DaveAV1 Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 27 minutes ago, DCJonah said: This all day. Of course he will make mistakes. And for me, if the majority of things are good, why focus on a mistake? Same with players. If in general they're playing well, why focus on the odd mistake because as you say they all make them. The unbelievable thing about the moaning last night, is that you can't even say its a mistake. Its just that something didn't happen that a few people wanted to happen. Imagine the arrogance and delusion, you have to have to moan in that situation. Dean Smith is experienced, with experienced coaches next to him. You'd think after a club record run of wins, premier league survival and a huge improvement in all areas, they'd get a little bit of trust. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozvilla28 Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 Wasn't sold on Smith last year in Premier League , but can't fault him this year have to back him credit goes to him and his coaching group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulberto21 Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 1 hour ago, Avcol said: Already failed against Burnley so impossible to beat every team at least once. Unless I'm missing a joke here. From now and until the end of the season. So the teams we haven't beaten I think we will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 (edited) 15 minutes ago, DCJonah said: And what proof is there that not making subs caused that? Again arrogance and delusion. They scored a cross and a header. I guess trezeguet would have stopped both of that. Since you bring it up, one of those goals (whether it was the second or third) happened because Traore didn't track back. So yes, Trez most likely would have stopped that one. I was slightly confused about the lack of subs last night. Seemed the obvious move, but that's the benefit of being a leader when you're winning or getting the results required. You're immune to criticism at that point, as maybe your choices actually caused the desired result. Personally I wouldn't have brought on Sanson early, but I'd probably have changed up that midfield on several occations, by subbing Traore, Barkley and McGinn. It was so flat. Edited January 31, 2021 by KenjiOgiwara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 15 minutes ago, sne said: Yeah, nobody was claiming any of that. You haven't read this thread properly then. And you said, it was right to moan last night because people didn't want what happened at Burnley to happen again. Is that not saying they know best? Or that subs would have stopped us losing at Burnley? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 7 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: Since you bring it up, one of those goals (whether it was the second or third) happened because Traore didn't track back. So yes, Trez most likely would have stopped that one. I was slightly confused about the lack of subs last night. Seemed the obvious move, but that's the benefit of being a leader when you're winning or getting the results required. You're immune to criticism at that point, as maybe your choices actually caused the desired result. Personally I wouldn't have brought on Sanson early, but I'd probably have changed up that midfield on several occations, by subbing Traore, Barkley and McGinn. It was so flat. Trez has never allowed a cross? I mean its this kind of rubbish that gets to me. People talk like their hypothetical situation will be true. Let's say Trez stops a cross, what's to say that Burnley don't score from him giving the ball away with a poor touch? There are so many variable, to just say making that sub would have stopped us conceding a goal is madness IMO. Maybe it would, maybe it wouldn't. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mjvilla Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 I think we have to remember our record when scoring the first goal this season when criticising Smith's (lack of) subs... 10 games: 9 wins. 1 defeat. He's obviously doing something right when we take a lead... Without stats, I think he makes more subs when we are behind? I might be wrong, that's how it feels. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 3 minutes ago, DCJonah said: You haven't read this thread properly then. And you said, it was right to moan last night because people didn't want what happened at Burnley to happen again. Is that not saying they know best? Or that subs would have stopped us losing at Burnley? Simply put no, and it certainly doesn't equate that people are claiming it would 100% have changed what happened like you claim they are saying. But we are done here. Amazing being this aggressive this early the day after a win. UTV and so on buddy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 Just now, sne said: Simply put no, and it certainly doesn't equate that people are claiming it would 100% have changed what happened like you claim they are saying. But we are done here. Amazing being this aggressive this early the day after a win. UTV and so on buddy. Probably something to do with having to defend the manager after our 10th win, putting is into 8th place. This thread was a joke last night. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 2 minutes ago, Mjvilla said: I think we have to remember our record when scoring the first goal this season when criticising Smith's (lack of) subs... 10 games: 9 wins. 1 defeat. He's obviously doing something right when we take a lead... Without stats, I think he makes more subs when we are behind? I might be wrong, that's how it feels. All the evidence points to the fact that his in game management is actually a major strength. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo_b Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 10 minutes ago, DCJonah said: All the evidence points to the fact that his in game management is actually a major strength. Yep agree, managed last night superbly against a very good Southampton side. Credit to Dean Smith and coaching team on a good battling win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 15 minutes ago, DCJonah said: Trez has never allowed a cross? No but I didn’t say that did I? Strawmen aren't needed here. Fact is simply that Trez has a phenomenal work rate and has looked great defensively this season. So by coming on for Traore at that point hf most likely would have covered that defensive run and thus the goal wouldn't have happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mjvilla Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 9 hours ago, MotoMkali said: We'd be 5th on goal difference if he made a sub before we conceded the 2nd against Burnley. 32 minutes ago, sne said: Yeah, nobody was claiming any of that. I actually think it was claimed, in fairness to @DCJonah. I personally think that DC isn't the person to be criticising for his overreaction. The overreaction to no subs last night is what should be criticised, after we had won a game. I read a few things which made me think 'wow, really' but someone (and I can't even remember who) called Smith a 'muppet' in the post match thread. Someone else would've given him a -50 out of 10. Someone else was 'deeply concerned' for our future. This, after 3 points and taking us to 8th with a game in hand. UTV and all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 1 minute ago, Mjvilla said: I actually think it was claimed, in fairness to @DCJonah. I personally think that DC isn't the person to be criticising for his overreaction. The overreaction to no subs last night is what should be criticised, after we had won a game. I read a few things which made me think 'wow, really' but someone (and I can't even remember who) called Smith a 'muppet' in the post match thread. Someone else would've given him a -50 out of 10. Someone else was 'deeply concerned' for our future. This, after 3 points and taking us to 8th with a game in hand. UTV and all that. I really hope that person was really drunk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holteend1982 Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 9 hours ago, av1 said: Well yes. You can't have a pop at the manager because we won a game on a tight VAR call without acknowledging that without right VAR calls we'd be in the top 4 You can't have it both ways simply because it suits your narrative What narrative? I felt he needed to make a sub against Southampton, that's it. It's really not that deep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 6 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: No but I didn’t say that did I? Strawmen aren't needed here. Fact is simply that Trez has a phenomenal work rate and has looked great defensively this season. So by coming on for Traore at that point hf most likely would have covered that defensive run and thus the goal wouldn't have happened. I just can't wrap my head around this thinking. How can you claim that your hypothetical situation is the most likely outcome? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 8 minutes ago, Mjvilla said: I actually think it was claimed, in fairness to @DCJonah. I personally think that DC isn't the person to be criticising for his overreaction. The overreaction to no subs last night is what should be criticised, after we had won a game. I read a few things which made me think 'wow, really' but someone (and I can't even remember who) called Smith a 'muppet' in the post match thread. Someone else would've given him a -50 out of 10. Someone else was 'deeply concerned' for our future. This, after 3 points and taking us to 8th with a game in hand. UTV and all that. The fact that defending a managers decisions that led to our 10th win and into 8th place, could even be considered overreacting, shows the state of this thread last night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenjiOgiwara Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, DCJonah said: I just can't wrap my head around this thinking. How can you claim that your hypothetical situation is the most likely outcome? Can't help you then. Anyway, edited this. Didn't want to sound snarky. It's okay to disagree. Edited January 31, 2021 by KenjiOgiwara Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 21 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said: No but I didn’t say that did I? Strawmen aren't needed here. Fact is simply that Trez has a phenomenal work rate and has looked great defensively this season. So by coming on for Traore at that point hf most likely would have covered that defensive run and thus the goal wouldn't have happened. He also had covid, and might not be the same Trez that would have maniacally tracked every run. There are probably a lot of factors we're not privy to. Unless Dean said he wasn't worried about our right hand side and didn't need to change anything there then I'm not sure how much there is for us to say without being presumptuous. Maybe bringing on Trez would have prevented the goal, maybe bringing on Trez while ahead or level would have caused even more harm than we realized, we don't know. Personally speaking, I'd defer to the manager's decision while he's still doing a fantastic job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avcol Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 58 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said: From now and until the end of the season. So the teams we haven't beaten I think we will. Love your optimism, if we manage to do that we will finish in a very high position. Need to ride our luck with injuries and rotate the midfield more than we currently are. I do worry about us burning out as we saw in the O'Neill years when he kept a mostly settled 11 and it seemed to go wrong every March. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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