nick76 Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 1 minute ago, TRO said: but this is not a one-off Nick, that is the worrying factor. Dean himself made a similar reference after the Leeds collapse at home....it has happened too many times. How often since? It’s rare and most clubs have it. Horrible to happen and you try to cut it out but will happen once in a while to all but the top few. I put a table up recently of how well we do in the last 15 mins so it is rare to collapse. Obviously he will backlash with the team today and tomorrow in training but we don’t collapse very often since that Leeds defeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 5 minutes ago, nick76 said: Isn’t that the actual definition of a midtable team? Win one, lose one. Doesn’t matter what teams above and below do, if you win one, lose one you are by definition a midtable result type team. It's like saying, beating Liverpool and then losing against Norwich next game is acceptable because we are midtable team. It's not acceptable, our team is better than this, I personally think our squad is on par with West Ham. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 9 minutes ago, nick76 said: Yeah but rarely! But does happen. Our defensive record and clean sheet record last season proves we’ve improved on that but it happens rarely, I guess if we look at other teams they would say the same about themselves, we aren’t unique in that. Everton losing 3-0 to us, wasn’t a 3-0 game, their fans probably felt they imploded for example. Any defeat can be dismissed as a bad day at the office. Games of a similar nature have happened 5 times now in 2021....if thats rare, then so be it.....I think we have it in our make-up to do that. Dean himself referred to " its happened too much and reared its ugly head again " after the Leeds game.....that is not a comment that deems it to be a rare occasion. I don't ever remember collapses under Ron Saunders, defeats yes, not collapses. To me Nick, that comes from mentality, mentality is borne on the training ground. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a m ole Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 22 minutes ago, Indigo said: I really don't think people appreciate the distribution of talent in this league. There's varying degrees but almost every single team has a manager and several players of proven quality worth a lot of money that are capable of hurting any side they play against. The margins are extremely fine, particularly in the general region we're in where there's many teams jostling for position. Yep, and they will all also lose games they should win and let results slip through their fingers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PussEKatt Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 There is another aspect that no one has mentioned yet. We have played 8 games and have 10 points,so after 8 games it looks like we could be relegation candidates ?! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 (edited) Why can we not be on our game more often than not. When we are on our game we beat almost anyone. I rarely see a game where we actually get out played and I don't hear many after games saying we were out played either. We lose games with errors and poor team efforts. Coach this out the team, expect 100% every game, an we may get that European place we all thrive for. Edited October 17, 2021 by foreveryoung Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 4 hours ago, hippo said: Rightly or wrongly the head coach is responsible for results. If poor performance s and results persist he will get the sack. The coach - coaches and organises the players to limit mistakes to the abolosute minimunuim. One of the things they will have worked is closing out a game. As the organiser, motivator, tactician, - the head coach is accountable. Not as a one off - but if it keeps happening the finger will point squarely at the head coach. as you quite rightly say, the buck stops with him. its his job now to say to himself.....you've let me down, and now, I'm going to let you down... Dean has to pick players that are mentally ready for the encounter, not just physically.....judging by yesterday a few were absent in that area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 Just now, foreveryoung said: It's like saying, beating Liverpool and then losing against Norwich next game is acceptable because we are midtable team. It's not acceptable, our team is better than this, I personally think our squad is on par with West Ham. Did I say it was acceptable? I’m just saying with our squad we are midtable team that will against the grain beat a few big teams, will lose to some smaller teams and vice versa and do what they are supposed to do. I’m happy you think our team is on par with West Ham but if I remember correctly most thought we’d end up between 9th and 12th and so far we are performing on par with that. We all want Europe but we might not be good enough, squad wise for that. With injuries and internationals we haven’t had a squad to compensate for that. Luiz going off yesterday caused problems. Bailey injured, Traore and Buendia been injured, Ollie injured and then has been off form in just a small sample of 8 games and yet we were only 10 minutes from being 7th yesterday yet never having played our best team. Unfortunately we collapsed but are still only 2 points from 7th so not all lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MotoMkali Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 1 minute ago, PussEKatt said: There is another aspect that no one has mentioned yet. We have played 8 games and have 10 points,so after 8 games it looks like we could be relegation candidates ?! We've had a fair chunk of injuries tbf. Missing Watkins the first few. Mings for Brentford, missed Luiz against Watford, and Martinez against Chelsea (although those were international fixtures). We've also had Bailey injured, Traore, Trez. Only El ghazi and Buendia have been fit among our wingers. And Buendia missed 2 games due to international duty. That being said whilst we've played Watford and Newcastle. We've also played Chelsea, united, Spurs, Everton and Wolves who should all be top half finishers. Brentford are also in the top half. 6 of our 8 games so far have been against teams in the top half. So we shall ahve a much easier run of games once we have faced West Ham and Arsenal. As it will leave only 3 of 10 in the top half to face and 6 of 9 in the bottom half. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 14 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: It's like saying, beating Liverpool and then losing against Norwich next game is acceptable because we are midtable team. It's not acceptable, our team is better than this, I personally think our squad is on par with West Ham. If football worked like that we'd all make a killing from the bookies. It's a very simplistic take, which ignores the history of football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 9 minutes ago, PussEKatt said: There is another aspect that no one has mentioned yet. We have played 8 games and have 10 points,so after 8 games it looks like we could be relegation candidates ?! No ones mentioned it because that's a ridiculous take on the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 9 minutes ago, TRO said: Any defeat can be dismissed as a bad day at the office. Games of a similar nature have happened 5 times now in 2021....if thats rare, then so be it.....I think we have it in our make-up to do that. Dean himself referred to " its happened too much and reared its ugly head again " after the Leeds game.....that is not a comment that deems it to be a rare occasion. I don't ever remember collapses under Ron Saunders, defeats yes, not collapses. To me Nick, that comes from mentality, mentality is borne on the training ground. Ron Saunders? Jeez you have to go back that far to back up an argument. It’s funny that Dean celebrated 3 years, yet from bottom half of Championship to 55 points last season and Dean is compared to Ron from 40 years ago to make a point. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PussEKatt Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 It does not matter where the teams are placed ( above us or below us ) if we are going to conceed 3 goals in 10 minutes "at home " we are in trouble. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 8 minutes ago, PussEKatt said: There is another aspect that no one has mentioned yet. We have played 8 games and have 10 points,so after 8 games it looks like we could be relegation candidates ?! FFS... Based on what? The bottom 3 currently have 2 points, 3 points and 3 points, we are 7 points off them, we are 2 points off 7th and 5 off 4th The points per game ratio of 10 points from 8 games gets us to 48 points, last year that would have got us 11th, guess where we finished last year? Relegation talk is beyond **** stupid, I know some don't like the phrase being used but it is knicker wetting 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 5 minutes ago, nick76 said: Did I say it was acceptable? I’m just saying with our squad we are midtable team that will against the grain beat a few big teams, will lose to some smaller teams and vice versa and do what they are supposed to do. I’m happy you think our team is on par with West Ham but if I remember correctly most thought we’d end up between 9th and 12th and so far we are performing on par with that. We all want Europe but we might not be good enough, squad wise for that. With injuries and internationals we haven’t had a squad to compensate for that. Luiz going off yesterday caused problems. Bailey injured, Traore and Buendia been injured, Ollie injured and then has been off form in just a small sample of 8 games and yet we were only 10 minutes from being 7th yesterday yet never having played our best team. Unfortunately we collapsed but are still only 2 points from 7th so not all lost. I may be wrong but I doubt West Ham have had the same issues as us over these first few months, if we are similar squad types. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PussEKatt Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 1 minute ago, DCJonah said: No ones mentioned it because that's a ridiculous take on the situation. What is rediculas about 10 points from 8 games ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 Just now, villa4europe said: FFS... Based on what? The bottom 3 currently have 2 points, 3 points and 3 points, we are 7 points off them, we are 2 points off 7th and 5 off 4th The points per game ratio of 10 points from 8 games gets us to 48 points, last year that would have got us 11th, guess where we finished last year? Relegation talk is beyond **** stupid, I know some don't like the phrase being used but it is knicker wetting Haha This is what I mean when I say these over reactions are funny. I get told I have no respect for other points of view but when they're based on absolutely nothing, what is there to respect? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 Just now, PussEKatt said: What is rediculas about 10 points from 8 games ? The idea that we're heading towards a relegation battle because of it. It's been explained much better by someone else above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 1 minute ago, PussEKatt said: What is rediculas about 10 points from 8 games ? 8 teams being worse would be a start... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 6 minutes ago, nick76 said: Did I say it was acceptable? I’m just saying with our squad we are midtable team that will against the grain beat a few big teams, will lose to some smaller teams and vice versa and do what they are supposed to do. I’m happy you think our team is on par with West Ham but if I remember correctly most thought we’d end up between 9th and 12th and so far we are performing on par with that. We all want Europe but we might not be good enough, squad wise for that. With injuries and internationals we haven’t had a squad to compensate for that. Luiz going off yesterday caused problems. Bailey injured, Traore and Buendia been injured, Ollie injured and then has been off form in just a small sample of 8 games and yet we were only 10 minutes from being 7th yesterday yet never having played our best team. Unfortunately we collapsed but are still only 2 points from 7th so not all lost. can you elaborate?....The timing was about right, but why do you think that was? ( not a loaded question),...what was Luiz doing the replacements didn't? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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