TrentVilla Posted July 17, 2014 Moderator Share Posted July 17, 2014 Made the mistake of going on to the liveleak web page Oh dear... I would recommend that others don't make the same error and request nobody posts any of that stuff on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted July 17, 2014 Moderator Share Posted July 17, 2014 6 Brits confirmed on the flight, RIP to them and all others on board. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrenm Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Not sure where this info has come from but this may be the bit of evidence that incriminates Russia Per Stratfor (Geopolitical analysis and consulting -Austin TX) The Security Service of Ukraine, has intercepts (unconfirmed) of 2 phone calls indicating a pro-Russian rebel group based in Chernukhino, Luhansk province shot down the plane. One is between Igor Bezler described by the Ukrainian report as a Russian military intelligence officer and leading commander of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People's Republic and someone the Security Service of Ukraine identifies as Vasili Geranin, a colonel in the main intelligence department of Russia's armed force at 4:40 p.m. local time, 20 minutes after the plane crashed.The second 40 minutes later between 2 militants codenamed "Major" and "Greek". Transcript: (-The translation from Ukrainian to English was made by Stratfor and is unofficial.) First call Igor Bezler: We have just shot down a plane. Group Minera. It fell down beyond Yenakievo. Vasili Geranin: Pilots. Where are the pilots? IB: Gone to search for and photograph the plane. It's smoking. VG: How many minutes ago? IB: About 30 minutes ago. Second call 40 minutes later "Major": These are Chernukhin folks show down the plane. From the Chernukhin check point. Those cossacks who are based in Chernukhino. "Greek": Yes, Major. "Major": The plane fell apart in the air. In the area of Petropavlovskaya mine. The first "200" (code word for dead person). We have found the first "200." A Civilian. "Greek": Well, what do you have there? "Major": In short, it was 100 percent a passenger (civilian) aircraft. "Greek": Are many people there? "Major": Holy sh-t! The debris fell right into the yards (of homes). "Greek": What kind of aircraft? "Major": I haven't ascertained this. I haven't been to the main sight. I am only surveying the scene where the first bodies fell. There are the remains of internal brackets, seats and bodies. "Greek": Is there anything left of the weapon? "Major": Absolutely nothing "Greek": Are there documents? "Major": Yes from http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/543733-mh17-down-near-donetsk-10.html#post8567828 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swerbs Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 I'd be wary of that evidence, could easily of been faked. Strange how it came out very quick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 I think this is a case of separatists shooting down what they thought was a Ukrainian military aircraft...they've already shot two down just this week. Russia will be red faced about this because they've armed these guys. Looks like a case of trigger happy idiots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
momo Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 (edited) It is Ukraine's fault that the plane was hit. I mean come on, why not surrender to the occupant, Mother Russia...then this would not have happened. Edit **** Israel! Edited July 17, 2014 by momo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Terrible terrible tragedy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 I think this is a case of separatists shooting down what they thought was a Ukrainian military aircraft...they've already shot two down just this week. Russia will be red faced about this because they've armed these guys. Looks like a case of trigger happy idiots. I don't think the Russians armed them with surface to air missiles though. They supposedly captured one of those from a Ukrainian military base when they took it over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 The fact that they are operating as a de facto arm of the Russian military makes Moscow look really bad, no matter where the missile came from. ( I'm pretty certain it's a Russian-made weapon). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 I think this is a case of separatists shooting down what they thought was a Ukrainian military aircraft...they've already shot two down just this week. Russia will be red faced about this because they've armed these guys. Looks like a case of trigger happy idiots. I don't think the Russians armed them with surface to air missiles though. They supposedly captured one of those from a Ukrainian military base when they took it over. Yeah I also saw that they captured the Buk artillery system from a Ukranian base. But it also seems that it's not a weapon just anyone can use. You need proper military training to use one of these things, which would point to military or ex-military persons operating the Buk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Jos Nijhuis, CEO of Schiphol Airport, said: "The nationality of the crew are all Malaysians. Our main priority at the moment is to look after this people who are suffering and that is our greatest attention at this point in time. The nationalities as we know at this time - 154 Dutch passengers were onboard the aircraft, 27 Australian passengers, 23 Malaysian, 11 Indonesian, six from the UK, four from Germany, four from Belgium, three from the Philippines and one Canadian. The rest we have not yet identified the nationality. We are in the process of verifying the data we have got." Link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legov Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 Why have 370 and 17 been placed in the same thread? Apart from the fact that both incidents involve the same airline, they are not related at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted July 18, 2014 Moderator Share Posted July 18, 2014 Why have 370 and 17 been placed in the same thread? Apart from the fact that both incidents involve the same airline, they are not related at all. Because people started talking about MH17 in the MH370 thread rather than starting a new one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legov Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 6 Brits confirmed on the flight, RIP to them and all others on board. including 2 jawdies on their way to watch newcastle's pre season tour of new zealand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lapal_fan Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 I think we should accidently send over Lancaster Bombers and carpet bomb them, world war 2 stylie. How can anybody account for that loss of life? It's absolutely awful. R.I.P to all those poor people.. wrong place, wrong time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 ****. Up. World. Just feel a huge war creeps closer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 ****. Up. World. Just feel a huge war creeps closer. define 'closer' Will this be before or after the USA invents a device that allows the prototype planes we want to buy off them to land on our soon to be completed aircraft carrier that we will be sharing with the French? if it's after that. we'll be fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 (edited) Quiet easy to deduce what has happened here. Everyone knows the Russians have been giving the rebels porwerful weapons, including anti aircraft missiles. The rebels clearly don't know that civilian aircraft are flying over Ukraine and some trigger happy fool has shot down the airliner thinking it was a transport plane as it was coming from the west. What happens next is important. If Russia thinks this is too much and backs off arming the rebels then the fighting can end sooner. If they pretend (as is common for the Russians) that even with overwhelming proof that they didn't give any weapons to the Rebels and it was Ukraine who shot down the airliner then we're in for trouble. Germany has to accept that getting over 20% of it's energy from Russia doesn't mean they can turn a relative blind eye to full sanctions as it will impact their economy. Edited July 18, 2014 by CVByrne 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 Russia will try and ignore blame for this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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