Peter Griffin Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 16 minutes ago, villa4europe said: i don't think smith underperforms or overperforms based on the 25 players that he has If that is the case then, for me, he is not the right man to be leading AVFC. I do not want and I doubt Purslow or NSWE want a Head Coach / Manager that does not get the players he has over performing. I think Deano over performed in his 1st season at Villa. In the 2nd season he did a decent job in that we stayed up but it was by the skin of our teeth and it was the only actual transition year we have had in a long time so he had a good excuse. Last season he over performed for half the season and under performed for half the season. Net result was finishing in an expect position. The half season of under performance is not really acceptable and should not have happened. This season at Deano needs to have Villa finishing in the too 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Keyblade Posted October 21, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 21, 2021 Listening to his press conference and hearing his level-headed analysis reminded me how off-base this thread is (and how asinine most of the questions journalists ask are). 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 14 hours ago, briny_ear said: I missed that. Who did he defend and what did he defend them against? just a character reference really, saying what a thoroughly decent guy he is....I think it was reported on Talk sport. I guess his achilles has been pushing himself too far, when he is/was a championship manager and no more. but hey ho, not our problem.....buts its nice to be nice.....I thought Dean was thoroughly decent supporting another manager, when he is down....he didn't have to. However, the 8 mill, helps too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Griffin Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 2 minutes ago, sne said: The topic being which players who were fit against Wolves or how Dean Smith and Villa are doing? No, if you reads back on the thread the topic was comparing Moyes progress at West Ham to Smith's progress at Villa. I posted a comment to show that there was only 1 point between Villa and Hammers on the day Moyes took over at Hammers and the teams were 17th and 18th in the league. I was showing that Moyes has improved West Ham more than Smith has improved Villa in the same period. That is comparing the two managers and their progress. It is a way of comparing Smith's effectiveness by comparing him to a peer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 26 minutes ago, Peter Griffin said: No, if you reads back on the thread the topic was comparing Moyes progress at West Ham to Smith's progress at Villa. I posted a comment to show that there was only 1 point between Villa and Hammers on the day Moyes took over at Hammers and the teams were 17th and 18th in the league. I was showing that Moyes has improved West Ham more than Smith has improved Villa in the same period. That is comparing the two managers and their progress. It is a way of comparing Smith's effectiveness by comparing him to a peer What about his other peers he’s been compared to in the past in Wilder and Bielsa. It always seems that Smith is compared to flavour of the month for whatever reason. He’s always at a disadvantage even in comparison to Moyes who both have done great in the last 18 months lifting their teams up the table, that’s still not enough. If West Ham fall away then whoever the flavour of the month is next, Smith will be compared to. Rodgers has only 11 points and 3 wins, Arteta the same. Even Brentford who people are drooling over only have 3 wins and 2 points more than us. It’s just overblown at the moment on here. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Griffin Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 1 minute ago, nick76 said: What about his other peers West Ham were place ahead of us in the league table with 1 point more so they were the nearest to us. Also, the changed their manager in Dec so it is show the effectiveness of Moyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 Has Moyes replaced Potter as this weeks manager to pick on Smith with? Sunderland fans be chuffed to hear he is so popular on here 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 2 minutes ago, Zatman said: Has Moyes replaced Potter as this weeks manager to pick on Smith with? I struggle to keep up it changes so regularly. We should all have a bet who next to be the flavour of the month will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted October 21, 2021 Moderator Share Posted October 21, 2021 Please could posters use threads more suited to their conversations. If you want to discuss 4-3-3/5-3-2, tactics, players picked or not, then use the following thread. If you want to compare how clubs are doing this season then please use. If you want to discuss the merits of any club's overall recruitment, coaching, board financing of transfers, team selections and all the other collective efforts that contribute to a team's results over time, in detail, then start a thread for it. Detailed analysis of West Ham's selections and results is not for this thread. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 37 minutes ago, nick76 said: What about his other peers he’s been compared to in the past in Wilder and Bielsa. It always seems that Smith is compared to flavour of the month for whatever reason. He’s always at a disadvantage even in comparison to Moyes who both have done great in the last 18 months lifting their teams up the table, that’s still not enough. If West Ham fall away then whoever the flavour of the month is next, Smith will be compared to. Rodgers has only 11 points and 3 wins, Arteta the same. Even Brentford who people are drooling over only have 3 wins and 2 points more than us. It’s just overblown at the moment on here. Yes agreed, but they are doing shite. Rodgers and Arteta know they have to improve. We are a a point below them, but we are fine as it's only 8 games in Smith is doing fine, it's just a few poor games. See the difference anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerCollins29 Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 Dean will demand a performance tomorrow and i think he'll get it too 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Griffin Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 59 minutes ago, Zatman said: Has Moyes replaced Potter as this weeks manager to pick on Smith with? What manager(s) would be most appropriate to compare Smith to? or is a critical comparison not allowed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 2 minutes ago, Peter Griffin said: What manager(s) would be most appropriate to compare Smith to? or is a critical comparison not allowed? Steve Bruce. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 4 minutes ago, Peter Griffin said: What manager(s) would be most appropriate to compare Smith to? or is a critical comparison not allowed? Why does he have to be compared to others? The only comparison for a Villa manager is against other recent Villa managers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, foreveryoung said: Yes agreed, but they are doing shite. Rodgers and Arteta know they have to improve. We are a a point below them, but we are fine as it's only 8 games in Smith is doing fine, it's just a few poor games. See the difference anyone? No not really, we are fine. We don’t have the points we wanted and we’ve had some poor performances, we’ve had some wins as well. We are fine because we know there is more to come with hopefully injuries in the rear view mirror and in a few games Buendia would’ve had more games under belt after injury, Bailey will hopefully be in the team, Traore and Sanson as options and hopefully Ollie will have got out of his poor form. Spurs game and Wolves 10 minutes was poor and Smith needs to fix that, and Smith needs to get this team going, I’m not arguing with that. Smith knows they have to improve and he’s talked about that today. Are we doing well? No…is it a meltdown? No. He knows we have to improve, I think everybody agrees with that but we are only 8 games, there are mitigating circumstances and at the moment it is “fine” just as it was fine, 2 games ago after we beat Man U and Everton. We weren’t phenomenal then or shit and we aren’t either of them now…we are fine but in need of a lot of improvement. Edited October 21, 2021 by nick76 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post blandy Posted October 21, 2021 Moderator Popular Post Share Posted October 21, 2021 Just now, Zatman said: Why does he have to be compared to others? Is the right answer. Frankly it’s a fools game. Dean Smith has a different board, different resources, different injuries to players, different size of club, different scouts, different length of time in this league, in Lower leagues and all the rest of it. If the manager of [another club] has a good or bad season, in their circumstances…we’ll that’s them. It’s got nothing to do with Dean Smith. I judge him by what he brings to our club and what he’s done so far, not by whether this week’s flavour of the, er, month is prospering mightily in Yorkshire or on the south coast, or has been relegated and sacked. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 8 minutes ago, Peter Griffin said: What manager(s) would be most appropriate to compare Smith to? or is a critical comparison not allowed? Why does he need to be constantly compared. Yes indirectly or once in a while but each club is different at different points in their journeys. Why can’t we just talk about Smith. It just feels like Smith is compared to flavour of the month at the time or a manager who the best at a type and Smith compares seems to compare unfavourably to that manager. Even in the arguments it’s not balanced because if it was it would be for example he’s not doing as well as Moyes but he’s been able to stave off the slump unlike Bielsa and still got some decent points in the bag this season. It always seems Dean has to be compared unfavourably to somebody to prove a point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Griffin Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 3 minutes ago, Zatman said: Why does he have to be compared to others? The only comparison for a Villa manager is against other recent Villa managers It makes sense to compare how we are performing against our competition. All companies whether sporting or otherwise benchmark. It is good business practice. From a footballing fans perspective it makes total sense to debate and discuss how effective your manager is. The manager makes a huge difference in a club. Just look at Steve Cooper. He took over at Forest relatively recently and in the last 6 games they have the highest points return in the entire league. Under Hughton, they had the very close to if the lowest points return in the league. That is a crazy turnaround and it absolutely down to the change in manager. Comparing manager to our peers and competition makes sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 1 minute ago, Peter Griffin said: It makes sense to compare how we are performing against our competition. All companies whether sporting or otherwise benchmark. It is good business practice. From a footballing fans perspective it makes total sense to debate and discuss how effective your manager is. The manager makes a huge difference in a club. Just look at Steve Cooper. He took over at Forest relatively recently and in the last 6 games they have the highest points return in the entire league. Under Hughton, they had the very close to if the lowest points return in the league. That is a crazy turnaround and it absolutely down to the change in manager. Comparing manager to our peers and competition makes sense Not really! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Griffin Posted October 21, 2021 Share Posted October 21, 2021 11 minutes ago, blandy said: Is the right answer. Frankly it’s a fools game. Dean Smith has a different board, different resources, different injuries to players, different size of club, different scouts, different length of time in this league, in Lower leagues and all the rest of it. If the manager of [another club] has a good or bad season, in their circumstances…we’ll that’s them. It’s got nothing to do with Dean Smith. I judge him by what he brings to our club and what he’s done so far, not by whether this week’s flavour of the, er, month is prospering mightily in Yorkshire or on the south coast, or has been relegated and sacked. I completely disagree with saying it is the right answer. Obviously, there are difference between clubs with funding, board etc but that is the same in all walks of life and in all businesses. Why do you think businesses benchmark themselves against other companies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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