September Optimism Gauge

[LondonLax]

I see people say that they are optimistic and we've had a good window but there also the attitude of "If we stay up" and "If we can survive"

If the window was so good surely relegation wouldn't be a concern.

Do you agree it was the managers choice to spend the money this way i.e. a lot of unproven young players rather than a few experienced players?

So he should be held responsible for the season rather than the owner?

We won't pay the wages for the big players so we had to splash it out on lower league nobodies in a scatter gun approach.

On the other hand we signed 9 players.

I recon we could have signed say, 5 or 6 and included a few established names if the manager had wanted.

It seems like this policy has come from the manager rather than the owner.

[avfc1982]

I see people say that they are optimistic and we've had a good window but there also the attitude of "If we stay up" and "If we can survive"

If the window was so good surely relegation wouldn't be a concern.

Do you agree it was the managers choice to spend the money this way i.e. a lot of unproven young players rather than a few experienced players?

So he should be held responsible for the season rather than the owner?

We won't pay the wages for the big players so we had to splash it out on lower league nobodies in a scatter gun approach.

.

On the other hand we signed 9 players.

I recon we could have signed say, 5 or 6 and included a few established names if the manager had wanted.

It seems like this policy has come from the manager rather than the owner.

I'd rather see quality not quantity. Lambert has to cut his cloth accordingly, as it's obvious Lerner won't pay top wages the big players demand. So it's clearly Lerner's policy not Lambert's.

[PieFacE]

Yeah but Lambert seems to want these "Young and hungry" players. He obviously likes a player to have a certain personality before he signs them... maybe he thinks that proven premier league players don't have the same hunger and desire to succeed.

[KjParton]

So Incognito has been tweeting again - It reads from bottom to top:

INCOGNITO AVFC ‏@INCOGNITOAVFC

Success is a journey, & now's the time for all of us as a club 2 come 2gether allowing Paul & the team 2 achieve his high goals. #avfc

2m INCOGNITO AVFC ‏@INCOGNITOAVFC

The path we have taken is fresh & full of young, hungry & vibrant talent.Paul has his philosophy in place which we endorse completely.#avfc

2m INCOGNITO AVFC ‏@INCOGNITOAVFC

The best route is very rarely the easy route. If you find something too easy to do, its not worth doing. #avfc

3m INCOGNITO AVFC ‏@INCOGNITOAVFC

It is better to go down a path with obstacles as you begin to learn and develop experience from working harder to get through things. #avfc

Also an interesting tweet from Agent_ITK, known to be one of the "best ITK's" on twitter:

"Here is the big announcement to all 35,000 followers that I have on here.

How many ITK calls did I get right? A hell of a lot more than I got wrong that is for sure! It is finally time for me to leave you all. I started this account to prove that ANYBODY could be an ITK and I could if I so wish get 10s of thousands of followers.

I was proved to be right.

I am somebody who decided to show the Spurs forum I frequent that anybody could be an ITK and could easily fool the public, much to my amusement it was easier than I thought.

What I didn't realise is that I would be used as a "source" for The BBC, Talksport, LBC, Radio London, The Daily Mail, The Sun, The Star, Sky Sports News and even The Independent. I was even mentioned on TV channels in Ireland, Australia, Spain and Fox in the USA.

I am not an ITK yet as some of you will no doubt say you released you still followed, like sheep being led to the slaughter. My every word was hung on and retweeted and retweeted, only getting the arse when the news I was telling you wasn't what you wanted to hear.

Some of the abuse that I have put up with is shocking, although it is always mainly from numptys will a small cock who are probably afraid to go out after dark.

I have left many hints over the last year of what I was doing, yet about 3 of you ever clocked this.

I will not apologise, as I was proved right anybody as usual! Anbody can call themselves ITK and get away with it. Within 4 weeks of starting this account I had 5,000 followers! SHEEP, baaaa, baaaa.

If I was you I would unfollow @backpage, anybody with "mole" in their name, @FouthOfficial_ is a complete fraud, @POTL, @JJetset, @AFCAMDEN, basically anybody that is telling you things that THEY think you want to hear!

Good Luck to you all, I think you'll need it. Baaa, baaaa..."

Looks like 35,000 have been fed lies. I knew he was chatting shit when he was deleting tweets he'd got wrong. Nonetheless, what a prick.

[Mantis]

Agreed LondonLax. Lambert's made it clear that this is his way of doing things. He did it at Norwich as well. Just take a look at their transfer window this time last year and it looks very similar to ours, just on a smaller scale with a lot less spending and no purchases from abroad. It's ridiculous that people are blaming Lerner for this.

Besides, what is there to blame anyway? Over half of Lambert's purchases (Holman wasn't a Lambert buy) haven't even played for us ONCE yet, so why are people already judging them?

We went down the route of spending lots of money on experienced Premier League players, and in the grand scheme of things it didn't do us that good. I'd take £4m Bennett, £2m El-Ahmadi and £3m Vlaar over £8m Warnock, £8m Reo-Coker and £10m Davies any day.

[Raymond]

I'd rather see quality not quantity. Lambert has to cut his cloth accordingly, as it's obvious Lerner won't pay top wages the big players demand. So it's clearly Lerner's policy not Lambert's.

First of all, Lambert is the one who turned down Dempsey after we could have gone in for him again later in the day.

Secondly, when has Lambert every shown a desire to get in the "big" players? Where in his coaching history has that ever been his philosophy?

Finally, how do you type "So it's clearly Lerner's policy[,] not Lambert's." with out any justification at all in your post. If you are going to make a declarative statement, at least give some evidence, or are we all just suppose to believe what you said because you said it?

[StanBalaban]

In fact, a comparison to AJ when Man City bought him would be Peter Whittingham. Played in the prem to minimal effect but excelled in the Championship, but you wouldn't want PW.

Judging someone purely on where they've come from without seeing them play for AVFC is doing them a huge disservice.

What a ridiculous and terrible comparison.

Peter whittingham dropped down to the championship because he was shit.

Adam Johnson dropped down with his club at the start of his career. Adam Johnson was also one of the hottest prospects in the country hence Man city signing him and Chelsea showing big interest.

Not really. AJ had played 50 premier league games before returning back to the championship. In that time he scored 2 goals and looked nothing more than average.

It was in the championship that he got 11 goals in 26 games and that where he made a name for himself... as a previously ineffective premier league player excelling in a lower division.

Man City bought a championship player. They took a gamble as he wasn't established in any way in the premier league, as he'd done **** all in 50 games previously. I suggested that if we were to sign someone like that you would be unhappy.

And how is that not like Peter Whittingham btw?

[VillaForever1970]

People said we had to sell to buy, they were wrong.

People said Lambert wouldn't be backed, they were wrong.

People say we will be relegated we needed more experience and they'll be wrong too.

Lambert has bought players who he sees something in and who want to play for Aston Villa, that is good enough for me. Hopefully we will see them grow and improve within our team, forgot the last time that happened.

**** off with the negativity get behind the boys and enjoy the ride!

[TRO]

Whoops!

came here thinking there might be a sensible discussion going on but found the usual childish anti-MON frothing in full flow.

Another thread ****...:?

If you can't swim don't go in the deep end.

[TRO]

It is typical of the self gratification jungle we live in.

We have illustrated our failure in graphic detail of signing players in excess of c 5mill, we have simply crashed and burn't them.

We have to try a different approach.... no one knows if it will work, but it has worked for HIM before and it has worked for US before.

As to the quality v quantity debate, I think in this instance we did need quantity also, its the thing that will help change the type of player and the culture.

The "hungry" needs to out populate the "over fed" and then the mental attitude to winning will hopefully change.

There are never any guarantee's but I think I can see what PL is trying to do.... fingers crossed.

[TRO]

So Incognito has been tweeting again - It reads from bottom to top:

INCOGNITO AVFC ‏@INCOGNITOAVFC

Success is a journey, & now's the time for all of us as a club 2 come 2gether allowing Paul & the team 2 achieve his high goals. #avfc

2m INCOGNITO AVFC ‏@INCOGNITOAVFC

The path we have taken is fresh & full of young, hungry & vibrant talent.Paul has his philosophy in place which we endorse completely.#avfc

2m INCOGNITO AVFC ‏@INCOGNITOAVFC

The best route is very rarely the easy route. If you find something too easy to do, its not worth doing. #avfc

3m INCOGNITO AVFC ‏@INCOGNITOAVFC

It is better to go down a path with obstacles as you begin to learn and develop experience from working harder to get through things. #avfc

Also an interesting tweet from Agent_ITK, known to be one of the "best ITK's" on twitter:

"Here is the big announcement to all 35,000 followers that I have on here.

How many ITK calls did I get right? A hell of a lot more than I got wrong that is for sure! It is finally time for me to leave you all. I started this account to prove that ANYBODY could be an ITK and I could if I so wish get 10s of thousands of followers.

I was proved to be right.

I am somebody who decided to show the Spurs forum I frequent that anybody could be an ITK and could easily fool the public, much to my amusement it was easier than I thought.

What I didn't realise is that I would be used as a "source" for The BBC, Talksport, LBC, Radio London, The Daily Mail, The Sun, The Star, Sky Sports News and even The Independent. I was even mentioned on TV channels in Ireland, Australia, Spain and Fox in the USA.

I am not an ITK yet as some of you will no doubt say you released you still followed, like sheep being led to the slaughter. My every word was hung on and retweeted and retweeted, only getting the arse when the news I was telling you wasn't what you wanted to hear.

Some of the abuse that I have put up with is shocking, although it is always mainly from numptys will a small cock who are probably afraid to go out after dark.

I have left many hints over the last year of what I was doing, yet about 3 of you ever clocked this.

I will not apologise, as I was proved right anybody as usual! Anbody can call themselves ITK and get away with it. Within 4 weeks of starting this account I had 5,000 followers! SHEEP, baaaa, baaaa.

If I was you I would unfollow @backpage, anybody with "mole" in their name, @FouthOfficial_ is a complete fraud, @POTL, @JJetset, @AFCAMDEN, basically anybody that is telling you things that THEY think you want to hear!

Good Luck to you all, I think you'll need it. Baaa, baaaa..."

Looks like 35,000 have been fed lies. I knew he was chatting shit when he was deleting tweets he'd got wrong. Nonetheless, what a prick.

There ain't nowt querer than folk.... I suppose it takes all sorts....

[Morpheus]

I see people say that they are optimistic and we've had a good window but there also the attitude of "If we stay up" and "If we can survive"

If the window was so good surely relegation wouldn't be a concern.

Do you agree it was the managers choice to spend the money this way i.e. a lot of unproven young players rather than a few experienced players?

So he should be held responsible for the season rather than the owner?

We won't pay the wages for the big players so we had to splash it out on lower league nobodies in a scatter gun approach.

On the other hand we signed 9 players.

I recon we could have signed say, 5 or 6 and included a few established names if the manager had wanted.

It seems like this policy has come from the manager rather than the owner.

That is correct about being the manager's policy to buy lower league players. Lambert has been quoted in today's Mirror (Saturday) stating as such while Lerner had made more money available to sign more established Premiership players.

It will totally be down to the manager if we struggle this season!

[Big_John_10]

And how is that not like Peter Whittingham btw?

If you can't see the difference then there's not much to debate.

Peter whittingham showed he couldn't perform in the prem and dropped.

Adam Johnson was a very highly young player relegated with his team. Boro being relegated didn't change the fact Adam Johnson was rated highly hence Chelsea showing an interest and ultimately man city signing him.

How is that like whittingham.

And actually I'd be over the moon if there was a prospect like Johnson in the championship and we signed him over teams like city and Chelsea. What a stupid thing to say.

[Big_John_10]

Nice to see we are setting up lambert for the blame if things go wrong.

So after 2 poor seasons, we've blamed MON, the players, MON, houllier, MON, Faulkner, the players, MON, Mcleish oh and the players.

And once again if we had our 3rd poor season in a row the owner gets no blame.

I bet Doug is kicking himself for not thinking of the free scarves and tattoo idea.

[Big_John_10]

People said we had to sell to buy, they were wrong.

Yeah if you say so.

[Morpheus]

Nice to see we are setting up lambert for the blame if things go wrong.

So after 2 poor seasons, we've blamed MON, the players, MON, houllier, MON, Faulkner, the players, MON, Mcleish oh and the players.

And once again if we had our 3rd poor season in a row the owner gets no blame.

I bet Doug is kicking himself for not thinking of the free scarves and tattoo idea.

It was Lambert's decision to purchase lower league players rather than Lerner who did apparently make more money available to purchase more Premiership established players. It would then follow would it not that if Lambert's policy fails, the blame would lie with the manager!

[Mantis]

Nice to see we are setting up lambert for the blame if things go wrong.

So after 2 poor seasons, we've blamed MON, the players, MON, houllier, MON, Faulkner, the players, MON, Mcleish oh and the players.

And once again if we had our 3rd poor season in a row the owner gets no blame.

I bet Doug is kicking himself for not thinking of the free scarves and tattoo idea.

It was Lambert's decision to purchase lower league players rather than Lerner who did apparently make more money available to purchase more Premiership established players. It would then follow would it not that if Lambert's policy fails, the blame would lie with the manager!

Yeah exactly. Lerner obviously is to blame for certain things but you can't blame him for everything.

So I take it John that if Lambert's signings are a roaring success you'll be heaping praise on Randy?

[Big_John_10]

Of course.

It would be pretty hypocritical of me not to

[Mantis]

How odd. I mean, it's the manager that makes the signings, therefore any success or failure is down to him.

[Big_John_10]

Did I say I wouldn't praise the manager?

If the signings are a roaring success, it would mean we are doing very well and i think both would deserve praise and credit.

I think the strange thing is your inability to understand the question you asked and the response i gave while trying to make me look silly.