blandy Posted February 9, 2015 Moderator Share Posted February 9, 2015 ..i just dont get it blandy and i think a lot of those there today support what happend otherwise why protest. ....they start preaching all their bullshit which did not happen today i might add but when other protests happen they shout murder etc etc and use freedom of speech. but they dont like it the other way, if i went on national tv or radio and said something they did not like id be a marked man. Two comments in reply - on the first line - it's two TOTALLY seperate things. They organised a march to express their dislike of the drawings and comments about their God. That's fine isn't it in a free world. We let that happen in the UK - we let people march about Countryside Alliance and not liking fox hunting bans,. We let people march against our Gov't doing Iraq war, we let people march for the EDL, we let people march for protests about french cartoons. That's how we roll. Be peaceful, make your point, go home. They chose to protest about cartoons. That's OK. They also (but didn't have to) condemned the terrorsim. Good on 'em.. They weren't "secretly supporting terrorism", they just hold different cultural views to what you do or I do. That's why they protested. It's not sinister. it's fair and open and democratic. Free speech, yes. Freedom of expression. No one was hurt, no violence. I agree, I don't understand why they can't see the protest they did was ill timed and perhaps insensitive, but I'll get over it. The second point you wrote is a bit like putting stuff in their mouths they didn't do or say or think. The people there didn't "preach all their bullshit" they just said, in effect - "be nice to each other, please. Respect our view, and thanks UK media for not broadcasting the cartoons, that was good of you, we appreciate it" That's not in any way sinister or bad. I'd just say don't kind of imagine bad things of them for doing that. IF other people do bad things, preach hate or commend violence, then we'd both be quite right to have a go at them for it. But AFAIK these people did the opposite - they went out of their way to ask for all people to respect each other. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugeley Villa Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 yeah i know they wernt preaching hate, i was refering to other demos but its the same with the EDL etc. fair enough blandy, i suppose whats getting me is the timing of everything etc etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YGabbana Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Not sure where this notion of marching against everything and anything comes from. The march is poor timing and not needed in the UK. Many have marched against ISIS fyi, don't assume otherwise just because you have not read about it. ISIS is killing plenty of Muslims. I can do a straw poll of about 1000 Muslims in a few days and I am betting that not 1 would offer even a hint of support. I would say 50% of Khutbahs (sermons) I have been to over the last year and a bit has been about the wrongs ISIS are doing. It's very easy to pain the majority with a view when they don't do something to appease your pre-existing views. Sadly if its not reported on bbc/sky news or not in The Sun, joe public in this country wont even know about it. There have been marches all around the world condemning isis, muslim scholars, leaders of mosques and world leaders have all condemned it. Even al-qeada have called them barbaric. As for marching against the french magazine everyone who is offended by it has a right to express their feelings. It may seem like a funny cartoon to some people but to a muslim its offensive. Theres alot of double standards, a french magazine (not sure if the same one) drew cartoons about the israel/gaza mass murder and were asked to remove it which they did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Not sure where this notion of marching against everything and anything comes from. The march is poor timing and not needed in the UK. Many have marched against ISIS fyi, don't assume otherwise just because you have not read about it. ISIS is killing plenty of Muslims. I can do a straw poll of about 1000 Muslims in a few days and I am betting that not 1 would offer even a hint of support. I would say 50% of Khutbahs (sermons) I have been to over the last year and a bit has been about the wrongs ISIS are doing. It's very easy to pain the majority with a view when they don't do something to appease your pre-existing views. Sadly if its not reported on bbc/sky news or not in The Sun, joe public in this country wont even know about it. There have been marches all around the world condemning isis, muslim scholars, leaders of mosques and world leaders have all condemned it. Even al-qeada have called them barbaric. As for marching against the french magazine everyone who is offended by it has a right to express their feelings. It may seem like a funny cartoon to some people but to a muslim its offensive. Theres alot of double standards, a french magazine (not sure if the same one) drew cartoons about the israel/gaza mass murder and were asked to remove it which they did. Genuine question, but what's more offensive, mocking the prophet or the sort of killings that ISIS carry out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Killings. I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Not sure where this notion of marching against everything and anything comes from. The march is poor timing and not needed in the UK. Many have marched against ISIS fyi, don't assume otherwise just because you have not read about it. ISIS is killing plenty of Muslims. I can do a straw poll of about 1000 Muslims in a few days and I am betting that not 1 would offer even a hint of support. I would say 50% of Khutbahs (sermons) I have been to over the last year and a bit has been about the wrongs ISIS are doing. It's very easy to pain the majority with a view when they don't do something to appease your pre-existing views. Sadly if its not reported on bbc/sky news or not in The Sun, joe public in this country wont even know about it. There have been marches all around the world condemning isis, muslim scholars, leaders of mosques and world leaders have all condemned it. Even al-qeada have called them barbaric. As for marching against the french magazine everyone who is offended by it has a right to express their feelings. It may seem like a funny cartoon to some people but to a muslim its offensive. Theres alot of double standards, a french magazine (not sure if the same one) drew cartoons about the israel/gaza mass murder and were asked to remove it which they did. Genuine question, but what's more offensive, mocking the prophet or the sort of killings that ISIS carry out? Should we only protest against the very worst of humanity, and work in a linear fashion? Once we've stopped barbaric murder only then can we move on to domestic violence, only then animal cruelty, tax evasion, mean cartoons... Incidentally, that's pretty much the order of priority I'd put it in. But real life isn't either / or. Killing of any description is always offensive. White europeans are currently bombing hospitals and bus stops in Ukraine. I've done **** all about it. I have signed a petition about the local swimming pool. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted February 10, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted February 10, 2015 I don't see a problem with the protest - it is their right. I also don't see the point in targeting (through 'satire' or otherwise) a group that has no power and has been demonised for the past 14 years. But somewhat hypocritically I also think it is healthy to have people out there who push boundaries. They shouldn't be killed or jailed for being offensive, but they should be called out for bullshit if and when it happens. We need those people because we need to be wary of when 'we can, but shouldn't' veers toward 'we should, but can't'. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 http://www.newsobserver.com/2015/02/10/4545775/three-people-shot-dead-in-chapel.htmlCHAPEL HILL — Police charged a Chapel Hill man Wednesday with first-degree murder in the deaths of three family members in a quiet neighborhood near Meadowmont just south of N.C. 54. Craig Stephen Hicks, 46, is being held in the Durham County Jail on three counts of first-degree murder. He is accused of shooting Chapel Hill residents Deah Shaddy Barakat, 23, and his wife Yusor Mohammad, 21; and her sister, Razan Mohammad Abu-Salha, 19, of Raleigh. Police officers found the victims dead at the scene, after responding to a report of gunshots on Summerwalk Circle at 5:11 p.m. Tuesday. The neighborhood, adjacent to the Friday Center, is mostly rental apartments and modest condominiums. It rarely appears in reports of crime in Chapel Hill. A group of seven or eight young people who appeared to be in their 20s arrived in the area about two hours after the shooting. They sat on the curb at the corner of Summerwalk and Springberry Lane near a parked patrol car. One young man who did not identify himself said he thought his brother might have been one of the victms. He had been trying to reach his brother and two others in the Finley Forest subdivision without success. A woman who is believed to be Barakat’s mother arrived about 7:45 p.m. She was crying, asking officers to at least let them know who was involved. An officer said they did not have that information yet. A police crisis counselor took the mother and the man’s father aside to talk. The father returned to the group a short time later, walked up to police officers and demanded to know whether his son had been shot. He tried to walk toward his son’s apartment about two blocks away. A group of officers stepped in front of him and told him not to go there. He tried to go around them, and the officers stepped in front of him again. Late Tuesday, police were talking with members of the family in the neighborhood’s clubhouse, but they declined to give details of the discussion. Surprisingly hardly any news coverage of this in the US or anywhere else. Its being labelled hate crime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 It's pretty sickening that hardly any news outlets are reporting on this yet it is the number 1 trending thing on twitter. You can bet if it was the other way round there would be 24h news on this like a hawk. I look forward to hearing the crime condemned by the general population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted February 11, 2015 VT Supporter Share Posted February 11, 2015 (edited) All killings are condemmed by the "general population". This is no different. What the motives are for these killings are unknown as far as I can tell. EDIT: There's further info when clicking the actual link. Edited February 11, 2015 by PieFacE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarewsEyebrowDesigner Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 (edited) I suspect there is a lack of reporting because the man has already been arrested and charged & when that happens the meeja tends to pipe down as legal proceedings take over. But that's a guess and I'm not totally convinced by my own reasoning either. Edited February 11, 2015 by CarewsEyebrowDesigner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risso Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 It's pretty sickening that hardly any news outlets are reporting on this yet it is the number 1 trending thing on twitter. You can bet if it was the other way round there would be 24h news on this like a hawk. I look forward to hearing the crime condemned by the general population. Why? I can see the point you're trying to make, but it's not a valid one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 If it was the other way round do you think it would be treated the same? The double standards of the media is pretty apparent. Nowhere to be seen on the main BBC news page. You have to dig real deep to find it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Tbf the condemnation thing was a throwaway comment. The double standards of the media is the big issue. Not even on the headlines of CNN's regular broadcast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 If it was the other way round do you think it would be treated the same? The double standards of the media is pretty apparent. Nowhere to be seen on the main BBC news page. You have to dig real deep to find it. USA has a murder rate of about 150,000 per annum if even 1% of those was reported over here, 4 per day, that would take up a lot of news print If we did, then I guess we'd quite rightly have to give equal coverage to other countries too, not just those perceived as 'white' and all of a sudden it's patently not possible to report on every murder or serious crime where there is a possibility of 'hate crime' against religion, colour, spoken language, sexual orientation, disability, ethnic origin... But I do get the basic point (I think) you're making and its a valid one. People believe what a selective media tells them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Yes agree. My point is that this was a known militant atheist according to reports. He gunned down, execution style, 3 Muslims in an apparent hate crime/terrorist attack. If it was the other way round this story would take centre stage and be the main headline on a constant stream on all the main media outlets. It's the fact that one life is valued so much higher than another and that there is a clear double standard when it comes to these crimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YGabbana Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Yes agree. My point is that this was a known militant atheist according to reports. He gunned down, execution style, 3 Muslims in an apparent hate crime/terrorist attack. If it was the other way round this story would take centre stage and be the main headline on a constant stream on all the main media outlets. It's the fact that one life is valued so much higher than another and that there is a clear double standard when it comes to these crimes. The media has an agenda thats why, you can see it and so can i Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
limpid Posted February 11, 2015 Administrator Share Posted February 11, 2015 Yes agree. My point is that this was a known militant atheist according to reports. He gunned down, execution style, 3 Muslims in an apparent hate crime/terrorist attack. If it was the other way round this story would take centre stage and be the main headline on a constant stream on all the main media outlets. It's the fact that one life is valued so much higher than another and that there is a clear double standard when it comes to these crimes. What is a militant atheist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omariqy Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Not sure it's what some media outlets have called him. I imagine it is an extreme atheist who wants to harm religious people. At a guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Yes agree. My point is that this was a known militant atheist according to reports. He gunned down, execution style, 3 Muslims in an apparent hate crime/terrorist attack. If it was the other way round this story would take centre stage and be the main headline on a constant stream on all the main media outlets. It's the fact that one life is valued so much higher than another and that there is a clear double standard when it comes to these crimes. What is a militant atheist? 33% of VT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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