreitti said: You certainly are. Just as I'm entitled to call out the continued arrogance of your opinions. You aren't merely a spectator are you? You claim to know better than the manager. Arrogance, based on what exactly?....if you think I was making a strong point, I was rather hoping I was......why is it always you?.....just ignore my posts, if they so ruffle you. you are miffed, because you don't agree, fine, but don't come on here calling my posts arrogant when you offer nothing of significance other than juvenile comments of me purporting to know more than the manager....thats a preposterous false narrative. I couldn't live with Dean Smith, I couldn't do his job.....doesn't mean I can't make an observation of one thing I am concerned with.....In a one on one Dean Could explain and I could think again, is that being arrogant, silly. If you disagree, with my point, have the courage to call the point out, rather than attack me, which is far easier to do.....but I guess that takes too much humility, never mind brainwork. Arrogant my ar** Post on the post, not the poster.....and this is by far, not the first time. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vreitti Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Lerner's Driver said: I reckon Tro is pretty humble. Verbose, but humble and often right. I share his anxiety about our soft midfield and the potential for it to reappear in the upcoming season. Hope I am wrong. We have lots of other attributes, but it was horrible watching us give the ball away and be overrun again and again in the second half of last year. And yes, sure there were reasons, but we need to have an answer if those reasons recur. I do get your reservations, but as you yourself said, there were quite obvious reasons last season. Fwiw I don't think well see the same problems occur this coming season. Edited July 26, 2021 by vreitti 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 2 minutes ago, vreitti said: I do get your reservations, but as you yourself said, there were quite obvious reasons last season. Fwiw I don't well see the same problems occur this coming season. I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 Well here's hoping Smith and our staff of sport scientists and coaches identify this crippling flaw and puts an end to this deep laying "playmaker malarkey" 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vreitti Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 (edited) 14 minutes ago, TRO said: Arrogance, based on what exactly?....if you think I was making a strong point, I was rather hoping I was......why is it always you?.....just ignore my posts, if they so ruffle you. you are miffed, because you don't agree, fine, but don't come on here calling my posts arrogant when you offer nothing of significance other than juvenile comments of me purporting to know more than the manager....thats a preposterous false narrative. I couldn't live with Dean Smith, I couldn't do his job.....doesn't mean I can't make an observation of one thing I am concerned with.....In a one on one Dean Could explain and I could think again, is that being arrogant, silly. If you disagree, with my point, have the courage to call the point out, rather than attack me, which is far easier to do.....but I guess that takes too much humility, never mind brainwork. Arrogant my ar** Post on the post, not the poster.....and this is by far, not the first time. Lighten up old fella. Sure it was a cheap shot from me, then again you've yapped about the same issue for years. Perhaps you do not remember, but I share your concern myself, but I don't claim to know better than the manager. And I don't think Dean will want the type of player we advocate. Furthermore I generally agree with you and respect your opinion. Edited July 26, 2021 by vreitti 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vreitti Posted July 26, 2021 Share Posted July 26, 2021 6 minutes ago, TRO said: I do. I believe Buendia will make the difference, even if it's further upfield. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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