KentVillan Posted March 8, 2023 Share Posted March 8, 2023 (edited) 10 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: Not really, I was saying illegals also come on small boats. You don't really know what any of these words mean though, so your points don't make sense. There isn't really such thing as an "illegal immigrant". There is unauthorised entry into the UK (e.g. via a boat or whatever), but then these people can still claim asylum under longstanding international law. And you have people living in the UK without documentation / overstaying visas / etc, but they may have (usually have!) entered the country legally. Most so-called "illegals" are people who've come here on holiday or on a student visa or something like that, and overstayed or are working illegally. People going to the lengths of entering the country on a dinghy are more than likely going to claim asylum, and then they become... "asylum seekers". So what do you actually mean by illegals here? Do you mean bogus asylum seekers, or do you mean undocumented / false documented foreigners in the UK? They're not the same thing. Edited March 8, 2023 by KentVillan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted March 8, 2023 Share Posted March 8, 2023 11 minutes ago, juanpabloangel18 said: I don't know. But here's evidence from a Home Affairs Committee in 2020 that 98% of people who crossed went on to claim asylum: https://committees.parliament.uk/oralevidence/793/default/ Or research from 2022 that at least 60% of people making the crossing would succeed in gaining refugee status https://www.refugeecouncil.org.uk/latest/news/majority-of-people-on-small-boats-crossing-channel-last-year-are-refugees-new-analysis-shows/#:~:text=Over 25%2C000 men%2C women and,all who made the journey. But I doubt you'll even bother to read the above or consider that you might have something to learn on this topic. Side note, I'm increasingly of the view that some people that are a total waste of time, I never used to think that way though Carry on crossing on small boats then I guess, the odd death won't matter weather a adult or child. Cause this was my original issue, not the actual asylum seekers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted March 8, 2023 Share Posted March 8, 2023 11 minutes ago, bickster said: Thats a very small part of what you said and no one has disputed it, it's prety undeniable, of course they do. I've been on a bus with a wanted criminal, it doesn't make me the same as him. Not sure I said that?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted March 8, 2023 Share Posted March 8, 2023 5 minutes ago, KentVillan said: You don't really know what any of these words mean though, so your points don't make sense. There isn't really such thing as an "illegal immigrant". There is unauthorised entry into the UK (e.g. via a boat or whatever), but then these people can still claim asylum under longstanding international law. And you have people living in the UK without documentation / overstaying visas / etc, but they may have (usually have!) entered the country legally. Most so-called "illegals" are people who've come here on holiday or on a student visa or something like that, and overstayed or are working illegally. People going to the lengths of entering the country on a dinghy are more than likely going to claim asylum, and then they become... "asylum seekers". So what do you actually mean by illegals here? Do you mean bogus asylum seekers, or do you mean undocumented / false documented foreigners in the UK? They're not the same thing. Criminals also cross on small boats, they are what I mean by illegals. People escaping there countries legal systems. Which is why I don't agree with entering the UK this way. An I know it don't suit your narrative with wanting to call me xenophobic, racist, an I'm sorry for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted March 8, 2023 Moderator Share Posted March 8, 2023 4 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: Not sure I said that?? Quote There generally on the same ***** boat. You did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted March 8, 2023 Share Posted March 8, 2023 2 minutes ago, bickster said: You did Sorry I don't get you. So there are never any wanted criminals coming over on these boats? I'm sorry, I've said I'm not a hater of Asylum seekers, I just don't like how they enter the country over the Channel, as any one can come over this way, including criminals, petty thieves etc. If you wanna believe I hate foreigners, please do, its not true so who gives a *****! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted March 8, 2023 Share Posted March 8, 2023 2 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: Criminals also cross on small boats, they are what I mean by illegals. People escaping there countries legal systems. Which is why I don't agree with entering the UK this way. An I know it don't suit your narrative with wanting to call me xenophobic, racist, an I'm sorry for that. I didn't call you xenophobic or racist. I don't really know what narrative you think I'm trying to push. My point is just more a political / legal one, that these problems never really go away, and you have to just address them with coordinated action across different countries, instead of unilaterally trying to turn your country into an impregnable fortress or trying to make it a completely unattractive place for any foreigners to ever want to come to. The reason the fortress thing doesn't work is people can still overstay after entering the country legally... and there are so many different ways of entering the country illegally (lorries, boats, cargo ships, etc etc). I'm not saying for a moment that we should all be delighted that a 24 year old Albanian has arrived on a dinghy, helped by the Albanian mafia. But getting angry about stuff doesn't really change anything. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted March 8, 2023 Share Posted March 8, 2023 1 minute ago, KentVillan said: I didn't call you xenophobic or racist. I don't really know what narrative you think I'm trying to push. My point is just more a political / legal one, that these problems never really go away, and you have to just address them with coordinated action across different countries, instead of unilaterally trying to turn your country into an impregnable fortress or trying to make it a completely unattractive place for any foreigners to ever want to come to. The reason the fortress thing doesn't work is people can still overstay after entering the country legally... and there are so many different ways of entering the country illegally (lorries, boats, cargo ships, etc etc). I'm not saying for a moment that we should all be delighted that a 24 year old Albanian has arrived on a dinghy, helped by the Albanian mafia. But getting angry about stuff doesn't really change anything. Sensible post. No ones getting angry, but sometimes you get bored of hearing just nice stuff drummed into you, of arriving on a dingy. It's not all pretty, it's not all people seeking a better life, an it's certainly not ideal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted March 8, 2023 Share Posted March 8, 2023 13 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: I'm sorry, I've said I'm not a hater of Asylum seekers, I just don't like how they enter the country over the Channel, as any one can come over this way, including criminals, petty thieves etc. Weren't you going to give us your preferred solution to the problem at some point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desensitized43 Posted March 9, 2023 Share Posted March 9, 2023 7 hours ago, ml1dch said: Weren't you going to give us your preferred solution to the problem at some point? The thing is there’s not really a solution that’s politically acceptable for the tories. We all know there is one but it involves the government accepting that they need to invest in more processing centres, staff to process people in a timely fashion, housing, all the other services these people will need when they’re here and settled etc. Crucially all this hinges on the tories accepting that we have to accept people and that in order for the system to work properly we need to accept quite a few more than a lot of their voters want us to. Unfortunately they’re allergic to investment in things they don’t see as vote winners and even more allergic to telling their voters the hard reality of the situation. Its just populism. Governments sometimes have to do things that are massively unpopular for the good of the nation. It’s called leadership and they don’t have any. it’s easy to just take a referendum and do what the “majority” think you should do but what’s hard is interpreting the data, situation and making an argument and convincing people to come along with you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
picicata Posted March 9, 2023 Share Posted March 9, 2023 7 hours ago, ml1dch said: Weren't you going to give us your preferred solution to the problem at some point? Rejoining the EU would probably solve a lot of the small boat problems. But I can't see the Tories going for that solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted March 9, 2023 Author Moderator Share Posted March 9, 2023 9 hours ago, KentVillan said: You don't really know what any of these words mean though, so your points don't make sense. There isn't really such thing as an "illegal immigrant". There is. People entering the uk without authority are one such category. It’s what this whole latest row is about. The baby eaters propose that this category of illegal immigrants will be barred from claiming asylum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted March 9, 2023 Share Posted March 9, 2023 21 minutes ago, blandy said: There is. People entering the uk without authority are one such category. It’s what this whole latest row is about. The baby eaters propose that this category of illegal immigrants will be barred from claiming asylum. The classic loophole - you have to apply for asylum on arrival, but you can’t get a visa for arriving. Woop woop. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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NurembergVillan Posted March 9, 2023 Moderator Share Posted March 9, 2023 10 hours ago, foreveryoung said: Sorry I don't get you. So there are never any wanted criminals coming over on these boats? I'm sorry, I've said I'm not a hater of Asylum seekers, I just don't like how they enter the country over the Channel, as any one can come over this way, including criminals, petty thieves etc. If you wanna believe I hate foreigners, please do, its not true so who gives a *****! But if we had a safe, legal route then ONLY criminals would come over on small boats, making them very easy to spot. It's the system that is the issue, not the mode of transport. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted March 9, 2023 Share Posted March 9, 2023 Quote Boris Johnson earned 85% of all the outside pay generated by MPs this year, Sky News can reveal. The former prime minister has declared earnings of £4.8m, mostly since stepping down from Downing Street in speeches and book deals, the latest update to the Westminster Accounts by Sky News can reveal. Some £3.7m of this was earned in just the first six weeks of this year, on top of the basic MP salary of £84,144. Imagine how much he’d earn if he wasn’t a useless, corrupt, lying sack of shit? Link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted March 9, 2023 Share Posted March 9, 2023 So, having been assured 2 weeks ago there was absolutely no truth in the rumour that HS2 was going to be further reduced, it’s out today that the stretch north of Birmingham is to be ‘delayed’. C’mon, we’ve all got our well rehearsed pieces to put in here. £77 billion for a train from Birmingham to London. Quote The government is set to announce that construction of certain sections of HS2 will be delayed to save money, the BBC understands. It is thought the delay will primarily affect sections from Manchester to Crewe and Birmingham to Crewe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted March 9, 2023 Share Posted March 9, 2023 This was hinted earlier on the week and I don’t understand. Often delays are blamed for projects going wildly over budget. This is the only case I know of where delaying is actually going to save money. How is that possible? On the same report I saw earlier this week they mentioned there was 30,000 people working on HS2. 30 **** thousand!!! No wonder it’s so expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted March 9, 2023 Share Posted March 9, 2023 4 minutes ago, chrisp65 said: So, having been assured 2 weeks ago there was absolutely no truth in the rumour that HS2 was going to be further reduced, it’s out today that the stretch north of Birmingham is to be ‘delayed’. C’mon, we’ve all got our well rehearsed pieces to put in here. £77 billion for a train from Birmingham to London. What a disgraceful amount of money. At a time when public workers are out on strike most months, it's sickening to read how much we've spent on this project. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainy316 Posted March 9, 2023 Share Posted March 9, 2023 46 minutes ago, Genie said: Imagine how much he’d earn if he wasn’t a useless, corrupt, lying sack of shit? Link Probably less. These are the kind of people that get ahead in our messed up society. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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