The Video Assistant Referee (VAR)

[Mic09]

40 minutes ago, StewieGriffin said:

They need ex pro's on the VAR panels

[MrBlack]

2 hours ago, sharkyvilla said:

The problem is people who have played the game at the highest level have never shown any interest in refereeing.  They know what a horrible job it is, the money wouldn't be enough to get them out of bed in the morning plus most players are thick as mince and don't know the rules properly anyway.  I doubt they'd even want to get involved with sitting in the VAR truck.

I agree with this ^

But I also agree with this v

1 hour ago, StewieGriffin said:

They need ex pro's on the VAR panels - one forward and one defensive. Any defence-minded ex pro (or, indeed, anyone with a brain cell) would be able to spot the impediment to Leno and the foul on Dawson.

Two officials for rule clarity and the pros for common sense implementation.

Each VAR should be a 30 second "you're correct" or "look at the screen" - VAR shouldn't be making the decisions, the in field official(s) should

On the one hand,  the officials don't understand and are either too corrupt or too ignorant to be able to. On the other,  ex pros are largely stupid (see screenshot above) or if they are intelligent enough, won't be interested in spending their time reviewing referee decisions for peanuts,  when they could be lying on a beach or admiring their 10 bedroom mansion and 5 cars.

It only needs a few to be willing to join in,  and maybe there's some that will accept the minimal pay day whilst also being able to make an unbiased logical call. But so many are jaded by their careers that they'll hold a bias that sways their decision, most likely towards the big 6.

The only answer is to scrap it. It's not brought the benefits most envisaged, but has brought a whole host of further problems.

Edited September 7, 2023 by MrBlack

[StewieGriffin]

6 minutes ago, MrBlack said:

I agree with this ^

But I also agree with this v

On the one hand,  the officials don't understand and are either too corrupt or too ignorant to be able to. On the other,  ex pros are largely stupid (see screenshot above) or if they are intelligent enough, won't be interested in spending their time reviewing referee decisions for peanuts,  when they could be lying on a beach or admiring their 10 bedroom mansion and 5 cars.

It only needs a few to be willing to join in,  and maybe there's some that will accept the minimal pay day whilst also being able to make an unbiased logical call. But so many are jaded by their careers that they'll hold a bias that sways their decision, most likely towards the big 6.

It doesn't need to be ex-PL players on VAR though - Im sure there are many ex-pro's from down the pyramid who'd jump at the chance to earn a good wage after their career is over. You don't need to have played at the top level to understand whether Leno was impeded or not, or to tell whether something subjective (a handball for example) is deliberate/intentional.

It'd also bring a better understanding to incidents like the Man Utd-Wolves one and the Van Dijk one (although they did get that correct)

[MrBlack]

3 minutes ago, StewieGriffin said:

It doesn't need to be ex-PL players on VAR though - Im sure there are many ex-pro's from down the pyramid who'd jump at the chance to earn a good wage after their career is over. You don't need to have played at the top level to understand whether Leno was impeded or not, or to tell whether something subjective (a handball for example) is deliberate/intentional.

It'd also bring a better understanding to incidents like the Man Utd-Wolves one and the Van Dijk one (although they did get that correct)

Good point, well made. Hopefully lowers the likelihood of the bias aspect too...

[HKP90]

5 hours ago, Mic09 said:

[villa4europe]

8 hours ago, sharkyvilla said:

The problem is people who have played the game at the highest level have never shown any interest in refereeing.  They know what a horrible job it is, the money wouldn't be enough to get them out of bed in the morning plus most players are thick as mince and don't know the rules properly anyway.  I doubt they'd even want to get involved with sitting in the VAR truck.

One of the things theyve introduced this summer under Webb is that academy players have to take ref classes but they've said its so that the players will understand the rules better (!) not because they think that for the thousands of kids that don't make it it's potentially a viable career, it should be the latter

Unfortunately I think more are likely to drop down several leagues to chase still playing than they are to follow a path in to being a ref (or a coach, physio, sports scientist etc etc)

[bobzy]

8 hours ago, StewieGriffin said:

Each VAR should be a 30 second "you're correct" or "look at the screen" - VAR shouldn't be making the decisions, the in field official(s) should

I’d rather have them just calling out incorrect decisions. You don’t need to send the ref to a screen on a marginal call; the VAR is already a ref, after all!

Separate issue is the interpretation of the laws of the game - which shouldn’t be a thing, but is. 

[fightoffyour]

How about putting less onus on the referee to make decisions about penalties either way, when it will be checked anyway? Then there’s less pressure overturn or backup the referee.

[Nicho]

11 hours ago, bobzy said:

I’d rather have them just calling out incorrect decisions. You don’t need to send the ref to a screen on a marginal call; the VAR is already a ref, after all!

Separate issue is the interpretation of the laws of the game - which shouldn’t be a thing, but is. 

It has to be one or the other for me. VAR was so successfully implemented at the 2018 World Cup as they just sent the ref to the screen every time. 

If it’s about letting the on field ref manage the game and potentially still make some mistakes even after reviewing then fine.

If it’s about correct decisions then VAR should just over rule and be done with it. This way seems to be seen by the ref fraternity as heresy.

[bobzy]

1 hour ago, Nicho said:

It has to be one or the other for me. VAR was so successfully implemented at the 2018 World Cup as they just sent the ref to the screen every time. 

If it’s about letting the on field ref manage the game and potentially still make some mistakes even after reviewing then fine.

If it’s about correct decisions then VAR should just over rule and be done with it. This way seems to be seen by the ref fraternity as heresy.

There’s definitely better ways for it to work. I guess VAR is only reviewing “big incidents” so maybe sending the ref to the screen all the time is fine.

I kind of hoped having VAR would just remove “clear and obvious errors”. The Onana incident vs Wolves being an example; it’s just a foul. Ref thinks it’s a collision or whatever the transcript says, VAR just messages down to say “no, that’s a foul. Penalty”. No need for ref to screen stuff. 

[StefanAVFC]

9 hours ago, bobzy said:

There’s definitely better ways for it to work. I guess VAR is only reviewing “big incidents” so maybe sending the ref to the screen all the time is fine.

I kind of hoped having VAR would just remove “clear and obvious errors”. The Onana incident vs Wolves being an example; it’s just a foul. Ref thinks it’s a collision or whatever the transcript says, VAR just messages down to say “no, that’s a foul. Penalty”. No need for ref to screen stuff. 

We had this in the first season, I think a ref was sent once to the screen in the entire season. 
 

We had a goal disallowed against Brighton for an absolutely absurdly soft foul and the ref wasn’t allowed to look at it again despite clearly not thinking it was a foul first time around 

[villa4europe]

11 hours ago, Nicho said:

It has to be one or the other for me. VAR was so successfully implemented at the 2018 World Cup as they just sent the ref to the screen every time. 

If it’s about letting the on field ref manage the game and potentially still make some mistakes even after reviewing then fine.

If it’s about correct decisions then VAR should just over rule and be done with it. This way seems to be seen by the ref fraternity as heresy.

Its crazy how much better at it FIFA are

Almost like PGMOL don't want it to work...

It should be that VAR as a team of say 5 watch everything, they then spot something that the pitch ref doesn't spot, they buzz down to him "you might want to take another look at that" he says no I saw it and it's OK or he says yeah alright and takes a look

Its so simple

[bobzy]

So simple that we all have differing ideas on how it would be best implemented  

[villa4europe]

I don't get the idea that VAR only watches "big incidents" and this "clear and obvious" stuff

They watch everything and when he's wrong they tell him

If he's not wrong they do nothing

The whole principle should be based around the speed of the game and the angle the ref has, VAR is for things he didn't see properly, they buzz down and say you'd didn't see that go to the screen and he says back yes I did it's OK then it's done, ultimately the decision has to be the man in the middles still, VAR are purely there to watch it from a different angle at a slower speed and make a recommendation they shouldn't have any power

[luckyeddie]

1 hour ago, bobzy said:

So simple that we all have differing ideas on how it would be best implemented  

Simpliest way is to bin VAR and tell all the whinging pricks of managers that referees make mistakes, get over it cos you win some, you lose some. This whole farce was brought about by the persistent moaning of Ferguson, Wenger and the rest

Edited September 8, 2023 by luckyeddie

[Kingman]

1 hour ago, villa4europe said:

Its crazy how much better at it FIFA are

Almost like PGMOL don't want it to work...

It should be that VAR as a team of say 5 watch everything, they then spot something that the pitch ref doesn't spot, they buzz down to him "you might want to take another look at that" he says no I saw it and it's OK or he says yeah alright and takes a look

Its so simple

I think its more of the fact that PGMOL is a clicky as **** old boys club looking after there mates 

[Nicho]

14 hours ago, bobzy said:

So simple that we all have differing ideas on how it would be best implemented  

Brexit thread? 

[blandy]

14 hours ago, villa4europe said:

I don't get the idea that VAR only watches "big incidents" and this "clear and obvious" stuff

They watch everything and when he's wrong they tell him

If he's not wrong they do nothing

The whole principle should be based around the speed of the game and the angle the ref has, VAR is for things he didn't see properly, they buzz down and say you'd didn't see that go to the screen and he says back yes I did it's OK then it's done, ultimately the decision has to be the man in the middles still, VAR are purely there to watch it from a different angle at a slower speed and make a recommendation they shouldn't have any power

That’s pretty close to how it is. Apart from facts (offside/onside), they either agree with the on-field ref, occasionally also getting the same decision wrong that the infield ref did, or saying “recommend you review your decision”

[villa4europe]

33 minutes ago, blandy said:

That’s pretty close to how it is. Apart from facts (offside/onside), they either agree with the on-field ref, occasionally also getting the same decision wrong that the infield ref did, or saying “recommend you review your decision”

Its not though

At the moment in the PL they stop the game, stick "checking hand ball" on the big screen and then everyone stands still until the VAR gives a penalty or says no penalty

That's not how fifa do it

[foreveryoung]

14 hours ago, Kingman said:

I think its more of the fact that PGMOL is a clicky as **** old boys club looking after there mates 

This is bang on, they don't want to overule there mates, been proved too with that ref comment. Do you think any ref would say after the game, "can't believe you missed that', it's obviously known mistakes will be made.