rjw63 Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 13 minutes ago, sharkyvilla said: I think I've decided upon Wagner as my first choice. I suspect we'd just end up ruining him, though. He was never that good to start with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Thomas Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 (edited) Still anybody's guess. More it goes on the less likely it is going to be Bruce imo. Edited October 6, 2016 by Gary Thomas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted October 6, 2016 Moderator Share Posted October 6, 2016 3 minutes ago, Gary Thomas said: Still anybody's guess. More it goes on the less likely it is going to be Bruce imo. Yeah I think you're right. I know we're only guessing, but it almost seems as if Bruce is being treated as the guaranteed backup if we can't get someone more progressive or exciting. I suppose we should be happy that our fallback is someone who almost gets teams out of this league in his sleep. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyjavfc Posted October 6, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted October 6, 2016 I think it could well be Bruce but glad the club is not stroking his ego by holding no other interviews and not looking at other candidates to find the best man. I feel like under the old regime Bruce would have been practically begged to join by now just based on a glance of the available managers, but we seem to have a bit more sense at least now to not rush anything without a proper process. The same was not true of RDM's recruitment to be fair - Dr Tony seems to think the same as he has tweeted that appointment wasrushed, I just hope they have learnt their lessons and really scrutinise the field this time despite the clamoring of the fans for an immediate appointment. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted October 6, 2016 Moderator Share Posted October 6, 2016 9 minutes ago, mikeyjavfc said: Dr Tony seems to think the same as he has tweeted that appointment wasrushed, I just hope they have learnt their lessons and really scrutinise the field this time despite the clamoring of the fans for an immediate appointment. The difference this time is we have a Technical Director in place specifically for things like this and the football structure is more established. Fingers crossed that it does its job. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted October 6, 2016 Author Share Posted October 6, 2016 36 minutes ago, Gary Thomas said: Still anybody's guess. More it goes on the less likely it is going to be Bruce imo. I do not read it like that. I read it that they may be trying to not make the same mistake again. The only thing that length of time does convince me of though is how much they think we could get promoted this year or if it is still a realistic objective. I think if they felt this was the case then they would have made a swift appointment. What I do suspect is that they have put the breaks on rushing headlong into mistake after mistake, taken a step back and thought lets not **** this up again here there is too much money at stake lets make the right decision and see where that gets us this year and hope that next year we get promoted. Just my thoughts and I hope I am reading it correctly and not crediting them with more nous than they have 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 Has the good Dr. himself not ruled out Bruce now through listening to the Villa fans. It would be the wrong appointment through 3/4 fans will be at him from the word go. He will have no cushions, no time, no breathing space. It would be McLeish MKII all over again. I don't expect any activity for another week or so, this also confirmed on the Dr's twitter page. As for the bookmakers odds on tactics as well shows how wrong they are too. The reason they made Bruce odds on cause they know he will not be getting the job, therefore just deploy this tactic to sweep up any last bits of money from mug fans and punters alike before it is common knowledge to the world that he will not be our manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheStagMan Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 It is just a little frustrating that (from the outside) it appears that our managerial hunt (again) is so hopeless. Swansea sack their manager, immediately announce Bob Bradley - Cardiff sack Trollope on Tuesday and announce Warnock on Wednesday! I am not saying I like those managers but it does seem like other clubs have a plan and we don't! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted October 6, 2016 Author Share Posted October 6, 2016 1 minute ago, TheStagMan said: It is just a little frustrating that (from the outside) it appears that our managerial hunt (again) is so hopeless. Swansea sack their manager, immediately announce Bob Bradley - Cardiff sack Trollope on Tuesday and announce Warnock on Wednesday! I am not saying I like those managers but it does seem like other clubs have a plan and we don't! or other clubs have rushed and we wont 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 2 minutes ago, TheStagMan said: It is just a little frustrating that (from the outside) it appears that our managerial hunt (again) is so hopeless. Swansea sack their manager, immediately announce Bob Bradley - Cardiff sack Trollope on Tuesday and announce Warnock on Wednesday! I am not saying I like those managers but it does seem like other clubs have a plan and we don't! If you'd wanted Warnock or Bradley it probably could have been done overnight. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted October 6, 2016 Moderator Share Posted October 6, 2016 3 minutes ago, TheStagMan said: It is just a little frustrating that (from the outside) it appears that our managerial hunt (again) is so hopeless. Swansea sack their manager, immediately announce Bob Bradley - Cardiff sack Trollope on Tuesday and announce Warnock on Wednesday! I am not saying I like those managers but it does seem like other clubs have a plan and we don't! I'd say those 2 things, what they did (in firing and hiring quickly) and who they brought in, are inextricably linked. So I don't think you can ignore the identity of their new managers and whether you like them or not while seemingly preferring the way they went about things. Also, Swansea went one better than that. They openly met with Bradley while Guidolin was still in the job. You [Swansea] stay classy now I prefer our way given our short to mid-term history, and I don't accept that it means we don't have a plan. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 4 minutes ago, TheStagMan said: It is just a little frustrating that (from the outside) it appears that our managerial hunt (again) is so hopeless. Swansea sack their manager, immediately announce Bob Bradley - Cardiff sack Trollope on Tuesday and announce Warnock on Wednesday! I am not saying I like those managers but it does seem like other clubs have a plan and we don't! I don't think it was a case where Swansea sacked their manager and within hours got on the phone to Bob Bradley and was like Hey Bob, you fancy the managers job? It's available. Why sure Mr Swansea.. I'll be on the next plane to sign the deal. These behind the scenes goings on would have taken place weeks before either managers where sacked. I am glad we are taking the time to find the right man instead of a quick - panic appeasement. I just hope we do get the right man for the job and that we are also looking abroad and not just the basement bin of English football for our next manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 1 hour ago, PieFacE said: Think this is untrue. Villa fans will be patient as long as there's clear progression. When things go stale or go backwards is when Villa fans lose patience. Which is not a bad thing. It's fairly instantaneous, though. We take much longer to be "happy" than "unhappy" these days. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 1 minute ago, bobzy said: It's fairly instantaneous, though. We take much longer to be "happy" than "unhappy" these days. I think you will find this is going on across the globe and has been for a few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted October 6, 2016 Author Share Posted October 6, 2016 (edited) 20 minutes ago, TheStagMan said: It is just a little frustrating that (from the outside) it appears that our managerial hunt (again) is so hopeless. Swansea sack their manager, immediately announce Bob Bradley - Cardiff sack Trollope on Tuesday and announce Warnock on Wednesday! I am not saying I like those managers but it does seem like other clubs have a plan and we don't! Where I do have some sympathy is that you would have hoped that they had some contingency plans. That they had played out what if scenarios in case of the need to remove the manager. That they would have done this over the course of the last few weeks. Who knows maybe they did and the what we are now seeing is something that developed as part of that strategic thinking. A step back to make strides forward. Let's hope so eh? As I said I hope I am not over thinking or giving credit where it is not due. I certainly hope there is a plan and maybe my reading of the current situation could be taken as confirmation bias (there's that phrase again), it will only really be proven in time wont it. I certainly hope that regardless of names they are looking for a manager who is successful, has a plan to be successful, has a plan for a way of team working, of utilising the assets at his disposal in the most productive way and of identifying additional assets needed to help support and grow the club and that that manager has a long term not short term approach to it. Above all else this last one is so important to me as a fan. I am not motivated or pushed by an objective to be successful in promotion this year. As nice as it would be I do not and did not think it realistic or achievable . It is not about this season for me. It is about the long term success of the cub . Now on saying what I want in a manager I have to trust those charged with making the decision to first of all agree with my outlook and secondly identify someone who has that ability, someone who in their judgement has that ability. So do I think they have that outlook? Dont know, hope so as for me it is the only way for sustained and long term development of the club. Do I believe they have that judgement to be able to identify someone? Well to be honest in Xia and if it was him alone no I dont think he is capable of that. Especially as it seems RDM was his pick. However I think there are people at the club who do have that skil, Wyness, Round, Little and people of influence (Taylor) who would all give good advice. So on the second bit if they do approach it as I would like then yes I do believe there is sufficient football brain to pick the right man, if the owner does not have sole say. Given all that I would be deeply troubled if they thought any of the following were able to show the necessary skill set I have outlined Bruce, Pearson, Mccarthy, Hodgson, Mcclaren, Clarke, Cotterill, Grayson, Allardyce, Mowbray, Sherwood, Pearce (and maybe some others!) as to me they have not demonstrated that capability or have done and not for a while as their careers are downward and we need someone with an upward career trajectory. If any of these were to be recruited I would seriously doubt the ability of those charged with running our club Edited October 6, 2016 by Richard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheStagMan Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 6 minutes ago, BOF said: I'd say those 2 things, what they did (in firing and hiring quickly) and who they brought in, are inextricably linked. So I don't think you can ignore the identity of their new managers and whether you like them or not while seemingly preferring the way they went about things. Also, Swansea went one better than that. They openly met with Bradley while Guidolin was still in the job. You [Swansea] stay classy now I prefer our way given our short to mid-term history, and I don't accept that it means we don't have a plan. I'm not suggesting that I like either of those appointments. I am not suggesting that we rush into things. It just looked clearly like those clubs had planned for their managers sacking and we haven't. That's how it looks. I think you can separate the names and the speed of appointment, I'm sure that given the way they went about it they could have had any of their target managers in place very quickly (including our apparent prime target Steve Bruce!). Our current way is exactly how the last three managers have arrived....... great! From the outside looking in, it looks like we have had a bunch of bad results, the owner has thrown his toys and sacked the manager and we are now scratching around wondering who to look at. Looking at Swansea and Cardiff it looks like they have thought..... "hmm, manager is on his way out, lets line something up before acting" I know that is probably not the case, I hope I am wrong. It is just very frustrating to have days and weeks of "Allardyace", "Bruce" etc being bandied about. 5 minutes ago, AvfcRigo82 said: These behind the scenes goings on would have taken place weeks before either managers where sacked. I am glad we are taking the time to find the right man instead of a quick - panic appeasement. Well, it can't have been a quick panic appeasement if the behind the scenes had been going on for weeks. Again, implies that they had a plan...... we don't (appear to) have one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted October 6, 2016 VT Supporter Share Posted October 6, 2016 4 minutes ago, bobzy said: It's fairly instantaneous, though. We take much longer to be "happy" than "unhappy" these days. Possibly yes, but when you look at Lamberts time as manager, I think he was probably given too much time by fans (the ones at the ground anyway). To be honest, I think Villa fans have every right to be unhappy at the minute. I reckon from the last 5 years of being a season ticket holder, I've seen us win about 12 games at home. It's no surprise that fans find the unhappiness feeling more so than the happiness feeling, because Villa Park has simply been woeful for a long long time now. If a new manager comes in and wins 2 home games on the bounce everyone would be having orgasms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOF Posted October 6, 2016 Moderator Share Posted October 6, 2016 7 minutes ago, TheStagMan said: From the outside looking in, it looks like we have had a bunch of bad results, the owner has thrown his toys and sacked the manager and we are now scratching around wondering who to look at. Looking at Swansea and Cardiff it looks like they have thought..... "hmm, manager is on his way out, lets line something up before acting" I know that is probably not the case, I hope I am wrong. It is just very frustrating to have days and weeks of "Allardyace", "Bruce" etc being bandied about. I don't think it's a coincidence that all 3 sackings happened at the start of an international break. I guess we've just chosen the break to pick carefully and do due diligence whereas the others went the route of getting someone in and using the break to give him an extra week with the players. Again, for the sake of 1 extra week's training, I'll go with the method that tries to identify the right man. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 2 minutes ago, BOF said: I don't think it's a coincidence that all 3 sackings happened at the start of an international break. I guess we've just chosen the break to pick carefully and do due diligence whereas the others went the route of getting someone in and using the break to give him an extra week with the players. Again, for the sake of 1 extra week's training, I'll go with the method that tries to identify the right man. Particularly as half the squad are away. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 If Clarke is under consideration for the full time post then is it not likely that they'll want to give him a few games to see how he performs, obviously that's not something we can do with any of the other options but it makes sense to me, particularly as it may/will also mean less upheaval in the coaching staff etc. I don't personally believe that he is the right man but if he starts putting points on the board then that's a pretty good start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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