Panto_Villan Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 (edited) Wrong. By my logic, everyone is equally entitled to have an opinion regarding the players/manager/fans and being a season-ticket holder makes you no more qualified to do so. The point being made was that people who don't pay to go to Villa Park and watch the games (myself included) should perhaps refrain from lecturing paying fans as to how they must behave during them. It is obviously easier to swallow watching constantly awful displays when you are watching on TV/stream and are not paying a significant amount of your disposable income for the pleasure. I fail to see how your strawman analogy is relevent to that point. So you're saying that if we're not season ticket holders, we're not allowed to have an opinion on the fans? We don't pay as much money to watch the club, ergo our opinions have less value? (EDIT - with regards to the fans, at least) Edited March 3, 2014 by Panto_Villan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaGoMarching Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 I don't know if this has been posted but following our third goal, Lambert celebrated and then immediately turned to a Villa fan behind the Norwich dugout who I assume had been giving him grief. Lambert was gesticulating that he wanted a word and shouting at this bloke who then came rushing down the front row to the edge of the Villa dugout and was pounced on by a few fans and security. Lambert took his coat off as if he was going to go toe to toe for a scrap and was going crazy. The "fan" was escorted away by a couple of security fans and I assume thrown out. If you have video'd the game, watch how lambert snaps round and looks at someone behind the dugout after the goal and a moment later you will see him without his coat, despite the fact that it was pissing down. For what it's worth I remember an incident in the Albion game where I thought a fan had confronted Lambert at the dugout after one of our goals. Despite a definite coming together of lambert and someone who looked like they'd ran from the side if the dugout. I saw no mention of the incident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R1chuk Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 First Culverhouse having a go at the fans who help pay his wages, now Lambert. The pair of them don't deserve to work for our great club. If that was me in my workplace I would gave been disciplined and perhaps sacked for gross misconduct. Let alone the pair of them being shit at their jobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaGoMarching Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Wonder if it's the same guy who ran on to the touchline and briefly celebrated with Lambert after one of the goals v WBA? You do get some moaners right behind the dugout, O'dreary never stopped going on about them and MON had a pop from time to time. Glad you mentioned this Chris. I never saw anymore said about it after the match but thought it was a bizarre incident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jon_c Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Wrong. By my logic, everyone is equally entitled to have an opinion regarding the players/manager/fans and being a season-ticket holder makes you no more qualified to do so. The point being made was that people who don't pay to go to Villa Park and watch the games (myself included) should perhaps refrain from lecturing paying fans as to how they must behave during them. It is obviously easier to swallow watching constantly awful displays when you are watching on TV/stream and are not paying a significant amount of your disposable income for the pleasure. I fail to see how your strawman analogy is relevent to that point. So you're saying that if we're not season ticket holders, we're not allowed to have an opinion on the fans? We don't pay as much money to watch the club, ergo our opinions have less value? (EDIT - with regards to the fans, at least) Also by this logic, Randy has put more money than anyone so his opinion on Lambert must be the absolute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Lions_Roar Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 It is definitely what happened. I couldn't hear what was said but the actions were as I have said. Lambert wanted a word with the guy, was pointing and shouting in his direction, took his coat off with a clear intent. Fortunately a few fans and security got to the guy first and bundled him away - lambert was absolutely fuming.Sorry, I didn't mean to disbelieve your account - just a worry that it may have been a report of what someone else may have said and so on. That's not a good report at all. Just to corroborate this story and perhaps add a little to it, this DID happen. I sit in C4 and, whilst I didn't hear the exact nature of the incident I both saw what happened and spoke to the steward who ejected him (who I just happen to know through work). Obviously there were a lot of grumbles after the first 15mins or so and, much like Culverhouse on numerous occasions has, Lambert turned round and told a group of fans to get behind the team and to 'shut the f up' or words to that effect. Now, because it was quiet, this became a direct shouting match between the fan and the manager for 10 seconds. A few minutes later Villa had scored and as the celebrations were dying down it became obvious the 'ruckus' was kicking off and the guy was fuming. Lambert kept goading him and he looked like he wanted to tear the managers head off. Fans, the Villa physios/coaches that sit behind the dugout and a few stewards pulled him away and back to his seat but with such force the guys jacket got torn p*ssing him off further. He then disappeared. At half time I bumped in to this steward friend (I say friend, I know him to speak to but actually don't know his name still!) of mine who approached me after he'd had a chat with the young lad who stewards directly next to the dugout. Said the bloke he'd had to eject was f'in and blinding about being sworn at and having Lambert stick a few choice fingers up at him. I think the view of the crowd and the stewards was that this was kind of caused by Lambert for either not ignoring the situation in the first place or continuing to goad him through out it. Oh, and it wasn't the same guy that hugged him a few weeks back! (Which, by the way, Lambert dealt with appallingly by shoving him and swearing etc - but I suppose you might not trust a stranger). The question is: should a manager always rise above it or is there a tolerance level any human being has for what is just words? Seems like much ado about nothing. The lesson learnt here is to not say anything until the match is finished. If this was anything then it would be mentioned but so far I've not read one press report with this in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackbauer24 Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 I don't know if this has been posted but following our third goal, Lambert celebrated and then immediately turned to a Villa fan behind the Norwich dugout who I assume had been giving him grief. Lambert was gesticulating that he wanted a word and shouting at this bloke who then came rushing down the front row to the edge of the Villa dugout and was pounced on by a few fans and security. Lambert took his coat off as if he was going to go toe to toe for a scrap and was going crazy. The "fan" was escorted away by a couple of security fans and I assume thrown out. If you have video'd the game, watch how lambert snaps round and looks at someone behind the dugout after the goal and a moment later you will see him without his coat, despite the fact that it was pissing down. For what it's worth I remember an incident in the Albion game where I thought a fan had confronted Lambert at the dugout after one of our goals. Despite a definite coming together of lambert and someone who looked like they'd ran from the side if the dugout. I saw no mention of the incident. This also did happen but was quite the reverse of Sunday's incident. The fan at WBA got a little overexcited and got on to the touchline to hug Lambert and he initially thought it was Culverhouse then got a little peed off and pushed the fan away, the stewards took over but recognised it was merely over-exuberance and let him return to his seat. However, they have since added a stronger barrier on the corner between the fans and the dugout - so much so the physios/ coaches that sit behind the dugout couldn't get to their seats against West Ham! But this week they put in a gate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordSepulchrave Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 In a weekend dominated by Pardew's headbutt, really glad the press didn't pick up on all this. They would have immediately linked the two of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isa Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 So you're saying that if we're not season ticket holders, we're not allowed to have an opinion on the fans? We don't pay as much money to watch the club, ergo our opinions have less value? (EDIT - with regards to the fans, at least) I wouldn't quite put it like that. I would just hope that instead of sanctimoniously lecturing those who actually pay to go to the matches, perhaps some empathy can be employed to understand why the crowd behave as they do. I personally would refrain from booing during the game and would wait until the interval but I won't blame or criticise those who do as it is completely understandable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Don't agree with all this.... fans having access to the manager...seems amateurish to me. He should be screened off and not having to listen to rants from fans. He lives and dies by the football he plays and there is a mechanism for voicing opinions.....not whilst the game is in progress. I am not entirely happy with him, but would not dream of slagging him off whilst a game is in progress. i have never been in favour of booing the staff of the football club whilst a game is on....but equally can understand the fans frustration, they have had simply TOO MANY poor performances at home to criticise them. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post bobzy Posted March 3, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted March 3, 2014 So you're saying that if we're not season ticket holders, we're not allowed to have an opinion on the fans? We don't pay as much money to watch the club, ergo our opinions have less value? (EDIT - with regards to the fans, at least) I wouldn't quite put it like that. I would just hope that instead of sanctimoniously lecturing those who actually pay to go to the matches, perhaps some empathy can be employed to understand why the crowd behave as they do. I personally would refrain from booing during the game and would wait until the interval but I won't blame or criticise those who do as it is completely understandable. Hardly lecturing to suggest that it may not be the greatest action in the world to boo the team after 3 minutes. Understandable to be unhappy with recent seasons, understandable to be unhappy with the manager, understandable to be unhappy with the board, understandable to boo at full-time having witnessed a terrible game, can't understand why you'd want to berate the team so early on. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butterfingers Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Can anyone blame Lambert for having a go back occasionally? he's busting a gut for the cause & has to endure this almost non-stop criticism. We've been 10th/11th for a good while. Surely this is about right after 1.5 seasons? Yes, he is a paid employee but if you receive stick at close range, you should be entitled to your pound of flesh now & again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electric Avenue Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 I might have to go and sit by the dugout one week to assess the situation for myself . I sat there for mcleishs last home game vs spurs . He got very little abuse that day , then again he was a broken man by that point. He sat down the whole game never got up once. There was one poignant moment when Kevin Macdonald who was sat next to him clutched his forearm as a show of support for him. I think they were both aware he'd already lost his job at that stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 (edited) Can anyone blame Lambert for having a go back occasionally? he's busting a gut for the cause & has to endure this almost non-stop criticism. We've been 10th/11th for a good while. Surely this is about right after 1.5 seasons? Yes, he is a paid employee but if you receive stick at close range, you should be entitled to your pound of flesh now & again. He should not be receiving stick from fans, like that, at such close quarters its almost intimidation. ....sorry it ain't on. I'm not trying to defend him I would say the same if it was Alex McLeish or Billy McNeill.....it simply ain't right. No person serving the public would accept that, they would refuse to serve them and ask them to leave.....no amount of frustration is a mitigation for that kind of abuse. Ps ..The club should not allow that to happen Edited March 3, 2014 by TRO 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Can anyone blame Lambert for having a go back occasionally? he's busting a gut for the cause & has to endure this almost non-stop criticism. We've been 10th/11th for a good while. Surely this is about right after 1.5 seasons? Yes, he is a paid employee but if you receive stick at close range, you should be entitled to your pound of flesh now & again. Whether he is doing a good job or not ...this is two different things....he should not have to put up with close quarters abuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 I might have to go and sit by the dugout one week to assess the situation for myself . I sat there for mcleishs last home game vs spurs . He got very little abuse that day , then again he was a broken man by that point. He sat down the whole game never got up once. There was one poignant moment when Kevin Macdonald who was sat next to him clutched his forearm as a show of support for him. I think they were both aware he'd already lost his job at that stage. It just shows a low level of intelligence imo despite a man failing, (he don't intentionally fail) its a sad state of affairs the club should not allow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyAnty Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 It is definitely what happened. I couldn't hear what was said but the actions were as I have said. Lambert wanted a word with the guy, was pointing and shouting in his direction, took his coat off with a clear intent. Fortunately a few fans and security got to the guy first and bundled him away - lambert was absolutely fuming.Sorry, I didn't mean to disbelieve your account - just a worry that it may have been a report of what someone else may have said and so on. That's not a good report at all. Just to corroborate this story and perhaps add a little to it, this DID happen. I sit in C4 and, whilst I didn't hear the exact nature of the incident I both saw what happened and spoke to the steward who ejected him (who I just happen to know through work). Obviously there were a lot of grumbles after the first 15mins or so and, much like Culverhouse on numerous occasions has, Lambert turned round and told a group of fans to get behind the team and to 'shut the f up' or words to that effect. Now, because it was quiet, this became a direct shouting match between the fan and the manager for 10 seconds. A few minutes later Villa had scored and as the celebrations were dying down it became obvious the 'ruckus' was kicking off and the guy was fuming. Lambert kept goading him and he looked like he wanted to tear the managers head off. Fans, the Villa physios/coaches that sit behind the dugout and a few stewards pulled him away and back to his seat but with such force the guys jacket got torn p*ssing him off further. He then disappeared. At half time I bumped in to this steward friend (I say friend, I know him to speak to but actually don't know his name still!) of mine who approached me after he'd had a chat with the young lad who stewards directly next to the dugout. Said the bloke he'd had to eject was f'in and blinding about being sworn at and having Lambert stick a few choice fingers up at him. I think the view of the crowd and the stewards was that this was kind of caused by Lambert for either not ignoring the situation in the first place or continuing to goad him through out it. Oh, and it wasn't the same guy that hugged him a few weeks back! (Which, by the way, Lambert dealt with appallingly by shoving him and swearing etc - but I suppose you might not trust a stranger). The question is: should a manager always rise above it or is there a tolerance level any human being has for what is just words? A manager should always rise above it. He is a professional and thats what he has to do. If he cant control himself then being a manager isn't for him. What next, a kung fu kick when we play palace? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 The fans and the manager should not have access to each other, like they do. I know its not easy to prevent, but surely something could be done. The manager is not likely to change his opinion of his intentions, because of a ranting fan....so what is the point other than just giving vent to your feelings. I equally don't agree with Managers having stand up rows with fans, they should be concentrating on the game.....If the club never allowed comments to get to managers by screening them, they may not have reason to get involved. its all a bit sad really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 It is definitely what happened. I couldn't hear what was said but the actions were as I have said. Lambert wanted a word with the guy, was pointing and shouting in his direction, took his coat off with a clear intent. Fortunately a few fans and security got to the guy first and bundled him away - lambert was absolutely fuming. Sorry, I didn't mean to disbelieve your account - just a worry that it may have been a report of what someone else may have said and so on. That's not a good report at all. Just to corroborate this story and perhaps add a little to it, this DID happen. I sit in C4 and, whilst I didn't hear the exact nature of the incident I both saw what happened and spoke to the steward who ejected him (who I just happen to know through work). Obviously there were a lot of grumbles after the first 15mins or so and, much like Culverhouse on numerous occasions has, Lambert turned round and told a group of fans to get behind the team and to 'shut the f up' or words to that effect. Now, because it was quiet, this became a direct shouting match between the fan and the manager for 10 seconds. A few minutes later Villa had scored and as the celebrations were dying down it became obvious the 'ruckus' was kicking off and the guy was fuming. Lambert kept goading him and he looked like he wanted to tear the managers head off. Fans, the Villa physios/coaches that sit behind the dugout and a few stewards pulled him away and back to his seat but with such force the guys jacket got torn p*ssing him off further. He then disappeared. At half time I bumped in to this steward friend (I say friend, I know him to speak to but actually don't know his name still!) of mine who approached me after he'd had a chat with the young lad who stewards directly next to the dugout. Said the bloke he'd had to eject was f'in and blinding about being sworn at and having Lambert stick a few choice fingers up at him. I think the view of the crowd and the stewards was that this was kind of caused by Lambert for either not ignoring the situation in the first place or continuing to goad him through out it. Oh, and it wasn't the same guy that hugged him a few weeks back! (Which, by the way, Lambert dealt with appallingly by shoving him and swearing etc - but I suppose you might not trust a stranger). The question is: should a manager always rise above it or is there a tolerance level any human being has for what is just words? A manager should always rise above it. He is a professional and thats what he has to do. If he cant control himself then being a manager isn't for him. What next, a kung fu kick when we play palace? easier said than done particularly in our case ,when its probably on all season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electric Avenue Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 Hmmm not liking those stories about Lambert if I'm honest. Lambert sounds a right clearing in the woods if you ask me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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