Rugeley Villa Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 3 minutes ago, Keyblade said: Like? This is their first terror attack in 7 years. Donald Trump-tier soundbite. Stop this cover up malarkey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 1 minute ago, Rugeley Villa said: Stop this cover up malarkey. Explain yourself, you made the claim. What kind of yuge problems is Sweden facing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 7 minutes ago, Keyblade said: Like? This is their first terror attack in 7 years. Donald Trump-tier soundbite. Rape? Grenade attacks? The fact there are some pretty big issues over there is undeniable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Keyblade Posted April 9, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted April 9, 2017 3 minutes ago, penguin said: Rape? Grenade attacks? The fact there are some pretty big issues over there is undeniable. I'm not sure about the grenade attacks, but the supposed Swedish rape epidemic is a pretty nasty misconception from what I understand. I'm sure @sne or @osmark86 can illuminate further.This is from the Swedish government: Quote Claim: "There has been a major increase in the number of rapes in Sweden." Facts: The number of reported rapes in Sweden has risen. But the definition of rape has broadened over time, which makes it difficult to compare the figures. It is also misleading to compare the figures with other countries, as many acts that are considered rape under Swedish law are not considered rape in many other countries. For example: If a woman in Sweden reports that she has been raped by her husband every night for a year, that is counted as 365 separate offences; in most other countries this would be registered as a single offence, or would not be registered as an offence at all. Willingness to report such offences also differs dramatically between countries. A culture in which these crimes are talked about openly, and victims are not blamed, will also have more cases reported. Sweden has made a conscious effort to encourage women to report any offence. Read more about the legal implications of the term 'rape' (in Swedish): http://www.notisum.se/rnp/sls/lag/19620700.htm#K6 https://www.bra.se/download/18.37179ae158196cb172d6047/148396 Clicky Quote Is Sweden really a 'rape capital' as repeatedly suggested by sections of the international media? The Local consulted experts to get to the bottom of the matter. In short, the answer is no. Evidence for the claim usually comes in the form of comparative international statistics suggesting for example that Sweden has 63.5 reported rape incidents per 100,000 citizens, compared to 27.3 per 100,000 in the US, or 27.9 per 100,000 in Belgium, the nearest European country based on those numbers. But comparing the number of reported rapes from one country to another is a process vulnerable to inaccuracies, several experts have told The Local. Enrico Bisogno is the chief of data development and dissemination at the United Nations Office of Drugs and Crime (UNODC). He says that variations in how different countries record different crimes can play a "huge role" in influencing the results of these comparisons. "Differences in reported crime data across countries are usually related to different reporting rates by victims (and/or detection by the police), different definitions of criminal offences by countries, and different counting rules," he explained. "For example, countries can count one 'case' or every single episode. This can make a big difference, especially in cases of domestic violence: is every episode of violence between partners counted, or only the report made by the woman/wife?". In Sweden, each case of sexual violence is recorded as a separate incident. So for example, if someone says they were raped by a partner every day for a fortnight, officers will record 14 potential crimes. In other countries the claim could be logged as a single incident. Sweden also significantly broadened its definition of rape in 2005, which means the word "rape" can be used to record acts which would be called assault or bodily harm in other countries. That led to an increase in the number of rapes reported in the country in the years following the law change, which since appears to have levelled out, as the following graph shows: Key: Purple line corresponds to number of rape reports, yellow line to number of sexual molestation reports, light blue line to sexual coercion reports and the top dark blue line is a combined figure for all three. Source: Brå Another not insignificant variable to take into consideration is society's view of rape: in Sweden, where women's rights are in sharp focus, women are and have increasingly been encouraged to report sexual assaults or rapes, compared to other countries where there may still be a greater social stigma. "As you can appreciate, all these factors can play a huge role in influencing figures, and for this reason, we always caution against making direct cross-country comparisons," UNODC expert Bisogno stressed. "The way of counting crimes differs between countries. In Sweden, a victim can report several cases when he or she decides to report a rape," Stockholm University criminology professor Felipe Estrada reiterated. "What we know is that we have a high number of reported rape cases. Since this is a crime with a high but varying hidden figure in every country in the world it is very difficult to say anything about the real level using reported cases," he added. An alternative way of trying to measure the level of rape in a country is by consulting crime victim surveys rather than the number of reported crimes. One such study looking into violence against women in the EU was published by the European Union Agency for Fundamental Rights (FRA) in 2014. It showed that 18 percent of Swedish women consulted said they had been the victim of sexual violence, the same percentage as in the Netherlands, and slightly less than Denmark (19 percent). But again, factors like cultural norms can also impact the data. The same study notes that "increased gender equality leads to higher levels of disclosure about violence against women", and that "it can be observed that Member States that are ranked highest in terms of gender equality tend also to have higher prevalence levels of violence against women". Sweden regularly places in the upper regions of gender equality rankings. We know from all of the above that comparing rape statistics between countries is an error-prone process, but what about the other argument often put forward: that there has been a "dramatic rise in sexual crime" in Sweden caused by its intake of refugees? Again, it doesn't ring true, and this time because the numbers don't add up. According to the Swedish National Council for Crime Prevention (Brå), the number of rapes reported annually in the country per 100,000 citizens has been relatively steady for almost a decade. In 2016 there were 67 reported rapes per 100,000 people, 60 in 2015, 69 in 2014, 63 in 2013, 66 in 2012, 69 in 2011, 64 in 2010 and 2009, 59 in 2008 and 52 in 2007. Those figures show there was actually a 12 percent dip in the number of rapes reported in Sweden in 2015 – the year the country received a record 163,000 asylum applications, at the peak of the refugee crisis. The figures for 2016 are preliminary. From The Local, emphasis mine. One of the problems of the internet age I guess, misconceptions spread fast. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 2 hours ago, Rugeley Villa said: Sweden are having real bad problems. Care to elaborate on this one? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Davkaus Posted April 9, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted April 9, 2017 Just now, sne said: Care to elaborate on this one? Smart people say so. Very smart people, believe me. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post chrisp65 Posted April 9, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted April 9, 2017 Sweden needs to sort out its law and order enforcement in places. Malmo has already been quoted. But please don't claim there are Birmingham style ISIS controlled states operating in Sweden. If there are rapes and gang attacks and drug gangs, sort them out with the laws that exist for that very purpose. Don't let shit fester and then claim we are being over run by a muslim conspiracy to out breed us. It's scared lazy fascist bollocks. Whilst I'm at it, if we don't want jihadi terror schools in our prisons, let's properly fund and run our prisons. Not just piss our pants and blame brown people, whilst getting G4S to run a prison with amateurs on minimum wage.. We're bigger than this, and I can't decide if there's a generation with no back bone, or a generation that sees an excuse to get NF style racism up and going again. Either way, it's not a great reflection on us is it. Man up, insist on law and order. Insist on integration. Insist on decent education. Insist drug cartels and dealers and smugglers are dealt with, insist illegal prostitution is dealt with, insist petty crime and violence are dealt with, insist shit schools and madrassas are closed. Stop selling bombs to murderers. Stop dabbling in value engineered mini wars. If a kid is abused in Rotherham, don't worry about how community relations might look, break up the paedo gangs. But that's all hard, expensive long term work isn't it. Much better to find an easy fix. It's probably just all muslims plotting against us, so send 'em back. We should get the red white and blue Sun to start a petition. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 29 minutes ago, Keyblade said: I'm not sure about the grenade attacks, but the supposed Swedish rape epidemic is a pretty nasty misconception from what I understand. I'm sure @sne or @osmark86 can illuminate further.This is from the Swedish government: Clicky From The Local, emphasis mine. One of the problems of the internet age I guess, misconceptions spread fast. I'd read a few explanations; on both sides of the political sprectrum so to speak and assumed the explanation lay someway in the middle but that's a pretty comprehensive debunking and a reassuring read. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 (edited) Since I've no interest in delving deep into Swedish politics as it would take a small essay to do so, I'll dumb it down. Something you really should not do as it leads to sweeping generalizations and Trump characters winning the election, but anyhow... Sweden doesn't have "huge problems" or organized muslim rape gangs roaming the streets. We do however (IMO) have a problem in that the established parties don't really wan't to handle the issues and problems people actually have and see in their everyday life and that causes ignorant people to find solutions in populist parties, religion or in just becoming apathetic and watching the Eurovision Song Contest like morons. Sweden have received a lot of refugees in the last few years and that puts stress on everything from schools to hospitals, housing and every other part of society. This will take a lot of effort to solve, and there is no easy quick fix. Edit: One of the things that really disgusts me was how quickly people on either side of the political spectrum wanted to make politics out of this tragedy. Edited April 9, 2017 by sne 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 12 hours ago, blandy said: The UK arms deal with Saudi was set up in the 80s and AFAIK comes under contract review every 5 years. I don't believe it's as simple as the Saudis deciding they want some woosh-bangs to set off on Yemen and shopping round for some. I might be wrong, but I think that's the way the contract, which is between the UK govt and the Saudi govt is done. No doubt the UK govt could cancel it. The implications would be huge, but what it wouldn't do is save a single life. There's a real difference between maintaining a long standing contract with someone and looking for a new market to sell some bombs to Assad. I don't know what the answer is, but it's likely to involve either diplomacy or a world wide agreement on restricting arms sales. Unilaterally cancelling the UK Saudi deal will change nothing. We're having our cake and eating it. Defence Secretary Michael Fallon has accused Putin and Russia of being complicit in gas attacks on civilians 'by proxy', as they are protecting and aiding the Syrian regime. Politics Home Quote The Defence Secretary said: “Russia must show the resolve necessary to bring this regime to heel. The Russians have influence in the region. They helped broker the original deal to put chemical weapons out of commission. This latest war crime happened on their watch… “By proxy Russia is responsible for every civilian death last week. Meanwhile the Saudi regime turns the dust of Yemen in to smaller finer dust mixed with a little blood and brain. 'Maintaining a long standing contract', what a sanitized turn of phrase for continuing to sell weapons to known murderers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted April 9, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted April 9, 2017 There has been a horrific picture circulating of one of the victims, turns out it was an 11 year old school girl on her way home. Just horrendous. What an earth was the person thinking who took the picture and put it on the net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 6 minutes ago, TrentVilla said: There has been a horrific picture circulating of one of the victims, turns out it was an 11 year old school girl on her way home. Just horrendous. What an earth was the person thinking who took the picture and put it on the net. If its the one I'm thinking of then I just hope her family and friends never see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted April 9, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted April 9, 2017 6 minutes ago, Xela said: If its the one I'm thinking of then I just hope her family and friends never see it. It is I'm afraid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
osmark86 Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 2 hours ago, TrentVilla said: There has been a horrific picture circulating of one of the victims, turns out it was an 11 year old school girl on her way home. Just horrendous. What an earth was the person thinking who took the picture and put it on the net. Haven't seen it and would rather not tbh. I think people don't even think about the potential hurt or consequences of such actions. It's so easy to anonymously share something like that and requires no afterthought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted April 10, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted April 10, 2017 8 hours ago, osmark86 said: Haven't seen it and would rather not tbh. I think people don't even think about the potential hurt or consequences of such actions. It's so easy to anonymously share something like that and requires no afterthought. I suggest you don't, I had no desire to and wish I hadn't. Sharing it is one thing but taking it.... there are some sick people around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted April 10, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted April 10, 2017 I don't even know how you come across these pictures. I hope to avoid them at all costs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted April 10, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted April 10, 2017 47 minutes ago, PieFacE said: I don't even know how you come across these pictures. I hope to avoid them at all costs. Twitter. I'm relatively new to it and it's easily done with intention, I know how to avoid it now though for the next time and sadly we all know there will be a next time sooner or later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted April 10, 2017 Moderator Share Posted April 10, 2017 14 hours ago, chrisp65 said: We're having our cake and eating it. Defence Secretary Michael Fallon has accused Putin and Russia of being complicit in gas attacks on civilians 'by proxy', as they are protecting and aiding the Syrian regime. Politics Home Meanwhile the Saudi regime turns the dust of Yemen in to smaller finer dust mixed with a little blood and brain. Agreed. Politician in massive hypocrisy It's never happened before. Michael Fallon is a bell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 (edited) 9 hours ago, PieFacE said: I don't even know how you come across these pictures. I hope to avoid them at all costs. I typed #stockholm into Twitter on Friday and it was one of the first things that came up So its easily done and its not aa though you need to search for it Edited April 10, 2017 by Xela Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 2 hours ago, Xela said: I typed #stockholm into Twitter on Friday and it was one of the first things that came up So its easily done and its not aa though you need to search for it Same, there's somethings you just can't 'unsee'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts