John McGinn

[bobzy]

9 hours ago, Sulberto21 said:

What a load of nonsense. He’s had poor games too you know. He was brilliant tonight but he’s had shit games too.

When he doesn’t try the Hollywood ball every single time he has games like tonight. In other games he’s been down at 66% possession retention. What benefit is that to us? 

If he’s been performing like tonight in most games your comment is justified but taking the mick because of one good game shows you’re just a McGinn fanboy who when he plays poorly still praises him. 

People keep trotting out this **** garbage, but having a 66% pass completion is because McGinn is the only player in our squad who tries to unlock the defence with ambitious passes - for example, the ball to Buendia for his goal.  Most of the time these won't come off, but when they do it's a massive chance for us.

He does the most tackling, he does the most creating and people want him gone because he doesn't play simple passes backwards or sidewards.  **** hell.

[Sulberto21]

8 hours ago, GingerCollins29 said:

Absolute rubbish!

Yes he has been in some games.

[Sulberto21]

17 minutes ago, bobzy said:

People keep trotting out this **** garbage, but having a 66% pass completion is because McGinn is the only player in our squad who tries to unlock the defence with ambitious passes - for example, the ball to Buendia for his goal.  Most of the time these won't come off, but when they do it's a massive chance for us.

He does the most tackling, he does the most creating and people want him gone because he doesn't play simple passes backwards or sidewards.  **** hell.

Giving the ball away with aimless long balls is rubbish. When he plays well he’s up at 75% + . Which is much more beneficial to us. It’s not a difficult concept to understand. 66% completion is rubbish. He’s proven he can operate at 85%+ and create chances. Again not a hard concept to understand. Yesterday he was at 84% with 3 key passes , Dougie was at 92% with 3 key passes, Buendia was at 90% with 4 key passes. All very very very good. 

and for the record these side to side passes every McGinn fanboy seems to dislike how the eff do you think Liverscum and Man City keep the ball ?  Not every pass has to be an aimless long ball. McGinn has proven in many many games he can be high retention with high creation. 

I know his arse is big maybe you and a few other fanboys should get it out of there. 

Edited May 20, 2022 by Sulberto21

[bobzy]

2 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said:

Giving the ball away with aimless long balls is rubbish. When he plays well he’s up at 75% + . Which is much more beneficial to us. It’s not a difficult concept to understand. 66% completion is rubbish. He’s proven he can operate at 85%+ and create chances. Again not a hard concept to understand. 

I know his arse is big maybe you and a few other fanboys should get it out of there. 

Apparently his pass completion this season sits at 75.4% - exactly the same as Bruno Fernandes and 0.3% behind Kevin De Bruyne.  Other (good) players who are losing the ball more often because they're playing risky passes.  His "aimless long balls" are completed 59.3% of the time, compared to Fernandes 54% or De Bruyne 53.5%.  For progressive passes (which fbref counts as "completed passes which move the ball towards the opponents' goal by at least 10 yards"), McGinn is 13th in the entire league - again, for comparison Fernandes is 4th and De Bruyne is 19th.

But yeah pal, **** the stats - I'm just a "fanboy". 

[Sulberto21]

1 minute ago, bobzy said:

Apparently his pass completion this season sits at 75.4% - exactly the same as Bruno Fernandes and 0.3% behind Kevin De Bruyne.  Other (good) players who are losing the ball more often because they're playing risky passes.  His "aimless long balls" are completed 59.3% of the time, compared to Fernandes 54% or De Bruyne 53.5%.  For progressive passes (which fbref counts as "completed passes which move the ball towards the opponents' goal by at least 10 yards"), McGinn is 13th in the entire league - again, for comparison Fernandes is 4th and De Bruyne is 19th.

But yeah pal, **** the stats - I'm just a "fanboy". 

Checks my own post again “when he plays well he’s up at 75% + completion “ .

He’s dropped below that in about 7/8 games since Gerrard has come in. He’s a senior pro at the club he needs to be more consistent for the benefit of Aston Villa.

In Gerrard’s first 5/6 games he was up at 88% completion but still with 3/4 key passes a game - not sustainable but he can do it. 75% is the minimum he should be aiming for. He does it by being more selective with his creating passes.

I don’t think he should be sold but he’s got to be more consistent and take more care.

I have also said he’s the best crosser from open play along with digne. 

[Zhan_Zhuang]

8 hours ago, GingerCollins29 said:

Absolutely clueless

It's a forum, deal with it...

Many others agree, he's inconsistent...

[bobzy]

7 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said:

Checks my own post again “when he plays well he’s up at 75% + completion “ .

He’s dropped below that in about 7/8 games since Gerrard has come in. He’s a senior pro at the club he needs to be more consistent for the benefit of Aston Villa.

In Gerrard’s first 5/6 games he was up at 88% completion but still with 3/4 key passes a game - not sustainable but he can do it. 75% is the minimum he should be aiming for. He does it by being more selective with his creating passes.

I don’t think he should be sold but he’s got to be more consistent and take more care.

I have also said he’s the best crosser from open play along with digne. 

It's almost like players fluctuate in form.  Crazy world, eh?

This consistency thing is becoming as infuriating as people referring to pass completion as well.  If he was consistently, week-in, week-out, pulling the top stats that he's averaging over the season in any case (creating the most in our squad, tackling the most, progressing, dribbling etc) he'd be absolutely nowhere near Aston Villa and probably in the running for Ballon D'or.

[Mic09]

Every few games he makes costly mistakes.

He likes to turn with the ball which is great, but can backfire. 

Sometimes his passing is off.

If he could improve those mistakes even by 30%/40%, he would be a top 6 player.

He is very good. 

[CVByrne]

McGinn is an attacking player who's had to do some more defensive roles this season in helping Luiz out. IF you look at McGinns stats he is one of the best players in the top 5 leagues at shot creating actions, expected assists, goals etc.. he's very good going forward. He's also very good with his long passes and their accuracy. Look at his assist yesterday. 

He does have poor short pass accuracy and rarely attempts them relative to other central midfielders. It's an issue when we are using him deeper to build play. 

[Zhan_Zhuang]

16 minutes ago, bobzy said:

Apparently his pass completion this season sits at 75.4% - exactly the same as Bruno Fernandes and 0.3% behind Kevin De Bruyne.  Other (good) players who are losing the ball more often because they're playing risky passes.  His "aimless long balls" are completed 59.3% of the time, compared to Fernandes 54% or De Bruyne 53.5%.  For progressive passes (which fbref counts as "completed passes which move the ball towards the opponents' goal by at least 10 yards"), McGinn is 13th in the entire league - again, for comparison Fernandes is 4th and De Bruyne is 19th.

But yeah pal, **** the stats - I'm just a "fanboy". 

Those stats are fairly skewed though and we have to judge each player individually.

De Bruyne and Man City are dominating the  possession of almost every single match.

Villa on the other hand aren't so passes are noticed when they go missing and it is crucial we don't turn over the ball. Yes McGinn tries to unlock the opposition defence but often he will give the ball away cheaply and put us under pressure. Because we don't dominate matches this faux pas is seen as dangerous and wasteful.

I like him, I really do but there are always better players out there.

 

[CVByrne]

McGinn is a bizzare one where it seems everyone outside Villa fans laud him and think he is brilliant. As do his two managers Smith and Gerrard. Whoscored have him by far our best player this season in ratings too. 

[Steero113]

36 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said:

And for the record these side to side passes every McGinn fanboy seems to dislike how the eff do you think Liverscum and Man City keep the ball ?  Not every pass has to be an aimless long ball. McGinn has proven in many many games he can be high retention with high creation. 

I know his arse is big maybe you and a few other fanboys should get it out of there. 

What an absolute crock of s**t this is. (in my opinion of course )

How do you think Liverscum and Man City create chances? By passing side to side into the goal?

They aren't aimless long balls... they are attempts at unlocking defences. He's basically the only player in the team who tries them.

Edited May 20, 2022 by Steero113

[duke313]

5 minutes ago, Steero113 said:

What an absolute crock of s**t this is.

How do you think Liverscum and Man City create chances? By passing side to side into the goal?

They aren't aimless long balls... they are attempts at unlocking defences. He's basically the only player in the team who tries them.

The difference is Man City and Liverpools' long balls are accurate.

[Steero113]

3 minutes ago, duke313 said:

The difference is Man City and Liverpools' long balls are accurate.

They're not though, KBD, Cancelo, Gundogan etc. have almost identical long pass completion rates as McGinn. 

This is just a total fabrication from the fanbase who expect McGinn to be prime Pirlo for some reason. 

The difference is that those teams do it more often and when they land they have world class attackers who bury the chances. 

Edited May 20, 2022 by Steero113

[bobzy]

16 minutes ago, Zhan_Zhuang said:

Those stats are fairly skewed though and we have to judge each player individually.

De Bruyne and Man City are dominating the  possession of almost every single match.

Villa on the other hand aren't so passes are noticed when they go missing and it is crucial we don't turn over the ball. Yes McGinn tries to unlock the opposition defence but often he will give the ball away cheaply and put us under pressure. Because we don't dominate matches this faux pas is seen as dangerous and wasteful.

I like him, I really do but there are always better players out there.

They're aren't skewed though - if anything, it makes McGinn out to be even better because Fernandes/De Bruyne will (likely) be able to play those forward passes with more regularity and in more space.

He does sometimes lose the ball - of course he does.  Every player does.  But the pros to his game are just so much more than those cons.

[bobzy]

16 minutes ago, CVByrne said:

McGinn is a bizzare one where it seems everyone outside Villa fans laud him and think he is brilliant. As do his two managers Smith and Gerrard. Whoscored have him by far our best player this season in ratings too. 

People just like to attach a certain level of blame to players and find it hard to shift from that position.  The same thing happened with Ashley Westwood.  He could've done absolutely anything in a game, but would always be lauded as shit (ironically whilst having a good pass completion % and keeping the ball - lol how times change lol).

McGinn and Watkins are the current two, for whatever reason.

[Zhan_Zhuang]

3 minutes ago, Steero113 said:

They're not though, KBD, Cancelo, Gundogan etc. have almost identical long pass completion rates as McGinn. 

This is just a total fabrication from the fanbase who expect McGinn to be prime Pirlo for some reason. 

The difference is that those teams do it more often and when they land they have world class attackers who bury the chances. 

They also dominate possession whereas when Villa don't and when McGinn tries it the passes often lead to a quick turnaround and put us under pressure. 

[duke313]

1 minute ago, Steero113 said:

They're not though, KBD, Cancelo, Gundogan etc. have almost identical long pass completion rates as McGinn. 

This is just a total fabrication from the fanbase who expect McGinn to be prime Pirlo for some reason. 

They are though, Man City have a long ball completion percentage of 74% and Liverpools' is 68%, ours by comparison is 55%

[Steero113]

1 minute ago, Zhan_Zhuang said:

They also dominate possession whereas when Villa don't and when McGinn tries it the passes often lead to a quick turnaround and put us under pressure. 

Quite, and this is the issue that Gerrard and the recruitment team need to solve with our shape and incoming transfers in the summer. 

We need a CDM who is capable of supporting McGinn by being comfortable in possession, our possession stats this season are shocking. 

[Zhan_Zhuang]

5 minutes ago, bobzy said:

They're aren't skewed though - if anything, it makes McGinn out to be even better because Fernandes/De Bruyne will (likely) be able to play those forward passes with more regularity and in more space.

He does sometimes lose the ball - of course he does.  Every player does.  But the pros to his game are just so much more than those cons.

Of course they are skewed, the possession stats of Man City will be double those of Villa in terms of passes made and completed.

Hence my point when our players (or McGinn) gives the all away it puts us under immense pressure.

I agree he has more pros than cons and stats back that up. I think we criticise because we want the best for Villa.

Edited May 20, 2022 by Zhan_Zhuang