PaulC Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 They always fall short in this competition but they have lost a lot of games this season and a team doesn't loose that many games in the Premier League without there being problems. Klopp won it and reached a final of the competition so yould rate him as the better manager out of the two. He's managed top clubs in European football and failed to win it at two of them. That has to be a slight on his managerial career. No doubt he has raised the standard of the Premier League though. The points totals that Man city and Liverpool have been achieving has been greater than we have seen in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted August 15, 2020 Moderator Share Posted August 15, 2020 21 minutes ago, Genie said: They beat the Spanish champions and most successful team in European cup history a week ago. What trophy do they get for that? It isn’t Pep’s fault but the hype about him for years has been totally ridiculous. He was very successful at Barca with the player so many proclaim to be the greatest ever. Since then he under achieved at Munich and has done so at City despite spending half a billion. He is so over rated it is untrue. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted August 15, 2020 Moderator Share Posted August 15, 2020 3 minutes ago, PaulC said: They always fall short in this competition but they have lost a lot of games this season and a team doesn't loose that many games in the Premier League without there being problems. Klopp won it and reached a final of the competition so yould rate him as the better manager out of the two. He's managed top clubs in European football and failed to win it at two of them. That has to be a slight on his managerial career. No doubt he has raised the standard of the Premier League though. The points totals that Man city and Liverpool have been achieving has been greater than we have seen in the past. Because the league is less competitive not because he is the greatest manager. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 9 minutes ago, TrentVilla said: What trophy do they get for that? It isn’t Pep’s fault but the hype about him for years has been totally ridiculous. He was very successful at Barca with the player so many proclaim to be the greatest ever. Since then he under achieved at Munich and has done so at City despite spending half a billion. He is so over rated it is untrue. You missed off "whilst playing some of the best football ever seen" 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted August 15, 2020 Author Share Posted August 15, 2020 the truth is Pep took over Barcelona at an opportunistic time, they were in a poor position but they had 3 of the best players on the Spain Euro 2008 team plus Messi. They just needed guidance so he did well Went to Bayern, at the time the best team in Europe but his arrogant style made them go backwards and the players didnt like him Went to City with all the money available, play good football but have been knocked out by Monaco, Spurs and Lyon in his 4 seasons in Champions League As a great manager he is far far away from the top table Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fun Factory Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 (edited) Big season for Guardiola next year. I think he has to deliver the title or the champions league or he will be off. The domestic cups do not salvage a season for clubs like CIty, they are just inexpensive baubles. I wouldn't be surprised if he went back to Barcelona in a few years time in a post messi side. Edited August 15, 2020 by The Fun Factory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted August 15, 2020 Share Posted August 15, 2020 He makes some mental decisions in big games. Changes a winning system to an experimental one. They'd have won tonight if they started 433. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rino8 Posted August 16, 2020 Visiting Supporter Share Posted August 16, 2020 53 minutes ago, Zatman said: the truth is Pep took over Barcelona at an opportunistic time, they were in a poor position but they had 3 of the best players on the Spain Euro 2008 team plus Messi. They just needed guidance so he did well Went to Bayern, at the time the best team in Europe but his arrogant style made them go backwards and the players didnt like him Went to City with all the money available, play good football but have been knocked out by Monaco, Spurs and Lyon in his 4 seasons in Champions League As a great manager he is far far away from the top table While I absolutely agree he has underperformed at City and Bayern to discredit his Barca achievements is wrong. Barca under Rijkaard were the best because they had Ronaldinho and Eto'o. That's it. Puyol was obviously class but nobody was putting Xavi or Iniesta on equal footing with Seedorf, Pirlo, Gerrard, Lampard etc etc. Messi was an obviously going to be world class 18 year old but people expected him to be more like Ribery than Maradonna. Messi's insane development and the real rise of Xavi and Iniesta is largely down to Pep. For a few years he changed football. Even clubs like Wigan suddenly saw value in keeping the ball down and moving 5 yards closer together, then teams realised you could play that way and not field 10 CM'S and the cracks started appearing. The previous loss Barca had to Bayern under Pep was almost as shocking as yesterday's. Hes made a few big blunders in the CL now and should be rightly criticised for it, but let's not be calling him the Spanish Big Sam just yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 I know it’s a matter of time until they do win it and it will be a sad day when they do but in the mean time I’ll enjoy the CL being this unattainable prize to them no matter how much money they fling at it. Did you know Aston Villa once won it on a pittance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
penguin Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 I wouldn’t disagree some of the hype around him as been a little over the top at times but let’s not get carried away, he’s clearly a top top manager. I was firmly in the “he’s massively overrated camp” upon his arrival but he’s converted me whilst he’s been at City. It would hard to argue against title winning side being the best the Premier League has ever seen. Undoubtedly he has a tendency to over-tinker in big Champions League games, seemingly always to his detriment but at the end of the day it’s a knock out competition and a game of extremely fine margins; The VAR decisión against Spurs last year and Lyon’s 2nd today being a prime example. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudevillaisnice Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 4 hours ago, Wainy316 said: I know it’s a matter of time until they do win it and it will be a sad day when they do but in the mean time I’ll enjoy the CL being this unattainable prize to them no matter how much money they fling at it. Did you know Aston Villa once won it on a pittance? It’s great isn’t it. I hope they don’t win for another 20-30 years as unlikely as it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 9 hours ago, TrentVilla said: What trophy do they get for that? It isn’t Pep’s fault but the hype about him for years has been totally ridiculous. He was very successful at Barca with the player so many proclaim to be the greatest ever. Since then he under achieved at Munich and has done so at City despite spending half a billion. He is so over rated it is untrue. They beat some of the best teams in Europe including the most successful European side in history just last week. He has also won lots of domestic trophies playing some of the best football I’ve seen in the Premier League. When they click they are unplayable and that is down to Pep (and the financial backing). As I said, he’s not the best ever but he’s also not a fraud/ con man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 8 hours ago, Zatman said: the truth is Pep took over Barcelona at an opportunistic time, they were in a poor position but they had 3 of the best players on the Spain Euro 2008 team plus Messi. They just needed guidance so he did well Went to Bayern, at the time the best team in Europe but his arrogant style made them go backwards and the players didnt like him Went to City with all the money available, play good football but have been knocked out by Monaco, Spurs and Lyon in his 4 seasons in Champions League As a great manager he is far far away from the top table That's not the truth though us it? When he came to barca he showed Ronaldinho, deco, thuram, zambrotta and edmilson the door and bought in dani Alves and pique whilst promoting busqeuts and Pedro from the b team, that's a bit more than guidance In the 3 years before pep bayern won 1 league, 1 Cup and the CL, in the 3 years he was there they won 3 leagues and 2 cups so not exactly backwards Man City he has the record for points in a season and the only team ever to win a domestic treble, in 4 years under pep they have 2 leagues and 4 cups, in the previous 8 years of oil money they'd won 2 leagues and 3 cups so he hasn't underachieved He holds the record for most games consecutively won in all 3 leagues 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 7 hours ago, Wainy316 said: I know it’s a matter of time until they do win it and it will be a sad day when they do but in the mean time I’ll enjoy the CL being this unattainable prize to them no matter how much money they fling at it. Did you know Aston Villa once won it on a pittance? Same with psg for me, was sat hoping they lost to atalanta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 He has improved Man City massively. Ok he hasn’t delivered the champions league but this season is weird anyway. I don’t accept he’s a fraud. Look at the development of Raheem Sterling under him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 10 hours ago, TrentVilla said: Because the league is less competitive not because he is the greatest manager. There’s no proof this is the case. That’s just your opinion. Facts are there that both Liverpool and Man City have moved to another level in domestic football Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted August 16, 2020 Author Share Posted August 16, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, PaulC said: There’s no proof this is the case. That’s just your opinion. Facts are there that both Liverpool and Man City have moved to another level in domestic football But the points tally of the other teams have gotten lower. Is a lot less quality in the overhyped financially doped Premier League Edited August 16, 2020 by Zatman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudevillaisnice Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 I don’t think he is a fraud but the praise he has received is well over the top since he has come in to the league, have to agree with the comment earlier of him re-inventing English football etc when he came in was absolutely embarrassing, he should be absolutely hammered for his tactics against Lyon. Trying to over complicate things as per. I personally rate Klopp higher for what he has achieved (the football is better too) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 Pep certainly fell into the trap that several other top coaches fall into. Overthinking team and formation and ending up in a real mess and seeing it backfire. Its like the ego gets in the way and they don’t just want to win, they want to do something mad and win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubbs Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 Would any of you hate to see him as Villa's manager? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts