Genie Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 The added time thing also seems very erratic. Sometimes 2-3 minutes, others 7-10 for no obvious difference in amount of stoppages 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 23 hours ago, Stevo985 said: I'll caveat this by saying I haven't seen the incident in question. But I think the problem is you could have several of the people you mention in your post think it IS a penalty, and it still wouldn't be given. The high bar / clear and obvious nonsense means that even if some of those people think it is a penalty, if it's not deemed obvious enough then a mistake won't be corrected. It's nonsense Regarding this incident specifically, I don't see how a cnclusion could arise that it's not a penalty. The attacker: -Doesn't try to initiate contact, actively tries to avoid it by trying to hurdle the keeper -Is in clear posession of the ball The goalkeeper -Lifts his arm up in an attempt to reach the ball, directly tripping the player -Makes no contact with the ball I'd be genuinely interested to hear views of anyone that doesn't think it's a penalty, and why. I can't get my head around it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted February 13 Author Share Posted February 13 8 minutes ago, kurtsimonw said: Regarding this incident specifically, I don't see how a cnclusion could arise that it's not a penalty. The attacker: -Doesn't try to initiate contact, actively tries to avoid it by trying to hurdle the keeper -Is in clear posession of the ball The goalkeeper -Lifts his arm up in an attempt to reach the ball, directly tripping the player -Makes no contact with the ball I'd be genuinely interested to hear views of anyone that doesn't think it's a penalty, and why. I can't get my head around it. The issue, as Stevo says, is that they're assessing whether it is or isn't a penalty. They're assessing 2 separate things. So even if the panel who assess these decisions think that it's a pen, they assess the reffing team as correct as it was also correct for VAR to not intervene. It's mental. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 3 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: The issue, as Stevo says, is that they're assessing whether it is or isn't a penalty. They're assessing 2 separate things. So even if the panel who assess these decisions think that it's a pen, they assess the reffing team as correct as it was also correct for VAR to not intervene. It's mental. Maybe I'm thick because I don't know what this means. How can it be a penalty but also correctly not a penalty? I 100% get it on certain grey areas, minimal contact, player looking for contact, did they get a slight ouch on the ball, was it enough, etc. but here I'm baffled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted February 13 Author Share Posted February 13 18 minutes ago, kurtsimonw said: Maybe I'm thick because I don't know what this means. How can it be a penalty but also correctly not a penalty? I 100% get it on certain grey areas, minimal contact, player looking for contact, did they get a slight ouch on the ball, was it enough, etc. but here I'm baffled. Ref doesn't give/or does give on field decision. After the game they review the decision. They decide that ref should have given penalty on field but VAR was also correct not to overturn. It's all weasel words tbh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 30 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said: Ref doesn't give/or does give on field decision. After the game they review the decision. They decide that ref should have given penalty on field but VAR was also correct not to overturn. It's all weasel words tbh Yep, and what’s peculiar is that VAR completely ignore the on-field decision for offside and do it to the millimeter. Yet for any kind of penalty / red card review, an enormous amount of leeway goes to the ref’s original call. Now I get that where the ref has *seen* everything correctly and made a judgment call (eg he feels attacker was playing for the pen, or he feels the tackle is borderline red / yellow). But often I think VAR is reviewing things the ref hasn’t been able to see properly, and they should just completely disregard the onfield decision and start from scratch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted February 13 Author Share Posted February 13 1 minute ago, KentVillan said: Yep, and what’s peculiar is that VAR completely ignore the on-field decision for offside and do it to the millimeter. Yet for any kind of penalty / red card review, an enormous amount of leeway goes to the ref’s original call. Now I get that where the ref has *seen* everything correctly and made a judgment call (eg he feels attacker was playing for the pen, or he feels the tackle is borderline red / yellow). But often I think VAR is reviewing things the ref hasn’t been able to see properly, and they should just completely disregard the onfield decision and start from scratch. 100% The other issue is refs are too scared to make tough decisions because they have the security of VAR but then VAR is advised not to get involved anyway. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 Also VAR should be getting involved in direct FKs around the box. Some shocking ones get awarded or overlooked which are (or would be) very good goalscoring opportunities. At least review it if a goal is scored direct from the FK? Just think the rules and the implementation are bonkers, even though I really like having accurate offside calls now. One thing they could do is have extra people on the VAR team so they can all look at the different possible infractions at the same time. Would speed up the game loads. But PL are tight. Always have been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted February 13 Share Posted February 13 7 hours ago, KentVillan said: Also VAR should be getting involved in direct FKs around the box. Some shocking ones get awarded or overlooked which are (or would be) very good goalscoring opportunities. At least review it if a goal is scored direct from the FK? Just think the rules and the implementation are bonkers, even though I really like having accurate offside calls now. One thing they could do is have extra people on the VAR team so they can all look at the different possible infractions at the same time. Would speed up the game loads. But PL are tight. Always have been. Could just give each team a couple of reviews each. For example the players all know that it shouldn't be a corner but is given. No VAR checks on that kind of thing so the corner gets taken and a goal is scored. Instead, the corner gets given, the player gives the ref the signal, VAR checks it, goal kick is given instead, the goal is avoided. Same thing with your free kick scenario. The players know there's been a dive but the ref is conned and it doesn't get checked, free kick taker sticks it in the top corner. If the defender reviews it and it's a dive, free kick given to defending team, yellow card to the diver. If it was a foul, the team loses the review. If it's not clear cut, the ref's decision stands but they keep their review. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanAVFC Posted February 17 Author Share Posted February 17 Absolute **** embarrassment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted February 17 Share Posted February 17 He was alright until he lost his head VAR and offside is what it is but the penalty shout isn't good enough and the Paulinha tackle is a shocker that no one will even talk about, mcginn is a lucky boy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted February 17 Share Posted February 17 Proves really what the Prem and PGMOL think about us. A newbie ref would not have refeereed any of the top 4 sides, Arse, City, Tottenham or Plop. not a chance, too important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted February 17 Share Posted February 17 Just now, villa4europe said: He was alright until he lost his head VAR and offside is what it is but the penalty shout isn't good enough and the Paulinha tackle is a shocker that no one will even talk about, mcginn is a lucky boy VAR blatently didn't want to over rule the newbie ref today. So obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted February 17 Share Posted February 17 FWIW ita also another week where we'll moan like **** about him but Fulham were chanting you don't know what you're doing and you're not fit to referee Not sure what decisions they thought he got wrong? There were minor ones like a blatant corner not given but it's not like he robbed them 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted February 17 Share Posted February 17 Just now, foreveryoung said: VAR blatently didn't want to over rule the newbie ref today. So obvious. But that penalty shout is what VAR is for, look at the refs positioning, him not giving it because he can't see it properly makes perfect sense and no one would argue against it VAR is not over ruling its offering a better view, just buzz down to him and say go to the screen, like it was always intended to do and like fifa and uefa use it They're making a rod for their own back because of incompetence and arrogance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted February 17 Share Posted February 17 (edited) 6 minutes ago, villa4europe said: FWIW ita also another week where we'll moan like **** about him but Fulham were chanting you don't know what you're doing and you're not fit to referee Not sure what decisions they thought he got wrong? There were minor ones like a blatant corner not given but it's not like he robbed them The Pau barge in the first half Fulham player dived, was never a pen Edit - had a look on their forum, the penalty not given, the Luiz back pass yep give them that it was a bad one and then just the number of yellow cards seems to be the main gripe Edited February 17 by villa4europe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrBlack Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 The foul by Odegaard on Aaron Ramsey was horrific. Studs up, tackle from behind, didn't get the ball, and has resulted in the player now probably getting injured for a month or more. Not even given as a foul. Combined with the dubious penalty calls across multiple games today just shows the state of refereeing in the league is appalling. VAR is not making it any better either. Just atrocious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyClarke Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 6 hours ago, MrBlack said: The foul by Odegaard on Aaron Ramsey was horrific. Studs up, tackle from behind, didn't get the ball, and has resulted in the player now probably getting injured for a month or more. Not even given as a foul. Combined with the dubious penalty calls across multiple games today just shows the state of refereeing in the league is appalling. VAR is not making it any better either. Just atrocious. Sounds more like 9 or 10 months. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 Saw some people saying they thought the new ref was alright on twitter. Absolute dog shite. Basic decisions completely wrong, lost control of the game, and bottled giving Traore a second yellow. He's like every other ref. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted February 18 VT Supporter Share Posted February 18 (edited) 6 minutes ago, kurtsimonw said: Saw some people saying they thought the new ref was alright on twitter. Absolute dog shite. Basic decisions completely wrong, lost control of the game, and bottled giving Traore a second yellow. He's like every other ref. Edited February 18 by Follyfoot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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