Vive_La_Villa Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 (edited) @villalad21 maybe I’m remembering it differently than what it was. Especially as we scored 78 goals. I just remember it to be very flat. Yes we were very sold but if we ever went behind it normally meant we lost the game or scraped a point at best. Edited July 25, 2020 by Vive_La_Villa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 1 minute ago, Vive_La_Villa said: if we ever went behind it normally meant we lost the game or scraped a point at best. Well that hasn't changed much this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, villalad21 said: Well that hasn't changed much this season. You know it’s a differently league right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 Just now, Vive_La_Villa said: You know it’s a differently league right? Doesn't mean you have to give up every time you go a goal down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaffer85 Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 58 minutes ago, villalad21 said: A losing cup final is nothing to brag about. Well at least to me it is. But maybe i have a different mentality than some. 17th isn't a good season. It's an acceptable season. We have shown we are a better side than Newcastle over 2 games and yet they are mid table. Smith needs to get more out of these players on a consistent basis. It's no good just to turn up the last 10 games of the season. This has happened in 2 seasons in a row now. You have to show these performance levels and desire from start to finish. Buy your logic the Liverpool fans should have been looking for klopp to get the sack because he lost his first few cup finals It has to start somewhere and if we stay up we will have progressed every year under Smith and that's all we can ask for We are not a big fish anymore we have build every year when we start to regress then is the time for a change If someone had have said to me we would 17 in the prem this year when Smith took over I would laughed at them before I bit there hand off In theory we have roughly moved up 20 league places in 1 and half seasons under Smith if that ain't progress I don't no what is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 10 minutes ago, villalad21 said: Doesn't mean you have to give up every time you go a goal down. No it doesn’t. But we were talking about Smith v Bruce in the Championship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 1 minute ago, Vive_La_Villa said: No it doesn’t. But we were talking about Smith v Bruce in the Championship. I think it was different circumstances. When Bruce took over we were a lower to mid table Championship team. He stabilized us and changed the culture. Took us to a cup final in his first full season, sadly didn't take us over the line. I'm not discrediting what Smith achieved in his first full season by the way. Just saying it was a different prospect. Better owners and a better team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 7 minutes ago, gaffer85 said: Buy your logic the Liverpool fans should have been looking for klopp to get the sack because he lost his first few cup finals It has to start somewhere and if we stay up we will have progressed every year under Smith and that's all we can ask for We are not a big fish anymore we have build every year when we start to regress then is the time for a change If someone had have said to me we would 17 in the prem this year when Smith took over I would laughed at them before I bit there hand off In theory we have roughly moved up 20 league places in 1 and half seasons under Smith if that ain't progress I don't no what is All the "doubters" are asking is for the team to perform and fight for a full season. Why do we have to delay it until the last 10 games of the season? That's what frustrates us so much. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 14 hours ago, meregreen said: Check out Alex Ferguson’s early record at Utd. He was one game away from the sack. Sacked in the morning was being sung at him at every away ground they played at, including ours.They played Forest in the Cup and won. It was a catalyst, the whole mood at Utd changed. Yes, he was blessed with having the wherewithal to sign some top players and later to harvest the riches of Utds youth set up. But regardless of that, he overcame those early problems and gradually climbed the ladder to success. Now maybe Dean Smith won’t follow that path, maybe he’ll be dumped, as so many managers are these days, before he can really make his mark. But I for one, am prepared to give him longer than some seem prepared to give him. He took over a basket case of a club. We are battling to stay in a League few of us would even have believed we would have been competing in half way through last season. Keep the faith, UTV. There is no right answer to this.....and that is a legitimate example of staying with it and keeping your nerve.....but lets rememeber, Mark Robins goal, changed it........you have to have change, you just simply cannot go on, losing games,something has to change. The other night, I seen some difference, I hadn't seen most of the season....both in the manager and the team.....I just hope it continues in to Sunday's game. Should we go on to stay up and strengthen the team and subsequently win more games, views on Dean will change.......Managers are people, its not them personally we judge, its their ability to manage.....my wife used to work in a top store and knew all the managers, she said they were all charming, exCept one....MON.....she told me Alex McLeish was alovely man. But we don't want friends, we want managers who can win us games. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 (edited) 14 hours ago, avfcDJ said: Bruce had the most expensive team in the league and failed. Smith has one of the “cheapest” sides in this league and might keep us up. Bruce got defended constantly, Smith gets every mistake thrown down our throats. About right? rubbish. Explain how he had the most expensive team, in what context......and a large portion of that team was handed to Dean,anyway. Sure Dean got us up, and that great run was instrumental.....but most of the players that got us up were left by Steve Bruce....Dean himself said after the final that both goalscorers were Steve Bruce signings a gentlemanly gesture to quell the nonsense written about him. Dean has always sought to play a better brand of football, but both ways have consequences.....we set out to play open football this season and got spanked, since lockdown we have learned and tightened up........on the other hand Bruce has a team individually no better than ours, but his mantra of cautious football has rendered him safe......who is right is anyones opinion...... a bit of both for me. Bruce got defended constantly, give me a break, you have some front to write that( from me he might have done, he got constant abuse elsewhere).....I don't think any manager will ever have a cabbage launched at him, despicable act for any manager to endure( and most of the country baulked at that too)......If you think Dean gets every mistake thrown down your throat, specifically argue against it, if its wrong, attempt to correct it, thats what a forum is for......Don't just depise the critic, argue your point. Anyway, it is ludicrous to attempt to deflect Dean Smith criticism by suggesting Steve Bruce never got enough, that is an argument for the Birds. and I might say, Dean was also comlimentary on adopting Steve's squad when he took over so the basket case is another exaggeration to suit the agenda....He actually said he could get this team promoted and fair play, he did.....it was a stupendous achievement.....and a much better spectacle than Steve Managed. Edited July 25, 2020 by TRO 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacketspuds Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 Already bricking it about tomorrow. I had already accepted relegation and was looking forward to next season. Now I know I'll be gutted if we go down after doing so well to get us to where we are right now. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 4 minutes ago, jacketspuds said: Already bricking it about tomorrow. I had already accepted relegation and was looking forward to next season. Now I know I'll be gutted if we go down after doing so well to get us to where we are right now. The only consultation is that next season might be more enjoyable in the championship. Should we stay up I can only see another of struggle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 This Bruce v Smith debate is boring. Just remember how Bruce did with the same squad in his last season. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, omariqy said: This Bruce v Smith debate is boring. Just remember how Bruce did with the same squad in his last season. Only 2 pts off 6th after his last game in charge. And it was only 11 games into the season. Plenty of time to turn it around Edited July 25, 2020 by villalad21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, omariqy said: This Bruce v Smith debate is boring. Just remember how Bruce did with the same squad in his last season. I've been off this forum for almost a year.. Arriving back and seeing Bruce debates are still going on is just incredible. Sticking with the current situation... Will you be avoiding watching the game tomorrow afterall Omariqy? Edited July 25, 2020 by AvfcRigo82 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted July 25, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted July 25, 2020 On 23/07/2020 at 13:02, hippo said: I really think this season is just an average one injury wise - Heaton is the only real loss - youre never going through a season where your better players won't miss chunks of the season through injury. Are you seriously trying to suggest that losing Wesley has not affected us? He scored 5 goals before injury. His replacements have scored 1 since. Even if he had only got another 5 in the second half, imagine what 4 extra goals would have done for our points total. Certainly we would be safe now. But as well as goals we generally were a better looking team when he played. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 3 hours ago, avfcDJ said: I'm talking about one forum user in particular. me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 8 minutes ago, sidcow said: Are you seriously trying to suggest that losing Wesley has not affected us? He scored 5 goals before injury. His replacements have scored 1 since. Even if he had only got another 5 in the second half, imagine what 4 extra goals would have done for our points total. Certainly we would be safe now. But as well as goals we generally were a better looking team when he played. Think 2 of them were against an injury hit Norwich though. Thought Samatta had 2 goals ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 19 minutes ago, omariqy said: This Bruce v Smith debate is boring. Just remember how Bruce did with the same squad in his last season. Fair play, thats right......and when he went the decision was right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 10 hours ago, briny_ear said: I think that's probably the most nonsensical statement I have ever read on Villatalk! Bruce was generally vilified on here almost from the word go - quite a lot of it unpleasantly personal abuse. He got us into the playoff places, we lost narrowly - he was written of as a failure. Smith got us into the playoff places, he won narrowly. He was hailed as a hero - such is life, the victors write the histories. He has faltered badly in the premier league and the excuses have flowed - he didn't pick the squad, Suso did, the squad are all useless, and so on... About right? In a nutshell Briny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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