sne Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 24 minutes ago, villalad21 said: When Steve Bruce had a bad spell this season it was the manager's fault. When Dean Smith have a bad spell it's the players fault. Interesting. Come on you know the answer to this one. One had been here for 24 months, the other one for just over 4 months. We all know the issues with the squad, one of them is the reason we have these issues, the other one was brought in to try and selvage the season despite the shitty hand given. Now Smith is failing atm, but he is working with the hollow squad that Bruce built (or disassembled) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 2 minutes ago, Nigel said: I want that type of football here and I'm prepared to write off this season to get it. Even if that means mid table? Cause that's all DS ever achieved. I would prefer good football as well, but not at any cost. If you asked me if i wanted good football and mid table or defensive football and top 6 i would pick the latter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 4 minutes ago, sne said: One had been here for 24 months, the other one for just over 4 months. We made it into the play off final in Bruce's 2nd season. You think DS will do better than that in his 2nd season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thabucks Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 I never wanted Bruce but got behind him until the results turned sour and thought he should of been removed that first summer as the signs were there for me personally it was a train wreck waiting to happen.... Now we are in a similar position with Smith and I get that if you weren’t behind his appointment as I wasn’t with Bruce I can understand to a point people questioning his ability to turn things around and wanting him gone ... Sadly we are again being divided in camps for and against Smith ... I wanted Henry purely down to the potential excitement of one of the greatest modern era strikers taken over .... look how that turned out for Monaco . I’m not sure what the answer is or if smith is the man long term. I always saw his appointment as a catalyst for change and to build lasting foundations and set long term plans in motion. After last night I can see we have a hell of a lot to do still but can’t help feel that the team is unbalanced with poor quality in key positions. Our FB and CM McGinn aside are not just not good enough. I feel any manger would struggle with the players we have in these key positions to make a coherent team to challenge for league. Play offs should of been achievable , too many draws have killed our chances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyAnty Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 5 minutes ago, sne said: Come on you know the answer to this one. One had been here for 24 months, the other one for just over 4 months. We all know the issues with the squad, one of them is the reason we have these issues, the other one was brought in to try and selvage the season despite the shitty hand given. Now Smith is failing atm, but he is working with the hollow squad that Bruce built (or disassembled) Its not the bad players who are picking 2 DM's. Also i think everyone would be more forgiving if there was a glimpse of a game plan. The system lack of tatics is the exact same as under Bruce. Nothing has changed. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thug Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 I saw the shit last night. I've seen the shit over the last 12 games or so. Its pretty dire. However, I remember the good stuff that we played with the exact same team that Bruce left him - and it was a difference of night and day. Losing 2 players that are comfortable on the ball have made a HUGE difference to how we function. Quite simply we do not have players that are comfortable in doing what he is asking them to do. Grealish and Tuanzebe both have the ability to step past a player and pick a pass to one of our own. The knock on effect of creating time and space for every one else is a lot more significant than a lot on here realise. The inability to replace them in the team isn't just Smith's fault. I've seen enough from his arrival to know I like the brand of football that he brings. Write this season off. And get some players that can pass and move in the summer, and we go from there. We're not going up, we're not going down. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomav84 Posted February 14, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted February 14, 2019 35 minutes ago, villalad21 said: When Steve Bruce had a bad spell this season it was the manager's fault. When Dean Smith have a bad spell it's the players fault. Interesting. there were problems with the players before too...even at the end i believed it wasn't ALL bruces fault. he had been given time to change the playing style and ultimately his time ran out. smith has yet to be given the time and the summer will be huge for him. mile, elphick, hutton, richards, whelan are all out of contract and good riddance. many others are back to their parent clubs. this leaves smith to try and assemble basically a whole new team and hopefully ship out some others in the process for a few quid i.e. BB, horihane, and lansbury. i cannot wait to see that back of the lot of them and actually i'm quite excited to see what smith puts together...hopefully he wont be sacked before then 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted February 14, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted February 14, 2019 1 minute ago, villalad21 said: Even if that means mid table? Cause that's all DS ever achieved. I would prefer good football as well, but not at any cost. If you asked me if i wanted good football and mid table or defensive football and top 6 i would pick the latter. The football we play will go a long way to how successful we are. It's no coincidence that all the top teams all play a similar possession based high intensity game. Also who is this mystical manager that will guarantee us top 6 by playing a different way? That is not the choice here. What is the choice is how you want to see the games played week in week out, the rest will always be a gamble. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 19 minutes ago, DaveAV1 said: I thought you’d said you’d go for Dunga a week or so ago. Youre right about how football works regarding results, but we should hold our nerve for now. It’s an ideal situation to rebuild under relatively low pressure. It's the lack of faith for me Dave. Our performances have been absolute shocking with no plan B. I had my doubts about him even being the correct man when we conducted surveys who should be our next manager. Game after game it's the same crap we have to watch week after week. Sorry, for me he is not the right man to take this club forward imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 4 minutes ago, villalad21 said: We made it into the play off final in Bruce's 2nd season. You think DS will do better than that in his 2nd season? With a squad that is totally dismantled and no parachute money? No I strongly doubt it. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 5 minutes ago, HeyAnty said: Its not the bad players who are picking 2 DM's. Also i think everyone would be more forgiving if there was a glimpse of a game plan. The system lack of tatics is the exact same as under Bruce. Nothing has changed. No I agree, I'm very much on the fence with Smith. I wan't to see clear development during the rest of the season to convince me he should manage us next season. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Albrighton Posted February 14, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted February 14, 2019 Just now, sne said: With a squad that is totally dismantled and no parachute money? No I strongly doubt it. Yep, comparisons are not going to be easy. Whether people think that’s a cop out or not, it’s true. This squad is going to look very different in the summer whomever is in charge. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Albrighton Posted February 14, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted February 14, 2019 1 minute ago, sne said: No I agree, I'm very much on the fence with Smith. I wan't to see clear development during the rest of the season to convince me he should manage us next season. Yep, roughly speaking where I am too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Posted February 14, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted February 14, 2019 11 minutes ago, villalad21 said: We made it into the play off final in Bruce's 2nd season. You think DS will do better than that in his 2nd season? Maybe, maybe not. However one guarantee will be that the season after we wouldn't be starting again under Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 5 minutes ago, Nigel said: The football we play will go a long way to how successful we are. It's no coincidence that all the top teams all play a similar possession based high intensity game. Also who is this mystical manager that will guarantee us top 6 by playing a different way? That is not the choice here. What is the choice is how you want to see the games played week in week out, the rest will always be a gamble. Main issue with DS teams is the defense. His teams tends to concede 50+ goals every season, very hard to get promoted with that many goals conceded. So far it's been very telling why we concede so many goals. Our fullbacks keep bombing forward making us extremely vulnerable to counter attacks. It's an extremely risky way of playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyAnty Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 3 minutes ago, Thug said: I saw the shit last night. I've seen the shit over the last 12 games or so. Its pretty dire. However, I remember the good stuff that we played with the exact same team that Bruce left him - and it was a difference of night and day. Losing 2 players that are comfortable on the ball have made a HUGE difference to how we function. Quite simply we do not have players that are comfortable in doing what he is asking them to do. Grealish and Tuanzebe both have the ability to step past a player and pick a pass to one of our own. The knock on effect of creating time and space for every one else is a lot more significant than a lot on here realise. The inability to replace them in the team isn't just Smith's fault. I've seen enough from his arrival to know I like the brand of football that he brings. Write this season off. And get some players that can pass and move in the summer, and we go from there. We're not going up, we're not going down. Are you telling me O'Hare (who is comfortable on the ball) wouldnt have been better than Hourihane. Smith let him go. Are you telling me Davis wouldn't be a better option to have on that Adomah or El Gazhi. Are you telling me Elmohamdy isnt a better option that Hutton at RB? Smith has took the safe option to avoid getting blame. Now he can use the excuse the fans are giving him that the players arent up to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mykeyb Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 I hate to mention that mob down the road but how many players has their manager brought in. He looked at what he had and came up with a game plan that works. We have arguably better players but we appear to have no heart or desire at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest av1 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 1 hour ago, lexicon said: A lot of people talked about fundamental root and branch changes at the football club. A philosophy. An ethos. Totally different types of players identified, signed and developed. How long does that take? A few months? Hell no, don't be ridiculous. We have to be willing to accept short term problems to fix things in the long term. You can't have your cake and eat it too, I'm afraid. Spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 3 minutes ago, HeyAnty said: Smith has took the safe option to avoid getting blame. Now he can use the excuse the fans are giving him that the players arent up to it. It does feel like Lambert all over again. Slowly goes back from his ways cause he feels the pressure from the fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyAnty Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 11 minutes ago, sne said: No I agree, I'm very much on the fence with Smith. I wan't to see clear development during the rest of the season to convince me he should manage us next season. I sort of am but i just cant see it with the performances over the past 15 games. Probably makes sense to keep him to the end of the season but things will need to change drastically between now and then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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