Dean Smith

[DCJonah]

28 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Then thats the fault of smith. If elmo isn't good enough then why not show some faith in kesler? Didnt even make the benxh but instead we have taylor on there who isnt even going to be here next season.

We have nothing to play for. I dont see the harm in giving kesler some game time against palace. 

How many times does it need to be said? The club have said that the priority is to win the FA youth Cup this season. You might not agree with it, but that's the decision the club (not smith) have made as part of the development of these talented kids. 

It's really not a difficult concept. 

[Demitri_C]

Just now, DCJonah said:

How many times does it need to be said? The club have said that the priority is to win the FA youth Cup this season. You might not agree with it, but that's the decision the club (not smith) have made as part of the development of these talented kids. 

It's really not a difficult concept. 

No harm giving them 10 minutes run out

But silly to loan hourihane out then if we dont have enough senior players to name on the bench.

[Demitri_C]

7 minutes ago, peterw said:

maybe because he doesn't think kessler would be able to stand up to someone like Zaha given that one is a highly rated premier league footballer and the other someone that has not played first team football.

This is in the same vein as your Chukwuemeka argument. It may have some validity and why not throw him in against Spurs? Maybe not if Son id playing? Chelsea? Maybe they'd be a better option given they're likely to rest players ahead of the CL final.

If that is smiths attitude (although i accept this is speculation) then really he has no faith in the youth.

Sometimes you have to throw them in deep when you get injuries etc.

Kelser looked great against liverpool i think he would have relished it 

[DCJonah]

5 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

No harm giving them 10 minutes run out

But silly to loan hourihane out then if we dont have enough senior players to name on the bench.

You just said that Kessler should have started. 

And there is harm if they injure themselves when they've already picked what the priority is for them.

[peterw]

23 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

If that is smiths attitude (although i accept this is speculation) then really he has no faith in the youth.

Sometimes you have to throw them in deep when you get injuries etc.

Kelser looked great against liverpool i think he would have relished it 

Hard to say that he has no faith in youth given that ramsey is playing and throughout the season they have made the bench every now and then. the biggest sign that he has faith in youth is how many are training with the first team squad. that is their first exposure to first team football long before making a matchday squad or being named in the 'starting' squad.

 

Bottom line is - if they're good enough they'll get their chance.

[Demitri_C]

32 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

You just said that Kessler should have started. 

And there is harm if they injure themselves when they've already picked what the priority is for them.

Started/given 10-15 minutes whatever.

And that was before you said they were prioritising the youth cup. I wasnt aware of them saying that 

[VillaFaninLondon]

8 hours ago, VillaChris said:

I think we'll be o.k start of next season. Depends on fixture list (remember we were supposed to play Man. City away first game so having that postponed and starting with Sheffield United and Fulham was a massive help) but crowds of 20k + hopefully in which the players will enjoy and we will have a lift from 2-3 signings that can hopefully come straight into the team or at least make the bench more competitive.

I'm not too concerned with the start, just got to do enough to keep in touch with those above. It's not like West Ham were that high going into November for instance.

Key for us to break cycle of last 20 years is not to fall away from February onwards as that's been a massive mental problem. We dip while those around us get into their stride. Simply means more credible first team options and far more rotation even during games e.g. McGinn being subbed, sometimes the full backs being rested, Ollie having a breather for the odd game etc.

I reckon we might have learnt from this season a bit and will be fairly active in January 2022 window aswell.

Key will be the summer transfer window. So far I've not been that inspired by (albeit tenuous) links to the likes of McNeil and Pereira who I just don't see taking us to the next level and pushing us into the top 8. 

 

I've seen a few fans namecheck players like Fekir and Bailey - if Smith was being honest about fans being excited by the names on our shortlist you would hope it would be players like those two. If you put two players of that calibre in this Villa team with Jack and Ollie alongside them we would be a hell of a threat.

 

But convincing players of that quality to come here is the real challenge and the owners and management have to have the gall to go after players like that and sell them their vision. If they really want to be in Europe within a year or 2 those are the type of players they have to go after.

[peterw]

How excited would you have been if Smith had said at the same time last year that he was brining in a forest midfielder to play at right-back, and Arsenal reserve keeper, and someone playing in france who failed the last time he was in the Prem league?

[CVByrne]

9 points from last 10 games is second worst in the League. With Spurs and Chelsea to end the season it'll be 2nd worst final third of the season. The worry is this bad form is carried into next season, we see it all the time. We saw it with us at the beginning of this season and most famously with Leicester. 

On paper 11th is par for the course, that was the target and we achieved it, unfortunately in the wrong way around with a very strong start and then the terrible finish. If we lose the last two games that means when you take out our 4 game winning start to the season we've been in form that would have us 16/17th with an average of 1.08pts per game over the last 34 games. It's a shocking level of form. We've had that 6 months of good form over the past two seasons and been pretty much terrible other than that.

Dean Smith is an average manager. He's had huge investment in terms of player signings and has done just enough in terms of results to keep his job. Last season was survival, this season was 12th. Both times he managed just enough. 

The main worry now is if we start next season bad and we are down in bottom 5/6 after 10 or 12 games. The damage done there is twofold, we replace Dean Smith and we likely lose Jack Grealish next summer as we've gone backwards. Lets hope we make the right signings, we start next season well and Dean proves my fears unfounded.

[peterw]

First season - wins 10 games on the bounce and gets us promoted. just enough?

Second season - survive (unlike the majority of sides that have gone up through the play offs in recent years) and reach a  major Cup final? just enough?

third season - midtable and played some of the best football from a Villa team for many a year? Just enough?

 

Blimey, tough crowd.

[VillaFaninLondon]

35 minutes ago, peterw said:

How excited would you have been if Smith had said at the same time last year that he was brining in a forest midfielder to play at right-back, and Arsenal reserve keeper, and someone playing in france who failed the last time he was in the Prem league?

That's it, I had mixed feelings about our signings last summer. 

 

I actually thought Barkley was the best bit of business and he's turned out to be the worst of the lot (after starting so well). Didn't rate the Cash signing at the time, thought we spent too much on Ollie, and didn't know what to expect from Traore and was sceptical as his last season at Lyon was poor. I rated the Martinez signing because I'd seen how he performed in the FA Cup Final and a few league games for Arse and it was clear he was a top quality GK - how he sat on Arse's bench for so long God only knows.

 

But last season we finished 17th. This season we will most probably finish 11th. Targets will therefore be more ambitious.

 

The reason we've gone backwards in the 2nd half of this season is because we've lacked quality going forward - that's as much to do with inconsistency of Traore as it is the lack of creativity without Jack in the team that Barkley was supposed to bring with him. That's 2 players signed last season who haven't performed consistently when we've needed them to. 

 

Ollie and Emi have been 2 great signings but we've been very reliant on them without offering, in Ollie's case, enough creativity and in Emi's case enough protection at times (giving 23 shots to Palace, for example, though I agree that mings and Cash being out made us more vulnerable). 

 

The back 5 is fine and solid enough when everyone's fit (though our form after going in front since January is alarming), but our options when they are injured or suspended are not good enough. Cash has been reliable most of the season but hasn't been as good since coming back from injury and has been the most vulnerable of all our defenders this season - though that is also down to Traore not doing his defensive duties. 

 

But our main issues lie in midfield and I want to see at least one creative, marquee player come in this summer to take the pressure off Jack. And I've said it many times before but we also need someone with pace because we're not quick enough in the transition. I also want to see another player in the number 6 role as both McGinn and Luiz aren't good enough defensively.

 

Hopefully we'll see the likes of McGinn, Luiz and Traore all rotated next season and not starting every game because we've seen they're not reliable enough to be first choice for a team with European aspirations.

[hippo]

1 hour ago, Demitri_C said:

If that is smiths attitude (although i accept this is speculation) then really he has no faith in the youth.

Sometimes you have to throw them in deep when you get injuries etc.

Kelser looked great against liverpool i think he would have relished it 

He didn't look great against WBA though.

I think we might be getting a little carried away with our youth prospects.

I remember when we won the youth cup a few years back - none of the players became first team regulars

[CVByrne]

Second season we were relegated if it wasn't for Covid. So in a normal season he's lost his job and we're in the Championship. First season was great, we had the new manager bounce and we won a penalty shootout against West Brom and we were promoted then after winning the final. We had the bounce of staying up fresh in our step when we started this season well. It's the falloff of form, like to relegation levels which is the most worrying. Hopefully it's just players being burnt out due to the games and in need of a rest, lack of depth to provide good alternatives and Dean impresses us all next season. But overall in his 2 years in the Prem he's been ok at best especially given 260m in player investment he's had.

[peterw]

11 minutes ago, CVByrne said:

Second season we were relegated if it wasn't for Covid. So in a normal season he's lost his job and we're in the Championship. First season was great, we had the new manager bounce and we won a penalty shootout against West Brom and we were promoted then after winning the final. We had the bounce of staying up fresh in our step when we started this season well. It's the falloff of form, like to relegation levels which is the most worrying. Hopefully it's just players being burnt out due to the games and in need of a rest, lack of depth to provide good alternatives and Dean impresses us all next season. But overall in his 2 years in the Prem he's been ok at best especially given 260m in player investment he's had.

new manager bounce? The lasted a little then we had a slump. Then when the slump returned after being sidelined with injury we won 10 on the bounce. because of one great player and some good coaching we;ve been able to mould a team that is getting better slowly but surely. 

[Dave-R]

2 hours ago, Demitri_C said:

Then thats the fault of smith. If elmo isn't good enough then why not show some faith in kesler? Didnt even make the benxh but instead we have taylor on there who isnt even going to be here next season.

We have nothing to play for. I dont see the harm in giving kesler some game time against palace. 

Agree with you these last few games is a reason to give youth a good bit of love and let them have at it. It's an opportunity to see what they are made of and that opportunity has slipped away all for trying to win these games we never had heart in winning all because the season has gone for us.

 

[OxfordVillan]

The 21/22 season will be pivotal for Dean Smith, I think. But then saying that, every season is pivotal for most managers in the Premier League. Most managers, generally, have the opening 8-12 games of the season. If things aren’t going as expected then you’re vulnerable to being replaced. But I do get the feeling that our owners will now feel that we shouldn’t get drawn into any early season scuffles at the lower end of the table, I think we will be expected to be in and amongst the top 8 all season. So we’ll need to start well, very similar to this season.

[Dave-R]

2 minutes ago, OxfordVillan said:

The 21/22 season will be pivotal for Dean Smith, I think. But then saying that, every season is pivotal for most managers in the Premier League. Most managers, generally, have the opening 8-12 games of the season. If things aren’t going as expected then you’re vulnerable to being replaced. But I do get the feeling that our owners will now feel that we shouldn’t get drawn into any early season scuffles at the lower end of the table, I think we will be expected to be in and amongst the top 8 all season. So we’ll need to start well, very similar to this season.

If they expect to be amongst the top 8 all season then they need to put the money up..

[vreitti]

11 minutes ago, Dave-R said:

If they expect to be amongst the top 8 all season then they need to put the money up..

There are no guarantees in this league. Just look at Everton, Spurs and even Chelsea.

[OxfordVillan]

9 minutes ago, Dave-R said:

If they expect to be amongst the top 8 all season then they need to put the money up..

They’ve put the money up thus far. All the noises being made indicate they’ll put the money up again this summer. And when they do they will not expect a return of points/form that we have seen over the last few months, which is bottom 3 type of form. And that’s fair enough. 

[Dave-R]

1 minute ago, vreitti said:

There are no guarantees in this league. Just look at Everton, Spurs and even Chelsea.

Oh I know there's no guarantees it was in response to Oxford saying the Owners may want the team to be in or around 8th all season long. 

If you want the best kind of guarantee the. Your going to have to spend wisely and as much as you possibly can.

As it stands I think our squad is a lower mistake to relegation scenario next season's but with some decent spending we could maybe do what we did this season or better. I'm not holding my hopes up for a good season like this season again, I didn't expect it and certainly don't unless some coinage is tossed the three amigos way.