DCJonah Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 16 minutes ago, TRO said: I guess you can pick your sides and i will reiterate there is no room in society for rascist remarks, i thought i would get that in before your misconstrue my comments. I have first hand information on the behavior of Rio Ferdinand in a retail store, so be careful with the holier than thou attitude, they ( footballers )all have form in that respect. If John Terry was convicted of racist remarks, i am not condoning it......but bullying and arrogant behavior is equally not acceptable, but it was not reported, does that make it ok?.... and in some cases can invite regretful responses. just making the point, it takes two to tango. but equally remember, 2 wrongs don't make a right. Can I remind you.....this debate was started by you rubbishing John Terry's character......when we should be talking about football. you chose to bring that up and that is your prerogative, but i do not wish to continue the debate on John Terry's private and personal life. Finally, from me,If we do sign him, you can choose not to watch him. I can't talk about the sort of person he is and just football? Well that's rubbish really. If he signs I'll be behind him. It won't change my opinion of him as a man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 11 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said: Yes everyone does have to use their moral compass, there may be things some of you have done which secretly make the uptight neighbor you have down the road think you are a "scumbag". lol Having said that, this is football, they are athletes first, not MP's , being role models isn't their first responsibility. As MattyVilla has said, we need a bit of attitude, for years we have been trying to use the "moral high ground" and end up with god old boys like Ashley Westwood. I had no hesitation with us signing players like Joey Barton years back. If these players weren't so heavily scrutinised by media we wouldn't now half of these things, similarly to how we don't know the skeletons the average man has in their closet. I don't have a major problem with signing some scumbags. We've had a few previously. But him signing for villa doesn't stop him being a piece of shit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 (edited) 12 minutes ago, DCJonah said: I can't talk about the sort of person he is and just football? Well that's rubbish really. If he signs I'll be behind him. It won't change my opinion of him as a man. do you know what.....i don't really care what you think of him as a man and I'll wager he don't care either. and don't forget " rubbish" can be a two way street. If he signs........I hope he kicks the ball out and it hits you on the head and he gives you a big greasy grin ps sorry, I have just been laughing at the thought. Edited June 23, 2017 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phumfeinz Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Just wait until he scores his first headed corner, everyone will be singing his name then. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alreadyexists Posted June 23, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted June 23, 2017 To me football is an escape from all the shit in the world... I can't dedicate the worry or the time to thinking about the players characters. If they're ok at football then that's as much as I can appreciate. Half the world is controlled scumbags worse than John Terry... but like that, it's best not to think about it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villan-scott Posted June 23, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted June 23, 2017 5 minutes ago, Phumfeinz said: Just wait until he scores his first headed corner, everyone will be singing his name then. And gets mobbed by the Holte End, you certainly won't find me complaining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, alreadyexists said: To me football is an escape from all the shit in the world... I can't dedicate the worry or the time to thinking about the players characters. If they're ok at football then that's as much as I can appreciate. Half the world is controlled scumbags worse than John Terry... but like that, it's best not to think about it. Exactly. Their art not the artist - Otherwise stop watching all your favourite films, stop listening to most of your favourite music, stop reading your favourite literature and definitely, definitely, give up watching footballers. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 16 minutes ago, TRO said: do you know what.....i don't really care what you think of him as a man and I'll wager he don't care either. and don't forget " rubbish" can be a two way street. If he signs........I hope he kicks the ball out and it hits you on the head and he gives you a big greasy grin ps sorry, I have just been laughing at the thought. Well you do care. You keep defending him. Like I said a while back. If you don't think less of him because of his actions that's fine, I do. And of course he doesn't care what people think of him. Hence he's a piece of shit. If he was bothered he might have decided to act like a decent person more throughout his career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alreadyexists Posted June 23, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted June 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, terrytini said: Exactly. Their art not the artist - Otherwise stop watching all your favourite films, stop listening to most of your favourite music, stop reading your favourite literature and definitely, definitely, give up watching footballers. I love The Smiths, but I think Morrissey is a bell end, I still listen to them. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 I could list hundreds of examples but here is my most recent one. Im reading Tony Iommis Autobiography. ( Black Sabbaths founder and lead guitarist for those who don't know). A work of great literature it isn't. Hilarious and a great insight into the joys and lows of being a rock star it is. And it reads like a crime sheet. Drugs, violence, adultery, criminal damage, contractual scams, even threats of death. So do I bin all my Sabbath Albums ? Stop my lad listening to it ? Tell Villa not to play paranoid ? Their art, not the artist. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Paul McGrath was an alcoholic. So was my mum. There is no such thing as a law abiding morally pure alcoholic. So, no more 'Paul McGrath My Lord " ? No, because we sing about the footballer, the guy who brought us so much pleasure. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 And I do hope nobody that has issues with his character ever exceeds the speed limit, dodges a parking ticket, or uses their mobile phone in the car, to name but three. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 9 minutes ago, alreadyexists said: I love The Smiths, but I think Morrissey is a bell end, I still listen to them. He is. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 53 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said: Yes everyone does have to use their moral compass, there may be things some of you have done which secretly make the uptight neighbor you have down the road think you are a "scumbag". lol Having said that, this is football, they are athletes first, not MP's , being role models isn't their first responsibility. As MattyVilla has said, we need a bit of attitude, for years we have been trying to use the "moral high ground" and end up with good old boys like Ashley Westwood. I had no hesitation with us signing players like Joey Barton years back. If these players weren't so heavily scrutinised by media we wouldn't now half of these things, similarly to how we don't know the skeletons the average man has in their closet. I agree with most things you say mate but I was glad we didn't sign Barton. There is bad, irresponsible behaviour and then there is just pure criminal bordering psychotic behaviour. Joey Barton isn't a nice person at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Tbh has anyone seen Wayne Bridge's ex-wife. If I had a chance then I think I'd choose the scumbag option. Wayne landed on his feet with Frankie anyway! The racism, I'm less forgiving of. But still, what damage can he do in a season? The pros outweigh the the cons as far as I'm concerned. If Baker can look decent in this division then I'm sure Terry will be class. He's always been underrated for his distribution and his positional sense and leadership is excellent. The fact that he's considering us rather than just take the easy dosh elsewhere speaks volumes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 23 minutes ago, terrytini said: And I do hope nobody that has issues with his character ever exceeds the speed limit, dodges a parking ticket, or uses their mobile phone in the car, to name but three. Driving 35 on an empty road is hardly the same as racially abusing another human being. Surely you don't count every bad behavior the same? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 6 minutes ago, DCJonah said: Driving 35 on an empty road is hardly the same as racially abusing another human being. Surely you don't count every bad behavior the same? Come on it was in the spur of the moment in a tense pressured game and he apologised for it. I'm not saying it was right and excusing it but lets not get all PC about things. He's not since been marching on right wing rally's and plotting the demise of all non whites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, DCJonah said: Driving 35 on an empty road is hardly the same as racially abusing another human being. Surely you don't count every bad behavior the same? Ah so now you are deciding some crimes are ok and some aren't ? There are degrees are there ? Well the law recognises both your examples as crimes. The fact that YOU have decided which matter more to you is entirely subjective, and the fact that you would have a completely different view of another persons character who could have committed as many, or indeed MORE crimes renders any judgments of dubious standing, to say the least. Also it means that by deciding he is despicable for the matters you've mentioned, you've hit something of a glass ceiling, so someone with far WORSE sins/ crimes ( which as you say have degrees) is STILL only despicable, as it's hard to get worse. So for example shouting something racist isn't as bad as murder. And sleeping with someone's wife isn't as bad as... etc etc etc - but your disapproval has no further to go because his issues are already so bad. So really whether any individuals character is bad or not comes down to nothing more than a personal feeling. So any moral indignation really is meaningless, given it comes from a totally arbitrary, and adjustable, position. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 And btw there is no such thing as an empty road, just hazards you haven't seen yet. The 'empty road' argument is a poor one often used by people wanting to be their own arbiter of what's right and wrong. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrytini Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 And if it's less naughty to break the law when nobody is looking would that mean you'd be against a player uttering ONE racist comment, but have no trouble with a player THINKING 1000000's of racist thoughts ? Thatd be odd wouldn't it, since the latter is surely the worse character ? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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