Dean Smith

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

2 minutes ago, vreitti said:

What is this ridiculous obsession with Leeds!? 

I told you, in my case, it's petty and childish.

I hate their incessant fans giving it the bigun. They especially love digging at us , any opportunity they get. ( On Social Media)

" Let us score gate " is constantly brought up as well.

[DCJonah]

In our premier league history, we've finished in the top 6, 9 times. We are historically a pretty midtable Premier league team with a few good seasons and a few terrible ones. 

Yet we're on here talking about our best finish in a decade like we've dropped from great heights and that the manager is on thin ice because of it. 

I feel like I'm following a different club at times. Reality doesn't match the garbage posted in this thread. 

[DCJonah]

Just now, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

I told you, in my case, it's petty and childish.

I hate their incessant fans giving it the bigun. They especially love digging at us , any opportunity they get. ( On Social Media)

" Let us score gate " is constantly brought up as well.

Yeah I'm the same. **** hate them. 

But ultimately it doesn't mean much and to be fair they've done well. I'm not convinced we'd have finished below them if Jack had stayed fit. But it is what it is, them doing well doesn't diminish the season we've had.

[vreitti]

3 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

I told you, in my case, it's petty and childish.

I hate their incessant fans giving it the bigun. They especially love digging at us , any opportunity they get. ( On Social Media)

" Let us score gate " is constantly brought up as well.

Okay, I must've missed that bit. Credit to you for the honesty. 

I couldn't care less about Leeds tbh. There are a handful of teams I "somewhat dislike", but only Manure that I really really despise 

[vreitti]

6 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

Yeah I'm the same. **** hate them. 

But ultimately it doesn't mean much and to be fair they've done well. I'm not convinced we'd have finished below them if Jack had stayed fit. But it is what it is, them doing well doesn't diminish the season we've had.

Absolutely, I think they're a great watch for 'neutrals'.

[HKP90]

5 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

I told you, in my case, it's petty and childish.

I hate their incessant fans giving it the bigun. They especially love digging at us , any opportunity they get. ( On Social Media)

" Let us score gate " is constantly brought up as well.

It's scoregate, and Bamford play acting to get AEG sent off for me. 

Not sure I get the 'Leeds fans digging at us' thing, though. Most of the Villa fans also love digging at us every opportunity they get.  

[DCJonah]

Just did the calculation.

Our average Premier league finish is 10th.

We're 11th.

Get a **** grip. It's pathetic. 

In the space of just two full seasons, Dean Smith has taken us from bottom half of the championship and returned us to what we historically usually were in the Premier league. 

And it's not enough. 

Edited May 17, 2021 by DCJonah

[TRO]

16 minutes ago, tinker said:

I can't watch a game like the one against Palace and ignore how poor we were in the second half and for some parts of the 1st. We have issues that need addressing before next season if we are going to consistently improve. 

To.clarify my position on Smith, he has been the best manager we have had since I don't know when, better than MON for me. I don't want him out I want him to succeed  and build a legacy that will last for seasons. 

 

Bravo

I think we all want that.

[TRO]

1 hour ago, DCJonah said:

Just did the calculation.

Our average Premier league finish is 10th.

We're 11th.

Get a **** grip. It's pathetic. 

No one is concerned with our league position, sadly, you are banging the wrong Drum.

Even the podcasters who even eclipse you for perceived positivity, are expressing concerns with our form.

It may be a this season thing and next season will be more of the start and the first 15 games....lets hope so.

Just spare a thought when the Titanic went down during the partying.....some had concerns,(maybe they was deemed as pathetic), some ignored them.....and in a similar way some of us have concerns, despite the league position meeting with expectation.

I am a great believer in a "stitch in time saves nine" don't wait until the momentum disipates and it becomes a demise....We need to snap out of this, but I suspect only new faces will do it.

 

Edited May 17, 2021 by TRO

[DCJonah]

4 minutes ago, TRO said:

No one is concerned with our league position, sadly, you are banging the wrong Drum.

Even the podcasters who even eclipse you for positivity, are expressing concerns with our form.

It may be a this season thing and next season will be more of the start and the first 15 games....lets hope so.

Just spare a thought when the Titanic went down during the partying.....some had concerns,(maybe they was deemed as pathetic), some ignored them.....and in a similar way some of us have concerns, despite the league position meeting with expectation.

I am a great believer in a "stitch in time saves nine" don't wait until the momentum disipates and it becomes a demise....We need to snap out of this, but I suspect only new faces will do it.

 

And it's also been shown that poor form doesn't just carry over season to season. 

So you're just making yourself get worried. Which when you say you're happy with league position, is just odd.

[CVByrne]

3 hours ago, OxfordVillan said:

The 21/22 season will be pivotal for Dean Smith, I think. But then saying that, every season is pivotal for most managers in the Premier League. Most managers, generally, have the opening 8-12 games of the season. If things aren’t going as expected then you’re vulnerable to being replaced. But I do get the feeling that our owners will now feel that we shouldn’t get drawn into any early season scuffles at the lower end of the table, I think we will be expected to be in and amongst the top 8 all season. So we’ll need to start well, very similar to this season.

If we spend over 100m on 3 or 4 players we can't be in lower half of the table after 10/12 games and deem that acceptable. Especially given the form since January this year. 

Lets hope a summer break and new signings pushes us on next season

[Mark Albrighton]

1 hour ago, DCJonah said:

They keep saying it, in the hope he'll finally fail. They should just own it and be honest that they want him gone.

It’s been -

“Smith won’t get us promoted.”

Villa get promoted.

”Smith won’t keep us up.”

Villa stay up.

”Smith won’t move us up the table.”

Villa solidify a midtable position.

 

What will happen is it will reach a point when it’s, say, “Smith can’t get us a champions league spot.” And he doesn’t manage it.

Then it will be “See? I knew I was right about Dean Smith...”

[GENTLEMAN]

2 hours ago, HKP90 said:

Good shout.

His market value is £22.5M, so within our budget, if Juve would sell him. By the sounds of it though they are having some financial issues.

 

2 hours ago, Zatman said:

They just paid that for him in March

Perhaps that ship has sailed. I meant in the sense, that he was heavily linked last summer. So a midfielder of his type was/is being considered. That is to say, it is not lost on the recruitment team (including Smith) what is missing from our midfield. 

[Tumblerseven]

1 minute ago, Mark Albrighton said:

It’s been -

“Smith won’t get us promoted.”

Villa get promoted.

”Smith won’t keep us up.”

Villa stay up.

”Smith won’t move us up the table.”

Villa solidify a midtable position.

 

What will happen is it will reach a point when it’s, say, “Smith can’t get us a champions league spot.” And he doesn’t manage it.

Then it will be “See? I knew I was right about Dean Smith...”

That point is next season. If we spend 100 mil on new players some people expectations next season is minimum europe. 

[vreitti]

7 minutes ago, TRO said:

Just spare a thought when the Titanic went down during the partying.....some had concerns,(maybe they was deemed as pathetic), some ignored them.....and in a similar way some of us have concerns, despite the league position meeting with expectation.

I think that's just fine. Most of us have concerns... for instance I'm not at all pleased with how Smith has used the squad, and think we're paying the price of that now. I suspect the likes of Hourihane and Guilbert felt the same. 

BUT you cannot honestly say some on here are simply 'raising concerns'.  This thread is flooded with evidence to the contrary. There are countless, daily digs at the manager, from every possible angle imaginable, one more absurd than the other. It's simply mindboggling, considering the truly amazing progress we've made with Dean at the helm.

[blandy]

26 minutes ago, TRO said:

concerns with our form

Indeed. On the form thing what interests me, or at least my amateur analysis is, is that things like squad strength combined with the number of games in a short time, plus injuries and loss of form mean that this season we're in no position to avoid drops in team form. Never mind whether we have the world's best manager or worst manager , there's no way anything other than what happened would happen in terms of the drop off. This isn't (IMO) on the manager. A better manager might have done better, who can say - it's pure speculation. Many might have done worse (also pure speculation).

So to me, the concentration and focus on the manager is kind of misplaced. There doesn't seem to be much understanding of what's going on - I don't mean around individual games or players performances within games, but the wider picture. To me it seems like some posters think there's a magic wand or something that Dean Smith could use but isn't, or he doesn't know how to use it.

For me, I think I've seen plenty that says he definitely does know what he's doing, is an excellent coach, adapts tactics to different opposition before games, adapts things during games, but equally doesn't have the things at his disposal to make us a top 8 side, quite just yet. One of those missing things is experience in the Premier league and experience of playing multiple times against the very best sides (or any of the sides). It's fine to criticise or take a view on different aspects of course, but some of it seems to lack a bit of context (I'm not talking about your post, here, btw).

[TRO]

1 hour ago, DCJonah said:

And it's also been shown that poor form doesn't just carry over season to season. 

So you're just making yourself get worried. Which when you say you're happy with league position, is just odd.

Yeah, I get that....and we all have varying levels of concern, in line with our personalities.....but I glean that from watching the play in the first half yesterday, we had a possession rating of 71%, I know possession is not everything, but we have the ball, they don't so they can't hurt us.

I find it odd, to say its odd to differentiate between form and league table position.....why do the Data boys, create form tables, if they think its meaningless.......The table goes back to include the likes of September, its a world away, in Football.....it is in the pandemic too.

I guess without looking, form can carry over just as easily either way....but I accept your point.

Edited May 17, 2021 by TRO

[Mark Albrighton]

4 minutes ago, Tumblerseven said:

That point is next season. If we spend 100 mil on new players some people expectations next season is minimum europe. 

For some, yeah it will be. Judging by a couple of posts I’ve read over the past 24 hours, I think there’s one or two who think europa qualification should be ours now, this season.

It will reach a crunch point for me at some point, it always will. Can we finish 6th? Then can we finish 4th etc etc. The next step for me is trying finish in the top 8, how close can Villa get to that next year. Then go from there regarding decisions. This is for the expectations thread really.

But I’m struggling with this hypothetical bad start to next season people seem to have decided is definitely going to happen. The talk of momentum is all well and good, but there’s an international tournament taking place and there’s a short break, plus new signings to lift all concerned. For me, any momentum, good or bad is likely to be dissipated.
 

[TRO]

21 minutes ago, blandy said:

Indeed. On the form thing what interests me, or at least my amateur analysis is, is that things like squad strength combined with the number of games in a short time, plus injuries and loss of form mean that this season we're in no position to avoid drops in team form. Never mind whether we have the world's best manager or worst manager , there's no way anything other than what happened would happen in terms of the drop off. This isn't (IMO) on the manager. A better manager might have done better, who can say - it's pure speculation. Many might have done worse (also pure speculation).

So to me, the concentration and focus on the manager is kind of misplaced. There doesn't seem to be much understanding of what's going on - I don't mean around individual games or players performances within games, but the wider picture. To me it seems like some posters think there's a magic wand or something that Dean Smith could use but isn't, or he doesn't know how to use it.

For me, I think I've seen plenty that says he definitely does know what he's doing, is an excellent coach, adapts tactics to different opposition before games, adapts things during games, but equally doesn't have the things at his disposal to make us a top 8 side, quite just yet. One of those missing things is experience in the Premier league and experience of playing multiple times against the very best sides (or any of the sides). It's fine to criticise or take a view on different aspects of course, but some of it seems to lack a bit of context (I'm not talking about your post, here, btw).

I get that Pete, but without going in to reams of text, a different view has enough credence to be raised.

I think our Game on Sunday, had enough in it, to raise concerns of the most partisan fans and indeed the podcasters who have a vested interest in painting a picture, were expressing concerns.

We had a 71% Possession  stat at one stage during that game and we were controlling it, albeit they were inviting the space, we so crave to play in....the second half, they denied us that valuable space and the rest is History....They recovered the Initiative and we surrendered it, it is certainly not the first time, this has been on show.....if it was we would all be less concerned and take it as a one off, but its not, its now a trait.

The owners in their wisdom, with their unimaginable support of our club, will have the Nous to know who we go in to the New Season with in charge......I will be surprised and disappointed if Dean goes, but I genuinely believe questions like " why have we dropped 19 points from winning positions will be raised....If Dean says " He is not bothered" with the question as he did on Sky...He might face a few more.

Its their call Pete.....If he is still with us when the season starts, I will be pleased for him.....I trust the Owners. They have put their money, where past owners have only put their mouths, in comparison of course.

 

Edited May 17, 2021 by TRO

[blandy]

14 minutes ago, TRO said:

We had a 71% Possession  stat at one stage during that game and we were controlling it, albeit they were inviting the space, we so crave to play in....the second half, they denied us that valuable space and the rest is History....They recovered the Initiative and we surrendered it, it is certainly not the first time, this has been on show.....if it was we would all be less concerned and take it as a one off, but its not, its now a trait.

Palace played Tuesday - Sunday. Villa played Thursday-Sunday. That's not the whole picture, but 2 days extra recovery time for Palace is significant and may explain or partly explain why Villa looked tired second half.

The thing about this "trait" is it's a bit subjective. I mean we've been good at grabbing points late on in games, too. I'm not saying that yesterday's second half drop off was anything but a disappointment. But like I said in the earlier post, I don't put ti down to the manager.

If he's not here at the start of next season I'll be absolutely amazed. He's done great in my book, notwithstanding the recent poor form.