Popular Post blandy Posted November 1, 2017 Author Moderator Popular Post Share Posted November 1, 2017 6 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: Sorry, but I can't buy that Labour are secretly remain and playing a long game. I think they're just starting to find the courage that the tories cannot. I think Starmer is doing a good job on Brexit. I think most MPs of all parties are of the view Brexit is/will be harmful. But the two main parties are officially pro Brexit "because democracy" even though the MPs personal views is it's bonkers. I think Labour is inching towards chaning from Pro to anti Brexit, bit by bit and is working to do this supported by proper arguments and evidence and political advantage. I think they feel that if the public view changes "wait, no we didn't mean we wanted that sort of Brexit", then Labour will want to be able to "be on their side" and definitely not be on the same side as the lunatic tories. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrenm Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 (edited) 46 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: Sorry, but I can't buy that Labour are secretly remain and playing a long game. I don't even think it's that secret. As @blandy says, why would they be so interested in getting the reports if they weren't interested in at least SM & CU membership (which is nigh on staying in anyway as by that time you may as well)? Stands to reason surely? Economically, only a fool doesn't see that full on hard brexit is disastrous. They wouldn't want to get in and have to bear the brunt of the shit that to come. And their manifesto wouldn't workable without a buoyant economy. Edited November 1, 2017 by darrenm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 2 hours ago, blandy said: I think they're just starting to find the courage that the tories cannot. I think Starmer is doing a good job on Brexit. I think most MPs of all parties are of the view Brexit is/will be harmful. But the two main parties are officially pro Brexit "because democracy" even though the MPs personal views is it's bonkers. I think Labour is inching towards chaning from Pro to anti Brexit, bit by bit and is working to do this supported by proper arguments and evidence and political advantage. I think they feel that if the public view changes "wait, no we didn't mean we wanted that sort of Brexit", then Labour will want to be able to "be on their side" and definitely not be on the same side as the lunatic tories. Yes, this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 Don't put Fox in charge of the chicken. Quote Liam Fox has defended the controversial practice of disinfecting chicken with chlorine, reopening a cabinet rift over whether post-Brexit food standards should be lowered to facilitate a trade deal with the US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 3 hours ago, darrenm said: They wouldn't want to get in and have to bear the brunt of the shit that to come is this the official party excuse being got in early for 2020 .. We could have trounced the Tories , but we didn't want to get in and have to bear the brunt of the shit , so we strategically decided to lose another election Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 35 minutes ago, peterms said: Don't put Fox in charge of the chicken. Haven't we just had 2 poultry scares within the EU in the last 6 months, I think both were covered up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 4 hours ago, blandy said: I think they're just starting to find the courage that the tories cannot. I think Starmer is doing a good job on Brexit. I think most MPs of all parties are of the view Brexit is/will be harmful. But the two main parties are officially pro Brexit "because democracy" even though the MPs personal views is it's bonkers. I think Labour is inching towards chaning from Pro to anti Brexit, bit by bit and is working to do this supported by proper arguments and evidence and political advantage. I think they feel that if the public view changes "wait, no we didn't mean we wanted that sort of Brexit", then Labour will want to be able to "be on their side" and definitely not be on the same side as the lunatic tories. I know what you're saying, it's the same message that Darren is giving out. It's 'hope' for the remainers that also handily keeps remainers voting for or supporting a pro brexit party. Best of both worlds, and I guess that's politics. On the Labour website, the part of their current manifesto regarding Brexit starts with the following five words: 'Labour accepts the referendum result...' I'm a bit too old to be naive about political parties, but I simply do not see a scenario, any scenario whatsoever, where Labour keep us in the EU. What they have is the exact same policy as the tories in so many ways. They are saying they want out, but they also want to keep all the good things, whilst carrying out the result of the referendum. It's very close to the same message, it's down to nuance and scrutiny. The EU will not allow a near identical deal but without shared responsibility, full financial contribution and freedom of movement. It would simply make the EU redundant as an entity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 9 minutes ago, colhint said: Haven't we just had 2 poultry scares within the EU in the last 6 months, I think both were covered up. There was an egg problem apparently linked with 14 years of cuts in the Dutch regulatory body, which was very widely reported. Was there something else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 Salmonella outbreak in Poland, killed some people not sure how many, but they are one of the largest exporters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted November 1, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted November 1, 2017 Laws being broken don't invalidate laws. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrenm Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 36 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: is this the official party excuse being got in early for 2020 .. We could have trounced the Tories , but we didn't want to get in and have to bear the brunt of the shit , so we strategically decided to lose another election You've seen the Momentum prepared tweets too?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 21 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: I know what you're saying, it's the same message that Darren is giving out. It's 'hope' for the remainers that also handily keeps remainers voting for or supporting a pro brexit party. Best of both worlds, and I guess that's politics. On the Labour website, the part of their current manifesto regarding Brexit starts with the following five words: 'Labour accepts the referendum result...' I'm a bit too old to be naive about political parties, but I simply do not see a scenario, any scenario whatsoever, where Labour keep us in the EU. What they have is the exact same policy as the tories in so many ways. They are saying they want out, but they also want to keep all the good things, whilst carrying out the result of the referendum. It's very close to the same message, it's down to nuance and scrutiny. The EU will not allow a near identical deal but without shared responsibility, full financial contribution and freedom of movement. It would simply make the EU redundant as an entity. Labour may or may not keep us in the EU, but they very clearly have a different policy to the Tories. The Tories can't decide what they want between either a] leaving with 'no deal', or b] a strictly time-limited transition. Labour can't decide between a] a longer time-limited transition, b] an indefinite transition period, or c] staying. Those are not the same options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 31 minutes ago, colhint said: I think both were covered up. If they were covered up, how do you know about them? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrenm Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 This is all getting very strange. Now Rees-Mogg the remainer? Tories won't oppose opposition day motion, assumedly they think it's not binding but deputy speaker thinks it is. So looking likely the studies will be released. My guess is they'll try to pass off some heavily redacted or crap versions as the real deal. Just popping my usual 'it'll never happen' in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 14 minutes ago, snowychap said: If they were covered up, how do you know about them? the bbc reported on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 (edited) 2 minutes ago, colhint said: the bbc reported on it So they weren't covered up? I'm guessing that 37 minutes ago, colhint said: Salmonella outbreak in Poland, killed some people not sure how many, but they are one of the largest exporters. referred to this: Multi-country Salmonella outbreak (EFSA - 27/10/2016) Quote Seven countries have reported human cases of Salmonella Enteritidis between 1 May and 12 October 2016 (112 confirmed and 148 probable). Cases have been reported by Belgium, Denmark, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Norway, Sweden and the UK. In addition, Croatia reported a cluster of cases, including one death, possibly associated with this outbreak. Whole genome sequencing, food and environmental investigations, and trace-back investigations established a link between the outbreak and an egg packing centre in Poland. Evidence suggests eggs as the most likely source of infection. Polish competent authorities and Member States to which suspect eggs were distributed have now halted distribution. Edited November 1, 2017 by snowychap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 Well they reported on it well after the event. They did report the authorities knew about it well beforehand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 Just now, colhint said: Well they reported on it well after the event. They did report the authorities knew about it well beforehand The 'authorities' knew about something before it happened? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 Just now, snowychap said: The 'authorities' knew about something before it happened? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 no they knew about it well before it was reported by the European press Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts