Humanoid Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 3 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: I disagree. Its wrong in my opinion. So if you have 100 shit england managers but numerous excellent foreign managers who would be interested we shouldnt consider them because they are not british? Thats discrimination. If you did that in the work place in the uk for example you would get the pants sued off you. Why would the england job be any different? I think the best person should get the job no matter where they are from personally I think it's far more sensible that if good English managers are available they should be considered first. If a foreign manager is considered far the best choice above available English managers, then it makes sense to go for the foreign manager. It shouldn't be a hard and fast rule, but certainly one that should influence choice by virtue of the side being national. I think that's the current position of the FA anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Humanoid said: I think it's far more sensible that if good English managers are available they should be considered first. If a foreign manager is considered far the best choice above available English managers, then it makes sense to go for the foreign manager. It shouldn't be a hard and fast rule, but certainly one that should influence choice by virtue of the side being national. I think that's the current position of the FA anyway. But thats my point mate there isnt a large selection of excellent english managers worthyof the england job. So carraghers point is nonsense. If there was a massive pool of good english managers then you can argue his point but his points ridiculous. The best person is the best person for the job no matterw where they are from. If this was in any other sector we would be say this racist or victimising Edited December 13, 2022 by Demitri_C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jono62 Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 Sol Campbell is available . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 45 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: If there was a massive pool of good english managers then you can argue his point but his points ridiculous. The best person is the best person for the job no matterw where they are from. If this was in any other sector we would be say this racist or victimising Wind your neck in a bit pal. There is nothing ridiculous about wanting the national manager of England, who is managing players who qualify as being English, to be English. That should be the main criteria for the FA, and I believe it is, currently. This should aways be the preference and part of what forms the 'best person for the job' criteria. As for racist/discrimination/victimising (who specifically is being victimised?) then nonsense. The FA is free to appoint who they want, but they have stated previously that they prefer English managers. If that is against the law then i'm sure it would have been challenged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rds1983 Posted December 13, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 13, 2022 If we get a non-English manager because they're the best available could we please also give a passport to someone like Angelina so that we don't have to play Shaw at LB anymore? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted December 13, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted December 13, 2022 3 hours ago, Zatman said: He had one tournament and quit because he was undermined by the FA rightly or wrongly 2 hours ago, Demitri_C said: Don't see how was a failure when he had to deal with the terry racism drama and decisions made without his consent like terry being stripped of the captaincy by the fa Also that german loss was highly controversial as we know that wasnt capello. So i think he absolutely wasnt a failure He was absolutely shit. He played terrible football and the players hated him. He scraped through the groups in his only tournament and then got battered by Germany. I don't care if Lampard's goal should have counted, we'd have still lost that game. What exactly did he do that you could remotely class as successful? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villaglint Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 2 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: He was absolutely shit. He played terrible football and the players hated him. He scraped through the groups in his only tournament and then got battered by Germany. I don't care if Lampard's goal should have counted, we'd have still lost that game. What exactly did he do that you could remotely class as successful? Not really answering your question but I met him once and he was a surprisingly small man. Also his surname means Hat in Italian which always tickled me for some reason. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theboyangel Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 He’s going to stay on isn’t he…? ffs I just cannot get excited by Southgate-ball. I can acknowledge his record in charge but cannot recall being satisfied watching England play during his tenure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 Would Southgate have got to a World Cup final and semi final with Croatia? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tayls Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 (edited) Just the fact he picks his team based on the club the players play for makes me dislike his management style. It’s a pathetic way of going about things. Can’t believe Maddison didn’t even get a single minute on the pitch, and he is probably the most in form midfielder. The defence was awful. Playing Henderson and Rice was awful. Playing 3-sub-appearances-for-city Phillips at any point was also awful. Edited December 13, 2022 by Tayls 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humanoid Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 12 minutes ago, Tayls said: Just the fact he picks his team based on the club the players play for makes me dislike his management style. It’s a pathetic way of going about things. Can’t believe Maddison didn’t even get a single minute on the pitch, and he is probably the most in form midfielder. The defence was awful. Playing Henderson and Rice was awful. Playing 3-sub-appearances-for-city Phillips at any point was also awful. You've hit two nails on the head there imo. Maddison not getting game time when we need a decent attacking creative center mid who can score freekicks, and persisting with Henderson, are two of a number problems I have with his decision making. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 1 hour ago, Stevo985 said: He was absolutely shit. He played terrible football and the players hated him. He scraped through the groups in his only tournament and then got battered by Germany. I don't care if Lampard's goal should have counted, we'd have still lost that game. What exactly did he do that you could remotely class as successful? Highest win percentage of any England manager... Says more about the use of stats because yes he was shit, players has no respect for him and the media went for him from the off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 19 minutes ago, Humanoid said: You've hit two nails on the head there imo. Maddison not getting game time when we need a decent attacking creative center mid who can score freekicks, and persisting with Henderson, are two of a number problems I have with his decision making. Maddison wasn't fit but was only picked due to his form being so good the media wouldn't let him get away with not picking him Henderson was OK, more than anything it shows the lack of depth in central midfield, something which is fixable in the euros cycle with Ramsey or elliot My biggest concern with the midfield is this revelation that bellingham is quality... He's been quality for a long time, should have been building the midfield round him since the euros yet I'm convinced if phillips was fit he wouldn't have even played, Southgate got lucky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humanoid Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 3 hours ago, Demitri_C said: But thats my point mate there isnt a large selection of excellent english managers worthyof the england job. So carraghers point is nonsense. If there was a massive pool of good english managers then you can argue his point but his points ridiculous. The best person is the best person for the job no matterw where they are from. If this was in any other sector we would be say this racist or victimising There never is a large selection of excellent English managers, but to be fair there isn't a large selection of excellent foreign ones who are open minded enough to want to take the job either. And it will remain that way for as long as Premier League clubs employ more foreign managers than English, and that's just the way it is. As for managers qualifying for the national job in the same way players do, I would imagine it would be up to Fifa to bring in the rule after a vote by all the national FA's. I don't think big footballing nations would be against it, but smaller ones could well be as they try to get the best they can from wherever. As for Southgate, it's not as if he has proved himself in the Premier League. No PL club would have taken him on before his appointment, imo. He's basically an in-house English FA manager, a guaranteed yes-man. And I think the FA will be very happy with the way it's turned out. A top drawer manager would get more out of the squad available, imo. I think in the past we've tended to over rate the England squad and make the manager the whipping boy to a certain degree (this isn't to excuse the managers). I think this time there's no doubt as to how good the squad is, and some are wondering if Southgate holds the players back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humanoid Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 15 minutes ago, villa4europe said: Maddison wasn't fit but was only picked due to his form being so good the media wouldn't let him get away with not picking him Henderson was OK, more than anything it shows the lack of depth in central midfield, something which is fixable in the euros cycle with Ramsey or elliot My biggest concern with the midfield is this revelation that bellingham is quality... He's been quality for a long time, should have been building the midfield round him since the euros yet I'm convinced if phillips was fit he wouldn't have even played, Southgate got lucky I didn't know Maddison wasn't fit. He chose Bellingham over Mount. If Bellingham is such a good all-rounder as it's claimed (and I've no doubts to the contrary), I'd say he would be a good replacement for Henderson and let Mount play behind the striker, or even as some pundits suggested, allow Foden to play there. I just dont understand the persistence with Henderson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don_Simon Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 1 hour ago, theboyangel said: He’s going to stay on isn’t he…? ffs I just cannot get excited by Southgate-ball. I can acknowledge his record in charge but cannot recall being satisfied watching England play during his tenure. Iran? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theboyangel Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 Just now, Don_Simon said: Iran? Not even then. Yeah, we can play well sporadically but never consistently like we realistically should be able to do with the players at our disposal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don_Simon Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 1 minute ago, theboyangel said: Not even then. Yeah, we can play well sporadically but never consistently like we realistically should be able to do with the players at our disposal. Yeah, I get it. I'm not into it either. As for the "must be English" debate, that can **** right off. If we'd won the World Cup under Capello, I'd have celebrated in exactly the same way as under every other manager. Get the best person, not the best English person. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mykeyb Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 2 hours ago, theboyangel said: He’s going to stay on isn’t he…? ffs I just cannot get excited by Southgate-ball. I can acknowledge his record in charge but cannot recall being satisfied watching England play during his tenure. I have seen a few mention his record as a reason he should stay but he has been incredibly lucky. The first decent team he meets in a tournament we lose. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don_Simon Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 Just now, mykeyb said: I have seen a few mention his record as a reason he should stay but he has been incredibly lucky. The first decent team he meets in a tournament we lose. If France win the World Cup, does this become less of an issue as they have beaten everyone else too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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