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UKIP/Reform NF Ltd and their non-racist well informed supporters


chrisp65

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13 minutes ago, bickster said:

Nigel Farage confirms he likes getting paid by GB News for spouting hateful shite

Don't speak too soon. He's quit his show for the duration of the election so he can campaign for Reform.

So he's obviously terrified of losing again so he won't stand, but it seems like he's going to all over every media outlet going.

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31 minutes ago, blandy said:

He'll be off to grift in America, too, no doubt.

He says he's going to be busy campaigning for Trump. 

The man is a prize word removed. 

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Bloke who runs J Vickerstaff at the fish markets was on BBC Breakfast this morning saying with heavy heart after voting Tory and even campaigning for Tories all his life is going to vote Reform because the Tories were all talk and no action. Mentioned uncontrolled immigration a couple of times. 

His right hand man said he wasn't going to vote at all because "you used to know if a party was left wing or right wing but now they're all just moving to the middle ground" 

I mean, yes, you couldn't get more moving towards middle ground than The Tories in recent years can you? 

Honestly it does trouble me.  These are intelligent guys running a successful established business. Their views are obviously extremely hard right. It's no wonder we're seeing a resurgence of parties like Reform. Less intelligent people going down Facebook rabbit holes and talking to man in the pub are going to be easily swayed by the bullshit. 

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Posted (edited)

I detest them but I don't see Reform as a bad thing at the moment as they'll serve the purpose of splitting the right wing vote.

Around 40% of the electorate has been right wing for as long as I've voted. The other approx. 60% has been split between the centre/centre left parties. This has unfortunately seen the Tories gain power more often than not due to having a monopoly on that right wing vote.

At present Labour/Libs/Greens are polling at around 60-65% with the Tories/Reform at 35%. It is far better the right wing vote gets split so Reform taking 10-15% out of the Tories is going to see them lose a shed load of seats. The expected rise in tactical voting by the centre left/centre parties is likely going to see the Tories totally annihilated.

Edited by markavfc40
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1 hour ago, Genie said:

Are people still voting Reform because they’re going to sack the entire home office and replace them with believers?

No, it’s because they want to be lobotomised 

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10 hours ago, markavfc40 said:

I detest them but I don't see Reform as a bad thing at the moment as they'll serve the purpose of splitting the right wing vote.

Around 40% of the electorate has been right wing for as long as I've voted. The other approx. 60% has been split between the centre/centre left parties. This has unfortunately seen the Tories gain power more often than not due to having a monopoly on that right wing vote.

At present Labour/Libs/Greens are polling at around 60-65% with the Tories/Reform at 35%. It is far better the right wing vote gets split so Reform taking 10-15% out of the Tories is going to see them lose a shed load of seats. The expected rise in tactical voting by the centre left/centre parties is likely going to see the Tories totally annihilated.

I see where you're coming from, and it has much merit. Until they get bigger than a fringe party and start to take over until there is no split. Then we have a British Trump party that can't be ignored, by us, by the media. Imagine a world where BBC balance is a balance between Blue Labour and Reform. We'd be ****.

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11 hours ago, markavfc40 said:

I detest them but I don't see Reform as a bad thing at the moment as they'll serve the purpose of splitting the right wing vote.

Around 40% of the electorate has been right wing for as long as I've voted. The other approx. 60% has been split between the centre/centre left parties. This has unfortunately seen the Tories gain power more often than not due to having a monopoly on that right wing vote.

At present Labour/Libs/Greens are polling at around 60-65% with the Tories/Reform at 35%. It is far better the right wing vote gets split so Reform taking 10-15% out of the Tories is going to see them lose a shed load of seats. The expected rise in tactical voting by the centre left/centre parties is likely going to see the Tories totally annihilated.

Whats interesting is that the Spectator article (linked below )is predicting a 11% vote share for Reform , but potentially zero MP's  v 30 Lib Dems with 10% of the vote 

 

there is some evidence in the data published here , that both parties are losing votes to reform in the past 2 years   .. but obviously its hard to validate that chart when it misses out Lib Dems , Greens etc 

 

image.png.832b9e7a17e3aa6c05de8916519dcb64.png

Snapshots from the Britain Elects poll tracker
Source: Britain Elects
 
 
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39 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

Whats interesting is that the Spectator article (linked below )is predicting a 11% vote share for Reform , but potentially zero MP's  v 30 Lib Dems with 10% of the vote 

 

there is some evidence in the data published here , that both parties are losing votes to reform in the past 2 years   .. but obviously its hard to validate that chart when it misses out Lib Dems , Greens etc 

 

image.png.832b9e7a17e3aa6c05de8916519dcb64.png

Snapshots from the Britain Elects poll tracker
Source: Britain Elects
 
 

There are plenty of seats where the LDs are the main challenger to the Tories, and their whole campaign will be about winning those kinds of seats. The purple mutter party, though has no such luxury, nor do they have the infrastructure or candidates even to win any seats, in all likelihood.

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1 minute ago, blandy said:

There are plenty of seats where the LDs are the main challenger to the Tories, and their whole campaign will be about winning those kinds of seats. The purple mutter party, though has no such luxury, nor do they have the infrastructure or candidates even to win any seats, in all likelihood.

Indeed. If the Lib Dems pick up 10% of the vote, but that 10% is concentrated in forty seats and they get a thousand votes in the other 610, then they'll win those forty seats. If the Brexit nobbers pick up 12% in 650 constituencies then they'll win none of them.

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3 minutes ago, ml1dch said:

Indeed. If the Lib Dems pick up 10% of the vote, but that 10% is concentrated in forty seats and they get a thousand votes in the other 610, then they'll win those forty seats. If the Brexit nobbers pick up 12% in 650 constituencies then they'll win none of them.

yeah the system is what the system is , i merely mentioned it  in passing 

but , I'm fairly sure when it was resulting in Tory victory, people were all in favour of moving away from FPTP   , i'm guessing that change won't be so popular this time around :) 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

yeah the system is what the system is , i merely mentioned it  in passing 

but , I'm fairly sure when it was resulting in Tory victory, people were all in favour of moving away from FPTP   , i'm guessing that change won't be so popular this time around :) 

 

 

No not really, can't speak for others but one of the reasons I'm not voting Labour is because they won't change the democratic system from FPTP. Its absolutely one of my red lines

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6 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

yeah the system is what the system is , i merely mentioned it  in passing 

but , I'm fairly sure when it was resulting in Tory victory, people were all in favour of moving away from FPTP   , i'm guessing that change won't be so popular this time around :) 

Personally I think that moving away from FPTP was right then, is right now and will still be right in the future. Pretty sure I'm not the only one (*nods @bickster).

It's possible that Labour will end up with a 300 seat majority and absolute power on 40% of the vote. Theresa May ended up with a hung parliament on 42% of the vote in 2017. This a silly system that shouldn't give results like that. 

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Just now, ml1dch said:

Personally I think that moving away from FPTP was right then, is right now and will still be right in the future. Pretty sure I'm not the only one (*nods @bickster).

It's possible that Labour will end up with a 300 seat majority and absolute power on 40% of the vote. Theresa May ended up with a hung parliament on 42% of the vote in 2017. This a silly system that shouldn't give results like that. 

Beat you by seconds :D 

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12 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

yeah the system is what the system is , i merely mentioned it  in passing 

but , I'm fairly sure when it was resulting in Tory victory, people were all in favour of moving away from FPTP   , i'm guessing that change won't be so popular this time around :) 

 

 

I want PR whoever gets in, that doesn't change if the Tories are finished. For what it's worth, I think the current system is unfair to reform and they should be able to win some seats. We'd then see in parliament how completely useless and batshit they are. 

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1 hour ago, Danwichmann said:

 We'd then see in parliament how completely useless and batshit they are. 

That wouldn't matter to their supporters. 

Everyone else knows that already. Their supporters are the same as those still voting Tory. They will just plough on regardless. 

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