Steve Bruce

[terrytini]

47 minutes ago, TRO said:

Well reasoned Terry, but I guess the less errors we make the better.....and ours just seem glaring ones.

its a fair comment you make, but equally managers can't be directly blamed, when those same errors have a major bearing on the final result.

some blame tactics, but they usually do when we lose, we just ****** up particularly on one goal, that probably secured them the match.

I agree, I wouldn’t blame a Manager for a result, in isolation, only for a performance ‘ in the round’ ( selection, preparation, transfers, tactics etc).

As for yesterday I said before the game I feared Bruce had gone a bit too negative ( as he clearly has before in tough games) but in actual fact I don’t think he was negative at all.......he tried to set us up in a similar manner to previously, and it was working fine until we conceded - so no complaints here.

There are half a dozen sides who have enough about them to go up, it’s no shame losing to one of them, and whilst disappointing as a day out, I doubt it will have a significant bearing on our season.

The top 6 or 8 are all going to take points off each other.

[sidcow]

12 hours ago, Dave J said:

But surely you have only highlighted my point? With respect  - wolves have good players and strength in depth- this is no accident or fluke 

No they have been incredibly lucky to have had almost no injuries to any key players all season. Their depth is not that good so they would almost certainly have stuttered more than they have done, they've had a free run at it all season. 

We HAVE got squad depth which is why we are still in touching distance of second despite having our 3 best players forming the spine of our team out for very lengthy periods.

Wolves lack of injuries has been freakish really. 

Edited February 19, 2018 by sidcow

[sne]

Helder Costa missed all of pre season and the first 2 months with a bad injury. He was their top player last season.

Just like them we've been able to bring in players when we got injuries.

Doubt Snodgrass would be here if Grealish had not got injured.

Not that it probably has had any real bearing on injuries but our squad has an average age of 28 compared to 25 at Wolves.

We do seem to have bad luck with injuries thou

[TRO]

2 hours ago, sidcow said:

No they have been incredibly lucky to have had almost no injuries to any key players all season. Their depth is not that good so they would almost certainly have stuttered more than they have done, they've had a free run at it all swansong. 

We HAVE got squad depth which is why we are still in touching distance of second despite having our 3 best players forming the spine of our team out for very lengthy periods.

Wolves lack of injuries has been freakish really. 

Is it that or is it that they have players who can play a style of football that is hard to close down so subsequently they have minimal contact?

We seem to have difficulty getting away from trouble so get clobbered so much.

just a thought.

[AvfcRigo82]

3 hours ago, terrytini said:

I agree, I wouldn’t blame a Manager for a result, in isolation, only for a performance ‘ in the round’ ( selection, preparation, transfers, tactics etc).

As for yesterday I said before the game I feared Bruce had gone a bit too negative ( as he clearly has before in tough games) but in actual fact I don’t think he was negative at all.......he tried to set us up in a similar manner to previously, and it was working fine until we conceded - so no complaints here.

There are half a dozen sides who have enough about them to go up, it’s no shame losing to one of them, and whilst disappointing as a day out, I doubt it will have a significant bearing on our season.

The top 6 or 8 are all going to take points off each other.

Great post Terrytini and agree with all of this.

Fulham are no mugs but from the game yesterday they where not entirely at the races themselves either until after half time.

A scrappy game and until the injury to Elmo that forced us to change things further it was only then and the one moment of lapse of concentration gave them breakthrough.

Up until then it was still anyones game really with no goalkeeper really having much to do and the dominos could have went anyones way. Unfortunately they fell against us and it was a very cheap and gifted win for Fulham in the end.

We must remain focused and move on from this because Tuesday night is another must win game and we get back to winning ways.

 

[KSV]

Adomah and Grealish (arguably our 2 best attacking players) are out.. and were replaced by Bikir and Tuanzebe. both defensive minded players (Bikir of late has been anyway.. although hes no good as an attacker imo)

Would have preferred he played Grabban outwide.. left Snodgrass where he has been killing it on the right. Lansbury or Onomah at attacking midfielder (grealish role). Possibly even Bikir for Jedinak. We didnt need Jedi for that game. We needed legs to press Fulham. 

Mistakes with team selection imo. Bruce cant afford to be scared to play a half decent team. Probably why he has no luck in the premier league. Why change what was working? To score goals you need attack minded players. We didnt have enough of them against Fulham and therefore we suffered. Sat deep.. gave 70% of the ball to Fulham.. and we conceded. Game plan over. 

I thought this type of negativity from Bruce was gone. I hope were back on the attack against Preston. We shouldn't have to worry about any side in this league... they should be worried about how to handle us. Dont change our system for anyone. Including Wolves. 

Edited February 19, 2018 by KSV

[terrytini]

1 hour ago, KSV said:

Adomah and Grealish (arguably our 2 best attacking players) are out.. and were replaced by Bikir and Tuanzebe. both defensive minded players (Bikir of late has been anyway.. although hes no good as an attacker imo)

Would have preferred he played Grabban outwide.. left Snodgrass where he has been killing it on the right. Lansbury or Onomah at attacking midfielder (grealish role). Possibly even Bikir for Jedinak. We didnt need Jedi for that game. We needed legs to press Fulham. 

Mistakes with team selection imo. Bruce cant afford to be scared to play a half decent team. Probably why he has no luck in the premier league. Why change what was working? To score goals you need attack minded players. We didnt have enough of them against Fulham and therefore we suffered. Sat deep.. gave 70% of the ball to Fulham.. and we conceded. Game plan over. 

I thought this type of negativity from Bruce was gone. I hope were back on the attack against Preston. We shouldn't have to worry about any side in this league... they should be worried about how to handle us. Dont change our system for anyone. Including Wolves. 

I didn’t see the game that way.

Yes at first sight the two incoming players were a defensive/ negative step.

But Green, the obvious choice, was injured and after that people have suggested as many different alternatives as there are players at the Club !

Said before the game I don’t understand Birkir in midfield other than DM, but we will all have our preferences.

My own preference was for one or both of Lansbury and O Hare - but I couldn’t possibly say they would have been significantly better, and indeed neither has any recent game time or form to speak of. Your choice is Grabban wide and maybe Lansbury....again, fine but no guarantees there is there ?

And Jedi did just fine. I don’t want Birkir anywhere other than DM but in actual fact, first half, he was fine too.

As it turned out there was nothing negative about how we set up or played. I dont think we DID change our system as such.

I totally agree you need a few footballers on the pitch, 3 plus your striker in my view, and too often in the past Bruce only has two - as on Saturday - for cautious reasons.....but with what we have available I’m not sure the choices were that obvious. 

The logic that Snodgrass “ becomes” Albert, Elmo “ becomes” Snodgrass, and Axel “ becomes “ Elmo, with Birkir ( at least attempting) to roughly fill Jacks position may be open to debate, yes, but I don’t see it as a change of system or negative approach, in fact the opposite.

For me, a negative/ defensive approach is manifest in selection and tactics - and I’ve seen a lot of that from Bruce, especially last season and the first few months of this.....but this wasn’t so in my view.....whilst the selection looked negative it wasn’t implemented that way.

I am not one who sees relevance in possession stats. First half Fulham had lots of the ball and for the most part did nothing.....they created no more than us. Yes we lost the first goal, always crucial in tight games, but it could have easily been the other way around.

Edited February 19, 2018 by terrytini

[Dave J]

10 hours ago, sidcow said:

No they have been incredibly lucky to have had almost no injuries to any key players all season. Their depth is not that good so they would almost certainly have stuttered more than they have done, they've had a free run at it all swansong. 

We HAVE got squad depth which is why we are still in touching distance of second despite having our 3 best players forming the spine of our team out for very lengthy periods.

Wolves lack of injuries has been freakish really. 

Well I disagree but I'm no wolves fan so let's hope we can catch them 

[Eastie]

1 minute ago, Dave J said:

Well I disagree but I'm no wolves fan so let's hope we can catch them 

After Saturday I think that ship has sailed , 2nd place is now the realistic aim .

congrats to wolves on winning the league .

[AJ]

19 minutes ago, Eastie said:

After Saturday I think that ship has sailed , 2nd place is now the realistic aim .

congrats to wolves on winning the league .

Careful, you'll jinx 'em.

[Dave J]

21 minutes ago, Eastie said:

After Saturday I think that ship has sailed , 2nd place is now the realistic aim .

congrats to wolves on winning the league .

Quite - I personally don't think we could have caught them 

[Demitri_C]

18 hours ago, terrytini said:

Not an issue for me. We are a Championship side, we are bound to make mistakes. In fact whatever level, you get mistakes - did Gerrards slip cost Liverpool the title ? No - it was just that it came at a time when it looked that way, one game into the season nobody would’ve made much of it, because all sides make mistakes.

Over a 46 game season our position will be decided by how well we work together, our tactics, the level of performance each week, our skill levels, all sorts. It definitely won’t be defined by mistakes, nor will any other side. In my view it’s a red herring, and suggests players have to be almost infallible.

I dont see cardiff and derby making these kind of errors though. we are just mistake ridden at times. has to improve if we want 2nd 

[terrytini]

I’m sure they do....everyone makes mistakes 

[Vive_La_Villa]

1 hour ago, Eastie said:

After Saturday I think that ship has sailed , 2nd place is now the realistic aim .

congrats to wolves on winning the league .

Agree. I hedged my villa promotion bets with money on them to win league. Cashed it out weekend with it being close to the whole amount I could have win. You could say bookies are paying out. 

[Vive_La_Villa]

I hope I'm wrong about this but it sounds like some of the old problems seem to resurface yesterday.  Inability to hold on to the ball, second in 50/50s, no really attacking threat. 

Now I'm only going on what I've read on VT but it does seem that Grealish is the key to promotion. We have a massive reliance on one player to achieve second. 

[AvfcRigo82]

1 hour ago, AJ said:

Careful, you'll jinx 'em.

That's the aim.

I've tried it in another thread too.   though I believe @Demitri_C has the magic touch on this better than most.

Edited February 19, 2018 by AvfcRigo82

[Taxahunter]

I have been critical of Bruce, before we went on that 7 game unbeaten run and want to give him massive credit for turning things around but, but yesterday, the way the team was setup, and the following loss was entirely down to him.

First, I dont understand why he chose to use Bjarnarson as a CM, when its obvious for all to see that he hasn't been very good in that position.

Second, why put on Onomah when he has been non existing, bar a couple of games in the beginning of the season. 

Why not bring on Lansbury and push Bjarnarson to left wing? Im giving Bruce credit for the wins, but this loss he has to take the blame for...

[Stevo985]

16 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I hope I'm wrong about this but it sounds like some of the old problems seem to resurface yesterday.  Inability to hold on to the ball, second in 50/50s, no really attacking threat. 

Now I'm only going on what I've read on VT but it does seem that Grealish is the key to promotion. We have a massive reliance on one player to achieve second. 

I think it's only a problem if we slump into another run of bad results like before christmas.

All teams have bad games. Even Wolves have had that.

The difference is when we've had our bad games in the past they've been followed up by a month of similarly bad results. If we go and get at least 7 points from the next 3 games then there's no issue.

[Demitri_C]

26 minutes ago, AvfcRigo82 said:

That's the aim.

I've tried it in another thread too.   though I believe @Demitri_C has the magic touch on this better than most.

The funny thing is I was serious on all counts wanst even trying to jinx it !  

[omariqy]

19 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

I think it's only a problem if we slump into another run of bad results like before christmas.

All teams have bad games. Even Wolves have had that.

The difference is when we've had our bad games in the past they've been followed up by a month of similarly bad results. If we go and get at least 7 points from the next 3 games then there's no issue.

Yup that is the key. Unlike December where we had tough game after tough game, we have a much easier run of games.