nick76 Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 1 hour ago, Demitri_C said: How many times did we see that last season? A good result followed by a poor one Poor season is abit over dramatic in my opinion If your not entertained thats different. But not poor for me Poor season for me because we have likely lost half our games this season, several runs of losing streaks, change in manager, points total likely to be 8 points lower than last season if we beat Burnley and lose to City and all despite replacing Grealish with Ings, Coutinho, Digne, Buendia and Bailey. All this while the young squad has another season of experience in the PL from Watkins, Konsa, Cash, Dougie and co. We’ve gone backwards in some ways that’s why it’s been poor to me. So that’s aside from the entertainment which you point to. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted May 16, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted May 16, 2022 Poor season , most worrying part is there is a distinct distance between the club and the supporters not helped by the poor performances on the pitch. Hopefully we can start next season well and give us all something to get behind. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaFaninLondon Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 Aston Villa last 10 seasons: 20/21: 11th (Prem) 19/20: 17th (Prem) 18/19: 5th (Champ) 17/18: 4th (Champ) 16/17: 13th (Champ) 15/16: 20th (Prem) 14/15: 17th (Prem) 13/14: 15th (Prem) 12/13: 15th (Prem) 11/12: 16th (Prem) Previous 10 seasons (all Prem): 10/11: 9th 09/10: 6th 08/09: 6th 07/08: 6th 06/07: 11th 05/06: 16th 04/05: 10th 03/04: 6th 02/03: 16th 01/02: 8th Pretty grim viewing when we will likely finish somewhere between 11th and 14th this season and miss out on top 10 again. We had 7 top 10 finishes in the last decade before this one to 0 top 10 finishes in 11 seasons (admittedly three of them spent in the Champ). We really have to get our sh*t together next season because we've been mediocre for far, far too long. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaParkAvenue Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 15 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said: Aston Villa last 10 seasons: 20/21: 11th (Prem) 19/20: 17th (Prem) 18/19: 5th (Champ) 17/18: 4th (Champ) 16/17: 13th (Champ) 15/16: 20th (Prem) 14/15: 17th (Prem) 13/14: 15th (Prem) 12/13: 15th (Prem) 11/12: 16th (Prem) Previous 10 seasons (all Prem): 10/11: 9th 09/10: 6th 08/09: 6th 07/08: 6th 06/07: 11th 05/06: 16th 04/05: 10th 03/04: 6th 02/03: 16th 01/02: 8th Pretty grim viewing when we will likely finish somewhere between 11th and 14th this season and miss out on top 10 again. We had 7 top 10 finishes in the last decade before this one to 0 top 10 finishes in 11 seasons (admittedly three of them spent in the Champ). We really have to get our sh*t together next season because we've been mediocre for far, far too long. At least before 2018 Villa had the excuse of not having extremely rich and ambitous owners. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 57 minutes ago, nick76 said: Poor season for me because we have likely lost half our games this season, several runs of losing streaks, change in manager, points total likely to be 8 points lower than last season if we beat Burnley and lose to City and all despite replacing Grealish with Ings, Coutinho, Digne, Buendia and Bailey. All this while the young squad has another season of experience in the PL from Watkins, Konsa, Cash, Dougie and co. We’ve gone backwards in some ways that’s why it’s been poor to me. So that’s aside from the entertainment which you point to. But lets not forget some of that was under smith so not all on gerrards. He has had to play catchup this season too. If we start as badly as we did this year then i get the criticism towards him. But for me he has done as expected of it. Main goal was to keep us up and he has done that. If we do finish 10th or above i dont see how anyone can call this a poor season 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 29 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: Main goal was to keep us up and he has done that. That’s not true though is it! We weren’t going to be relegated and even if you believe that do you really think Gerrard was only brought in to avoid relegation this season and the expectation wasn’t higher? I think you are fooling yourself if you think that 32 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: If we do finish 10th or above i dont see how anyone can call this a poor season But we aren’t going to do that, we aren’t going to beat both Burnley and Man City which is the minimum needed to get 10th and that’s hoping Brighton and Leicester don’t get the points they need or Palace. 35 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: But lets not forget some of that was under smith so not all on gerrards. He has had to play catchup this season too. I said in this thread it’s both Smith and Gerrard’s fault a number of times. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 39 minutes ago, nick76 said: That’s not true though is it! We weren’t going to be relegated and even if you believe that do you really think Gerrard was only brought in to avoid relegation this season and the expectation wasn’t higher? I think you are fooling yourself if you think that But we aren’t going to do that, we aren’t going to beat both Burnley and Man City which is the minimum needed to get 10th and that’s hoping Brighton and Leicester don’t get the points they need or Palace. I said in this thread it’s both Smith and Gerrard’s fault a number of times. We were 15th under smith if he stayed we would have been ina relegation dig fit if he stayed. We were only mathematically safe a few weeks ago so i dont understand how thats foolish? I think its unlikely we would have gine down considering hiw bad some of the teams down there have been. Even if we finish 11th or 12th we have established ourselves at least and not gone the way of leeds and sheff utd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 It really did have the makings of a poor season when SG took over and relegation was beginning to look an increasing threat. While the good run that we went on following SGs arrival didn't last, most of us would have been satisfied with a mid table finish. A win against Burnley will probably see us end up 12th and that is acceptable for me, but I will be looking for progress next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 55 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: We were 15th under smith if he stayed we would have been ina relegation dig fit if he stayed. Pure speculation, to conclude that after 11 games is disingenuous. We have no idea how Smith would’ve done if he had stayed, maybe he could’ve got us relegated but he could’ve done better than Gerrard, he was always a streaky manager with wins and losses. But Smith has gone but your comment is hyperbole mate. 55 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: We were only mathematically safe a few weeks ago so i dont understand how thats foolish? Yes Smith started badly but even by pure games Gerrard takes a lot of responsibility for only getting away from relegation…a run of 16 points from 16 games included in that. 55 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: I think its unlikely we would have gine down considering hiw bad some of the teams down there have been. Exactly, so after 36 games on 44 points, it looks better than it should. That’s Smith and Gerrard’s fault. Smith for the first 11 games but Gerrard’s had 25 games. 55 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: Even if we finish 11th or 12th we have established ourselves at least and not gone the way of leeds and sheff utd It’s not comparable this is our third season not our second season like Sheff Utd was and likely Leeds. Brentford most likely will fall next season. We avoided relegation our first season and the comparable second season, we got 55 points which normally would’ve got 8th position including likely this season but unfortunately it got us 11th last season. This season we will most likely finish between 11th and 14th which will be midtable but a step backwards definitely points wise and maybe lose a position or few. Additionally the amount of money we have spent compared to those teams it shouldn’t be a comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 It's really hard to say if relegation is a serious threat after what, 10/12 games and not even being in the relegation zone. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calcifer Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 3 hours ago, VillaFaninLondon said: Aston Villa last 10 seasons: 20/21: 11th (Prem) 19/20: 17th (Prem) 18/19: 5th (Champ) 17/18: 4th (Champ) 16/17: 13th (Champ) 15/16: 20th (Prem) 14/15: 17th (Prem) 13/14: 15th (Prem) 12/13: 15th (Prem) 11/12: 16th (Prem) Previous 10 seasons (all Prem): 10/11: 9th 09/10: 6th 08/09: 6th 07/08: 6th 06/07: 11th 05/06: 16th 04/05: 10th 03/04: 6th 02/03: 16th 01/02: 8th Pretty grim viewing when we will likely finish somewhere between 11th and 14th this season and miss out on top 10 again. We had 7 top 10 finishes in the last decade before this one to 0 top 10 finishes in 11 seasons (admittedly three of them spent in the Champ). We really have to get our sh*t together next season because we've been mediocre for far, far too long. God that is grim viewing! We circled the drain for a few seasons then we were flushed. Pre 2010 we had some respectable finishes, but that was before the huge increase in sky money, Man city etc. This season we won't replicate the dizzy heights of 11th that we managed last season. 12/13th is looking more likely, we are not getting anything vs City and I have a feeling Burnley will beat us, so all in all not a great final position but could have been much worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 1 hour ago, nick76 said: Pure speculation, to conclude that after 11 games is disingenuous. We have no idea how Smith would’ve done if he had stayed, maybe he could’ve got us relegated but he could’ve done better than Gerrard, he was always a streaky manager with wins and losses. But Smith has gone but your comment is hyperbole mate. Yes Smith started badly but even by pure games Gerrard takes a lot of responsibility for only getting away from relegation…a run of 16 points from 16 games included in that. Exactly, so after 36 games on 44 points, it looks better than it should. That’s Smith and Gerrard’s fault. Smith for the first 11 games but Gerrard’s had 25 games. It’s not comparable this is our third season not our second season like Sheff Utd was and likely Leeds. Brentford most likely will fall next season. We avoided relegation our first season and the comparable second season, we got 55 points which normally would’ve got 8th position including likely this season but unfortunately it got us 11th last season. This season we will most likely finish between 11th and 14th which will be midtable but a step backwards definitely points wise and maybe lose a position or few. Additionally the amount of money we have spent compared to those teams it shouldn’t be a comparison. You asked the question i merely presented what i think would have happened. Whether smiths gone or not the fact remained the season we under achieved was because of him this year more than gerrard. It is comparable as our 2nd season we finished 11th and those two clubs have been relegated or close to in leeds case. Like i said if we finish 11th or 12th its not a disaster like some are pointing out. Could it be better? Sure of course However gerrard isnt doing a bad job at all in my opinion. Came in at a difficult time and his signings have so far been a success. Im excited to see the level of players he is going to bring in come the summer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 1 hour ago, nick76 said: This season we will most likely finish between 11th and 14th which will be midtable but a step backwards definitely points wise and maybe lose a position Also just to support my argument gerrards record where are in the table. Not so bad is it... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 9 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: Also just to support my argument gerrards record where are in the table. Not so bad is it... Yep I agree but what gets dismissed is the new manager bounce of 12 points in the first 6 games and since then it’s 19 games 22 points. I’m not allowed to mention that though because many on here says that’s unfair/BS/cherrypicked. I think a new manager bounce is a thing and I have shown massive amount of data on this site to support that from many managers across many clubs down the years. I also point to how well we played those first six games, very different to most things in 2022 but I’ve been heavily criticised by some on here for that. I’m bound to get abuse for repeating but I don’t care. The last 19 games (equivalent of half a season so double that leads to a 44 point season). Anyway people will abuse me for that and I’ll just ignore that but that form is what concerns me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 10 hours ago, Demitri_C said: 12th in the league and a boring season? Wow People forget we nearly went out of business 4 years ago. Mid table in the Premier is a great recovery from everyone involved in the last few years. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejs1111 Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 For all the people talking about how the Villa players and staff need a change in culture/attitude towards winning...and not accepting mediocracy. I'm baffled by how many posters here are doing EXACTLY that. I for one agree with alot of Nick76 comments...the owners are definitely not here to just toil around in the Premier League and be content with mid-table like many clubs. They want a seat at the big table. They have already shown how ruthless they can be despite all the wonderful things that have been done with Villa. Coaches and players need to produce. Period. Or they will be replaced. End of. This season was simply not good enough. The mentality of this squad is weak. I think our vast youth is actually hurting us to an extent. We need some experience in the squad: calm players during the game, keep them focused in practice, etc etc. I don't expect SG to fill Villa with a bunch of old players, but I think he knows what we need. Obviously, the spine needs to be improved as well (DM, CB). Frankly I think those simple fixes will really unlock the potential of our team. 1 top class CB to partner with Konsa/Mings, and 1-2 top class DM/CM types to allow our CMs more freedom... suddenly we will look like a different team imo. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 57 minutes ago, nick76 said: Yep I agree but what gets dismissed is the new manager bounce of 12 points in the first 6 games and since then it’s 19 games 22 points. I’m not allowed to mention that though because many on here says that’s unfair/BS/cherrypicked. I think a new manager bounce is a thing and I have shown massive amount of data on this site to support that from many managers across many clubs down the years. I also point to how well we played those first six games, very different to most things in 2022 but I’ve been heavily criticised by some on here for that. I’m bound to get abuse for repeating but I don’t care. The last 19 games (equivalent of half a season so double that leads to a 44 point season). Anyway people will abuse me for that and I’ll just ignore that but that form is what concerns me. You wont get abuse from me for stating your opinion even if i disagree with it I think the manager bounce is a fair point as alot of managers usually do get that but at the same time you still have to beat whats in front of you. For me its been a mixed bag, we have some bad performances like watford and Newcastle but even our heaviest defeat the 4-0 vs spurs we were actually very good 1st. The game could have been very different. For me the worst performance this season was the wolves one. How smith lost that is almost unforgivable. I get your point about the form. I actually agree with that its not been consistent. A massive area that needs improvement. We cant go win 4 on the trot then lose the next 3 if we have aspirations for europe. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 Newcastle now going above us. This season has unravelling so spectacularly badly for us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 How did we fold over to Arsenal when we played them a few weeks back Poor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAMAICAN-VILLAN Posted May 16, 2022 Share Posted May 16, 2022 3 minutes ago, Zatman said: How did we fold over to Arsenal when we played them a few weeks back Poor 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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