Chindie Posted November 16, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted November 16, 2012 Awol, it's widely accepted that Israel is building on land it has no right to, I'm not sure how you can say otherwise. Unless you claim that Palestine doesn't exist and their is no territory belonging to the Palestinians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 UN talking of which wasn't the UN due to vote soon on giving Palestine "observer State" status the US needless to say weren't backing it but the Palestinians seemed confident they had enough votes in the bag to achieve it .. wonder if this latest round of violence will stop the vote going ahead ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 Meanwhile the shelling continues. You'd hate to be a kid in this situation. WTF have they done to deserve it? That makes me angry more than anything. Blowing up kids on account of things that happened long before they even existed is not only barbaric, but utterly stupid. Edit: Also, Al Jazeera reporting IDF are seeking approval to call up to 75,000 reservists, considerably more tha the 30,000 reported last night. It sounds like posturing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Rev Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 It's not as big as Great Britain? More people live in London than in Israel. Now obviously I'm not saying that everybody in Israel should live in a metropolis, or that Israel should be a city state but when people somehow cant see that constantly building new settlements ever closer to Gaza can be interpreted as aggressive, antagonistic and an attempt to wipe Gaza off the map (at the same time as very publicly complaining that Hamas say they want to do the same to Israel!) I do have to wonder what kind of blinkers they are wearing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 It's not as big as Great Britain? More people live in London than in Israel. Now obviously I'm not saying that everybody in Israel should live in a metropolis, or that Israel should be a city state but when people somehow cant see that constantly building new settlements ever closer to Gaza can be interpreted as aggressive, antagonistic and an attempt to wipe Gaza off the map (at the same time as very publicly complaining that Hamas say they want to do the same to Israel!) I do have to wonder what kind of blinkers they are wearing. I'm sorry for this but again, what your saying is complete bollocks. What other country is not allowed to build up to its own border in case the neighbours don't like it? Hamas are rocketing cities up to 25km inside Israel, where exactly do you want them to live, and why the hell should where they live be dictated by a bunch of murderous religious fruitcakes? It's true Israel are building illegal settlements in the occupied West Bank (clearly wrong) but there is no restriction on them or any nation building within their own borders, period. Personally I'd like to see Israel withdraw to '67 borders and have NATO guarantee the integrity of those boundaries, however most Israeli's would probably be reluctant to bet their future on a bunch of anti-semites, and a cursory read over this thread would amply explain why.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted November 16, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted November 16, 2012 I don't think there's a single anti-semite in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Rev Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 But if you are not rabidly pro Israel then you are an anti Semite according to a lot of folk over there. It swings both ways. I'm not really interested in arguing about it either, there has been sixty years of fighting, thousands of deaths, millions of debates and essays and billions of prayers on the matter and we are still are where we are. A thread on a football forum isn't going to solve this but I stand by everything I said in the post you took offence to I'm clearly not going to change your mind about things and you aren't going to change mine. Our sympathies lie in different places and I think that is all there is to it. I dont feel the need to spend the rest of the evening going around in circles to confirm it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 lol it was only before time that the anti-semite card was produced, it's the hilarious logic of a Zionist. If you don't actively support Israel's endeavors then you absolutely must be an anti-semite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 If you're not with us you're against us, eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ads Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 KHV and his post is the clearly anti-semitic. He shares the same ideology as Afterdinnerjacket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 lol it was only before time that the anti-semite card was produced, it's the hilarious logic of a Zionist. If you don't actively support Israel's endeavors then you absolutely must be an anti-semite. If as they have in this thread, people post that it would be for the best if Israel was wiped off the map then that is anti-semitic, is it not? Coming from a bunch who are usually holier-than-thou guardianistas only makes the depth of their hatred more obvious. It's easy to disagree with Israeli policies but still hold a more nuanced and less extremist view than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 "Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us." - Golda Meir It's another statement that puts the fault squarely with the other side. Peace may come when each side stops looking just at the failings of the other one, realizes that it has some or a lot of its own and thinks about trying to address them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCforever1991 Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 Florida? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted November 16, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted November 16, 2012 Anti-semitism is a hate of Jews. A distaste for Israel (even to the extent that one wouldn't be too upset to see it wiped off the map) isn't anti-semitism. I don't see anything to suggest that anyone in this thread simply hates Jews, and thus the cries of anti-semitism are not accurate. Back on topic, talk of Israel bringing up tens of thousands of troops is posturing - they won't need or have any use for that many even if they decide to sweep Gaza into the sea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 Back on topic, talk of Israel bringing up tens of thousands of troops is posturing - they won't need or have any use for that many even if they decide to sweep Gaza into the sea. If they have to deploy 10,000's of regulars into Gaza then the reservists will be needed to back fill the gaps those regular troops leave in the defences elsewhere. Bear in mind the Syrians have fired across the border several times at Israeli units and I believe (but may be wrong) that the Golan is on full alert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted November 16, 2012 VT Supporter Share Posted November 16, 2012 Yes. But talk of 70,000 is nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 I'm sorry for this but again, what your saying is complete bollocks. What other country is not allowed to build up to its own border in case the neighbours don't like it? Hamas are rocketing cities up to 25km inside Israel, where exactly do you want them to live, and why the hell should where they live be dictated by a bunch of murderous religious fruitcakes? It's true Israel are building illegal settlements in the occupied West Bank (clearly wrong) but there is no restriction on them or any nation building within their own borders, period. Personally I'd like to see Israel withdraw to '67 borders and have NATO guarantee the integrity of those boundaries, however most Israeli's would probably be reluctant to bet their future on a bunch of anti-semites, and a cursory read over this thread would amply explain why.. As you know, what Israel claims as its own land includes large areas where they have driven the owners off, either stealing their property as well as their land, or bulldozing it. The people who have ended up in refugee camps live under a siege, with Israel controlling their water, electricity, and borders. They are forbidden from importing things like spices; nothing to do with security, everything to do with trying to demoralise, crush their spirit. As well as that, as you recognise, Israel builds in land which even they admit is illegally occupied, they steal water supplies to supply these settlements, they cut Palestinians off from their own cultivated land and reduce them to the status of beggars. David Cameron described Gaza as a prison camp, which is about right. In any other situation, people would applaud the efforts of some of the dispossessed to fight for their rights, as we applauded the resistance to the Nazis who also wanted Lebensraum. Israel has no intention of seeking a peaceful solution. For many years, it has carried out this dance about pretending to want talks, imposing ludicrous demands, undertaking serial provocations, then acting horrified when there is a response, to which they respond in wholly disproportionate manner. All the while, this utter disregard for international law and human rights is made possible only by the connivance of the USA. We now learn that the man they murdered to set this off was in possession of a truce agreement. They have no interest in peace, just continual expansion at whatever cost to the rightful owners of the territory they crave.Reports say that the pilot of the downed F16 has been captured. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robojoel Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 Isreal vs Palestine is like someone having a bullied, starved and humiliated person kept in a tiny cage in the basement of a house they once owned until it was broken into and repossessed by their captors, who are constantly poked with a sharp stick and beaten senseless whenever they dare spit, speak back, or lash out at their captors. Subhuman scum, they know EXACTLY what they are doing and any attempt to hide behind ' antisemitism' is a moral equivalent of shitting on the graves of victims of the holocaust Thats putting it mildly, it is a disgrace that world leaders allow this to continue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 Peter, Israel is not occupying Gaza, they have no desire to be there and there are precisely zero Israeli settlements there. The West Bank is illegally occupied, the settlements are illegal and they shouldn't be there, as many Israeli citizens themselves recognise. That is not related to Rev's incorrect statement that building on the land of Israel itself is outlawed by the UN or that doing so threatens the Gaza Strip. The people of Gaza have not been dispossessed of their land (although the West Bank Palestinians certainly have been) and they have the ability to import whatever they chose through Egypt - including large amounts of war material from Iran with which to attack Israeli cities. Just as a point of consideration Israel was not in the West Bank until they were attacked by Jordan and others. They occupied the territory as a result to provide a buffer zone against further invasions. If their neighbours would renounce all violence against Israel then they would have no justification to remain there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVFCforever1991 Posted November 16, 2012 Share Posted November 16, 2012 Anytime anyone says anything against Israel they are always labelled Anti-Semitic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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