Villa Park redevelopment

[OutByEaster?]

9 minutes ago, CVByrne said:

Despite the fact he's said we are raising the capacity by around 2,000 seats and then again in this interview for ft said to get capacity to 50,000.

So aside from explicitly saying we are raising capacity, twice then yes you're right Heck doesn't want to raise the capacity of VP.

The club has mentioned this figure of 2-3k on a number of occasions (in advance of doing any work to find out how they'd do it) I think the attendance will go up, perhaps by that many, but more likely by a smaller amount - I don't think any of that increase will be in GA seating - I think it'll be achieved by restructuring the hospitality areas. Mr Heck is here to raise revenues not attendances.

[OutByEaster?]

19 minutes ago, CVByrne said:

Who cares what fans speculate about. The club are planning the improvements and will announce them when it's right. 

Absolutely - and I think we looked at it, decided against the North Stand and went looking for ways we could improve the existing facilities to raise revenues between now and the Euros. I think we might well look at how to redevelop after that, but I don't think any announcement are imminent and I get the feeling that any development that significantly takes our capacity up won't happen until after Mr Heck has moved on. I see him as a three to four year man - get in, raise revenue, collect bonus, get out.

[OutByEaster?]

34 minutes ago, Teale's 'tache said:

I don't know if you've seen the Financial Times article (I don't know the link as I didn't pay for it, it may be in the Heck thread), but I believe in that Heck has mentioned increasing the capacity to 50k.

Quote

Speaking at the club’s new London offices, Heck said it was vital to increase revenues to compete, highlighting opportunities in merchandise, sponsorship and expanding the club’s home stadium from roughly 42,600 seats to about 50,000.

He's quoted as having said it was vital, which would beg the question why he publicly calls it paused and privately cancelled - I think it's a thing you can say in an article that stresses our (very real) ambition without any pressure of having to add any detail.

Who knows, we haven't brought all these people on board for nothing - I do feel though that the project they're working on will be for the future while Heck works on the now - I think people hoping we'll see a massive development announcement in the summer will be disappointed, I think we're three or four years from that. I hope I'm wrong.

[Captain_Townsend]

39 minutes ago, CVByrne said:

Who cares what fans speculate about. The club are planning the improvements and will announce them when it's right. 

I prefer to punch up rather than punch down.

[Teale's 'tache]

11 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

He's quoted as having said it was vital, which would beg the question why he publicly calls it paused and privately cancelled - I think it's a thing you can say in an article that stresses our (very real) ambition without any pressure of having to add any detail.

Who knows, we haven't brought all these people on board for nothing - I do feel though that the project they're working on will be for the future while Heck works on the now - I think people hoping we'll see a massive development announcement in the summer will be disappointed, I think we're three or four years from that. I hope I'm wrong.

I think Hecks priority is on the 'right now' and the regulations and sudden growth demand that, but he was at the 76ers for 9 years, and there were long, mid, and short term plans he put in place there. I don't know if he'll last that long here, but I think it's unfair to say he's only looking at the short term.

I don't think there will be an announcement this summer, but I'm hopeful it may be sooner than 3-4 years, simply because when our owners get hands on it seems things get done, and the links to Edens and the new board members suggest he at least will be involved in whatever our new plans are.

[Caravella82]

4 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

I would think if we're looking at ducks, there are two.

• A new stadium built on land adjacent to Villa Park with us continuing to play at Villa Park alongside it while it's built.
• The big duck shaped duck that people don't like looking at - that Chris Heck doesn't want to raise the capacity and that he'd prefer to spend a couple of million to get a thousand more £400 a game supporters than £100m building 10,000 more seats at £40 a time.

 

Duck No. 1: The  Bill would be huge.

Duck No. 2: Will definitely fall Fowl of a few on the waitlist, but maybe it's time we lowered our Eggspectations.

[TRO]

21 hours ago, CVByrne said:

I think there's a key underlying assumption here on that you replace a current season ticket holder (who brings atmosphere but the lowest revenue per fan let's say because of the discount a season ticket is) and you replace them with a higher paying fan but lose atmosphere. 

The underlying assumption being those who can pay more for tickets are not as passionate which I think isn't true. In the case of corporate seating it is and the "prawn sandwich" eating it would be however. 

I think the challenge is balance. We need more premium seats with premium prices available that can be purchased as in if a group of Villa fans want to fly to Birmingham to see a game they can pay a price and the club gets the money. Instead of them having to buy tickets on resale on Viagogo. 

It's about finding the balance in seating and pricing. Not necessarily about sheer capacity of the stadium 

I was not saying a higher paying fan is less passionate.....but they do bring with them non-villa supporters as their corporate entertainment, was meant to be my point.

also the type on environment, these up market sections encourage, does not exactly lend itself to a fan losing his/her **** when we score.

I am not trying to over play atmosphere.....but merely saying, when you haven't got it, the higher paying fans are likely to drift.........Atmosphere imo encourages attendance from all demographics and social backgrounds, just saying "don't kill the goose..........."

[CVByrne]

15 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

He's quoted as having said it was vital, which would beg the question why he publicly calls it paused and privately cancelled - I think it's a thing you can say in an article that stresses our (very real) ambition without any pressure of having to add any detail.

Who knows, we haven't brought all these people on board for nothing - I do feel though that the project they're working on will be for the future while Heck works on the now - I think people hoping we'll see a massive development announcement in the summer will be disappointed, I think we're three or four years from that. I hope I'm wrong.

It depends what you are calling privately cancelled. If you are talking about the North Stand redevelopment, knocking it down and rebuilding over a 2 year period then yes it's cancelled on that form.

If you are saying privately cancelled in relation to improving the capacity of Villa Park to reach 50,000 the I'd say no. It's not cancelled, there will be iterative improvements at a minimum to increase capacity. 

It's currently unclear how we will be improving Villa Park in coming years. Will we mostly work within the confines of the existing structure so that we don't have any loss of capacity during the season? So a focus on reconfiguring and filling in the corners. 

Will be interesting whenever the club announce their plans. 

[Delphinho123]

Sounds as if Forest want to build a new stadium now, too. 

The pressure to expand VP and bring it into the 21st century / build a new stadium is going to increase on the club in the next couple of years.

I've made my feelings known, a new stadium is the way to go (I understand it's not that simple, land, location etc). 

[Mic09]

15 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

Mr Heck is here to raise revenues not attendances.

Knowing the inside thinking within the club a bit more than I do, could you please let me know why you think both can't be achieved simultaneously? And I would appreciate your opinion rather than 'what the club says'  

I.e. Yes, increase the GA+/hospitality offering, while at the same time getting 7-8k more bums on seats and in doing so, also increase the hospitality range within a new stand?

Surely it's not a one versus other situation, especially considering that NS brings very little revenue as it is? 

[Mazrim]

17 hours ago, thabucks said:

 

This is similar to what I envisage for VP. That nearest stand is Witton Lane / Doug Ellis, the green area is where the houses have been purchased and demolished. The road itself is routed around the stand or through it like a tunnel. The new NS to the right would be on a similar level.
However, the alternative and what makes more sense and least disruption is to build a new stadium adjacent to VP on newly acquired land between Witton Lane, Witton Road and the river Tame, closer to the Train station. We can play at VP until its ready.
Yes, a small neighbourhood needs to do one, but that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

[CVByrne]

1 hour ago, Mic09 said:

Knowing the inside thinking within the club a bit more than I do, could you please let me know why you think both can't be achieved simultaneously? And I would appreciate your opinion rather than 'what the club says'  

I.e. Yes, increase the GA+/hospitality offering, while at the same time getting 7-8k more bums on seats and in doing so, also increase the hospitality range within a new stand?

Surely it's not a one versus other situation, especially considering that NS brings very little revenue as it is? 

There is a difference between revenue and attendance. Simply based on supply and demand. The more demand there is and restricted supply the higher the market can take in terms of price increases. 

So if you look at Villa Park from a revenue perspective a new stand that adds 8,000 capacity is not really the effective way of raising revenue. 

We should tackle the following things. We have too many season tickets in relation to the capacity of VP, it's around 80% which is among highest in the league. We need to be aiming for closer to 70% and the remaining 30% are higher priced seats that tap into the current demand. 

Additionally we need to be pitching our average season ticket prices in the top 8 to 10 of the PL. 

Then we need to focus needs to go on getting fans to Stadium earlier and leaving later and making access to food and drinks plus speed they are served to be much improved so more revenue per fan can be generated. 

That is the priority for revenue growth from match day. Not just adding 8,000 seats in less than premium area of North Stand.

Which begs the question, what was going to happen to the season ticket holders in North Stand for the two years it was demolished? They just miss out for two seasons including the CL ?

[wishywashy]

Villa Park development plans per the Heck and Gabby interview:

• No plans to leave Villa Park
• Promises to not touch the Holte End too much: will install rail seating and 'more seats' but 'not going to change the banners'
• Work around the rest of the stadium over the next two summers to add seats, will install LEDs everywhere but Holte End
• 'Reimagine our premium seating'
• Superstore, Concert Venue and all round 'Entertainment Zone' (aim to have fans stick around before and after games)
  • Welcoming the Villa players was a success, will be more of that going forward including club legends etc.
• Working on the train situation, already implemented the shuttle buses

Edited May 9 by wishywashy

[Captain_Townsend]

5 minutes ago, wishywashy said:

Per the Heck and Gabby interview:

• No plans to leave Villa Park at the moment
• Promises to not touch the Holte End too much: install rail seating and 'more seats' but 'not going to change the banners'
• Work over the next two summers to add seats, will install LEDs everywhere but Holte End
• 'Reimagine our premium seating'
• Superstore, Concert Venue and all round 'Entertainment Zone'
  • Welcoming the Villa players was a success, will be more of that going forward including club legends etc.
• Working on the train situation

My opinion isn't welcomel on this thread so I will leave it at this.

The interview gives the impression any new seats added in the next two summers would be premium seats only.

 

Absolutely delighted he committed to staying at Villa Park, however.

Edited May 9 by Captain_Townsend

[Mic09]

7 minutes ago, wishywashy said:

Per the Heck and Gabby interview:

• No plans to leave Villa Park at the moment
• Promises to not touch the Holte End too much: install rail seating and 'more seats' but 'not going to change the banners'
• Work over the next two summers to add seats, will install LEDs everywhere but Holte End
• 'Reimagine our premium seating'
• Superstore, Concert Venue and all round 'Entertainment Zone'
  • Welcoming the Villa players was a success, will be more of that going forward including club legends etc.
• Working on the train situation

Close the thread now, we are getting a new stadium! 

 

 

 

 

 

[thabucks]

4 minutes ago, Captain_Townsend said:

My opinion isn't welcomel on this thread so I will leave it at this.

The interview gives the impression any new seats added in the next two summers would be premium seats only.

 

Absolutely delighted he committed to staying at Villa Park, however.

Your opinion is welcome as much as anyone’s but the rinse repeat nature will be respectfully responded to … We know your position and I personally enjoy debate and will challenge when I feel it’s appropriate. We all what the same at the end of the day 

[ferguson1]

3 minutes ago, Captain_Townsend said:

My opinion isn't welcomel on this thread so I will leave it at this.

The interview gives the impression any new seats added in the next two summers would be premium seats only.

 

Absolutely delighted he committed to staying at Villa Park, however.

All opinions are or should at least be encouraged on this topic or any other

Someone may disagree with what’s said and that’s ok, as long as they respond in the right way. 

[ender4]

13 minutes ago, wishywashy said:

Villa Park development plans per the Heck and Gabby interview:

• No plans to leave Villa Park
• Promises to not touch the Holte End too much: will install rail seating and 'more seats' but 'not going to change the banners'
• Work around the rest of the stadium over the next two summers to add seats, will install LEDs everywhere but Holte End
• 'Reimagine our premium seating'
• Superstore, Concert Venue and all round 'Entertainment Zone' (aim to have fans stick around before and after games)
  • Welcoming the Villa players was a success, will be more of that going forward including club legends etc.
• Working on the train situation, already implemented the shuttle buses

Thank you, interesting to hear. 

What are the LEDs that you mention?

[ender4]

53 minutes ago, CVByrne said:

There is a difference between revenue and attendance. Simply based on supply and demand. The more demand there is and restricted supply the higher the market can take in terms of price increases. 

So if you look at Villa Park from a revenue perspective a new stand that adds 8,000 capacity is not really the effective way of raising revenue. 

We should tackle the following things. We have too many season tickets in relation to the capacity of VP, it's around 80% which is among highest in the league. We need to be aiming for closer to 70% and the remaining 30% are higher priced seats that tap into the current demand. 

Additionally we need to be pitching our average season ticket prices in the top 8 to 10 of the PL. 

Then we need to focus needs to go on getting fans to Stadium earlier and leaving later and making access to food and drinks plus speed they are served to be much improved so more revenue per fan can be generated. 

That is the priority for revenue growth from match day. Not just adding 8,000 seats in less than premium area of North Stand.

It depends how much extra revenue you want.  The stuff you mention is basics that should have been done decades ago and needs to be done ASAP. Maybe that adds a few million to revenue.    But the big money comes from increasing the size of the stadium - 8000 extra seats of which 4000 are premium/corporate/hospitality seats (including converting existing seats elsewhere) adds many more millions every year. Much more than the tinkering with food and drink which should be done irrespectively of new stands or not. 

Also the four new infrastructure directors haven't joined just to create a new bar for selling more food and drink.  They are here to do big things.

[Mazrim]

5 minutes ago, ender4 said:

It depends how much extra revenue you want.  The stuff you mention is basics that should have been done decades ago and needs to be done ASAP. Maybe that adds a few million to revenue.    But the big money comes from increasing the size of the stadium - 8000 extra seats of which 4000 are premium/corporate/hospitality seats (including converting existing seats elsewhere) adds many more millions every year. Much more than the tinkering with food and drink which should be done irrespectively of new stands or not. 

Also the four new infrastructure directors haven't joined just to create a new bar for selling more food and drink.  They are here to do big things.

This is the main detail I think gets overlooked. They're here for something and we've not heard what that is yet.