The Wrestling Topic

[TrentVilla]

 

People pay to watch wrestling on PPV? Blimey.

[hogso]

8 minutes ago, TrentVilla said:

People pay to watch wrestling on PPV? Blimey.

Well, some might, butnot really, not any more. It's a old term for an event that (in North American wrestling at least) usually takes place once a month, with all of the biggest grudge / title matches taking place, that used to be literally pay per view.

Nowadays most every large (and some not so) wrestling promotion have an online subcription service for a monthly fee which includes all of the 'PPV' events, plus the back catalogue of past events.

There are some exceptions. Lucha Underground is a weekly TV show, which now has a deal with Netflix, although not in Europe yet. I couldn't tell you what TNA/Impact are doing, but I don't believe they have a sub service.

We should probably stop calling them PPVs, but old habits die hard. It's kinda like saying you're going to tape something on TV, when you're actually going to record it on to the HDD inside your set top box / TV. You're obviously not taping anything, or probably aren't anyway. But everyone knows what you mean.

[sharkyvilla]

They actually brought back the worst wrestler of all time?  Incredible.

[Daweii]

Battleground was a unique PPV as it wasn't actually bad, but it also wasn't great.

The matches were decent;

• Uso's/New Day was likely the match of the night and it was phenomenal with a great finish. It started the PPV on a very very high note.
• Corbin/Nakamura was a great match, but as will be the theme of the night it had an awkward ending. Now it saved both the grace of actually taking a pin, but still awkward.
• Women's 5-Way was a good match. It was rushed a bit at the end, but it was good certainly one of the better multi-Woman matches in WWE history. The finish though with Natalya winning was not what anyone wanted. 
• Owens/Styles was again a great match as these guys just can't wrestle badly, but again the ending was just awkward and disappointing I think the fans wanted a longer Styles title run.
• Cena/Rusev was terrible it was the worst match of the night, but it was a Flag Match it was never going to be good. The fact that not even SuperCena could make the match good should tell WWE to never do a Flag Match again.
• Kannelis/Zayn was a good match for what it was. I think Zayn winning while advances the feud doesn't help Kannelis much here and this is a feud to build Kannelis and nothing more. Standard match and finish surprisingly.
• Mahal/Orton was a slow match, but it did get good once they escaped the first cage. The table spot was brutal and the match itself was brutal, but again the finish was just awkward and no one wanted Khali back.

So while I can get the "worst PPV ever" claims I don't think it was that bad. The wrestling within the PPV was solid and great as always these days, but as is common as well these days the endings were booked poorly. Ultimately this does leave the PPV feeling more average than it potentially should have felt, but there is a lot to enjoy about the PPV bar the endings.

PS. Does anyone else think the Punjabi Prison match would be better if it was just the larger outer cage? I think there is a market for a more hardcore cage match that still has cage match rules. Having a cage outside the ring taller than a Hell in a Cell that has to be climbed over is cool, but I feel the inner cage that also has to be escaped just slows the match down. Last night the match came alive once they left the inner cage which is what got me thinking about this. I don't think the Punjabi Prison loses much at all if they remove the inner cage entirely..

[Villanun]

Quote

 

I read an interesting thread on reddit earlier about the way Jinder is being portrayed to the Indian audience:

https://www.reddit.com/r/SquaredCircle/comments/6p626u/spoilers_i_watched_the_battleground_main_event/?ref=search_posts

Quote

When all the alternate language commentators introduced themselves during the broadcast today, I decided to watch the Punjabi Prison match with Hindi commentary because I had a lot of questions about Jinder and his portrayal. When the Zayn-Kanelis match ended, I switched to Hindi and it was just fascinating. Some notes below

• First thing to make clear, there was literally no question who was the face and who was the heel. Jinder was the all conquering hero and Orton was the evil American
• When Jinder came to the ring, both the commentators ran down his accomplishments and ended with "1.3 Billion people are supporting him, and that will lead him to victory today"
• When Orton came down to the ring, they barely acknowledged his existence instead focusing on "Jinder agreed to face Randy in this match despite knowing he would have no backup. What a display of bravery"
• "India stands with Jinder" was the entire message on commentary
• Even the Hindi commentary could not sell "Jinder has an advantage in the Punjabi Prison Match because he is from Punjab" angle
• Jinder was addressed by the honorific "Jinderji" or "Maharaja Sahab" which is like saying "The esteemed Jinder" or "The respected Maharaja"
• One of the commentators kept saying "Randy Mahal" for some reason before correcting himself every time
• Jinder bravely preventing Orton from exiting the inner cage, but how dare Orton stand in Jinder's way???
• When the Singh Brothers pulled Jinder out, the commentators actively mocked Orton for being stuck in the inner cage
• On that note, why are the Singh Brothers here? Because they want to ensure that only a deserving person is Champion, and Jinder is the only deserving person in this match
• When the Singh Brothers attacked Orton, the commentary first egged them on, and then when Orton turned the tables, it became "What a brave fight by the Singh Brothers who are fighting someone twice their size"
• When Orton got the Kendo stick and Jinder begged, they were besides themselves and said "Jinder shouldn't reduce himself to begging for mercy, he is better than this."
• When the Singh brother was sent through the table and the other one was dispatched by a chair, the commentators said "The Singh Brothers showing us what the word 'loyalty' truly means. They are putting themselves on the line for Jinder"
• When Orton attacked Jinder with the steel chair, the commentators were livid "How dare he use a steel chair, I can understand using a Lathi (indian version of Kendo stick) but a steel chair is going too far, he wants to end the Maharaja's career"
• When The Great Khali came out, I am pretty sure both commentators jizzed in their pants right there. One of them sounded like the football commentators who scream "GOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLL". That moment alone was worth watching the match in Hindi (I would highly recommend you watch that moment on the Hindi commentary, it is at 3:06:00 and you don't even need to know Hindi to feel the commentator's excitement) ETA: Streamable link of part of the overall ending, but includes Khali's entrance in Hindi: (link redacted)
• They ended it with "This is patriotism. This is what it means to have the back of your brother (brother not in the "They are related" sense). India is proud of its two sons who are standing tall"

From start to finish, this match was just fascinating with Hindi commentary. It is a completely different alternate universe with that commentary. The narrative itself changed to "That evil American Randy Orton will do anything to take away Jinder's title". Will definitely go back and watch previous PPVs with Hindi commentary now to see how they tackle Jinder's matches.

 

Edited July 26, 2017 by Villanun

[Demitri_C]

On 7/24/2017 at 17:07, Daweii said:

Battleground was a unique PPV as it wasn't actually bad, but it also wasn't great.

The matches were decent;

• Uso's/New Day was likely the match of the night and it was phenomenal with a great finish. It started the PPV on a very very high note.
• Corbin/Nakamura was a great match, but as will be the theme of the night it had an awkward ending. Now it saved both the grace of actually taking a pin, but still awkward.
• Women's 5-Way was a good match. It was rushed a bit at the end, but it was good certainly one of the better multi-Woman matches in WWE history. The finish though with Natalya winning was not what anyone wanted. 
• Owens/Styles was again a great match as these guys just can't wrestle badly, but again the ending was just awkward and disappointing I think the fans wanted a longer Styles title run.
• Cena/Rusev was terrible it was the worst match of the night, but it was a Flag Match it was never going to be good. The fact that not even SuperCena could make the match good should tell WWE to never do a Flag Match again.
• Kannelis/Zayn was a good match for what it was. I think Zayn winning while advances the feud doesn't help Kannelis much here and this is a feud to build Kannelis and nothing more. Standard match and finish surprisingly.
• Mahal/Orton was a slow match, but it did get good once they escaped the first cage. The table spot was brutal and the match itself was brutal, but again the finish was just awkward and no one wanted Khali back.

So while I can get the "worst PPV ever" claims I don't think it was that bad. The wrestling within the PPV was solid and great as always these days, but as is common as well these days the endings were booked poorly. Ultimately this does leave the PPV feeling more average than it potentially should have felt, but there is a lot to enjoy about the PPV bar the endings.

PS. Does anyone else think the Punjabi Prison match would be better if it was just the larger outer cage? I think there is a market for a more hardcore cage match that still has cage match rules. Having a cage outside the ring taller than a Hell in a Cell that has to be climbed over is cool, but I feel the inner cage that also has to be escaped just slows the match down. Last night the match came alive once they left the inner cage which is what got me thinking about this. I don't think the Punjabi Prison loses much at all if they remove the inner cage entirely..

Bringing back that giant oaf that cant wrestle. Lame and taking the belt off AJ 

Spoiler

RAW PPV main event for SS strawman vs joe vs reigns vs lesnar, thats is going to be awesome main event. Strowman will probably come out as champ, but I would give it to SJ. Joe will turn face soon i think. He is getting some good fan reactions

Over on SD AJ recaputures US title which is odd why lose in first place? But Jericho is back!

Looks like Cena vs Mahal at SS with the most predictable Corbin cashing in when Cena wins it  

 

[supermon]

Lets hope they build up to Wyatt family (Bray, Luke and Eric) v Bullet Club (Balor, Gallows and Anderson) for Summerslam. I think Summerslam is for both brands so could work!

So many story-lines this could develop, imagine Strowman and AJ then got in the act for a 4 on 4

Dream booking!!

[Demitri_C]

1 hour ago, supermon said:

Lets hope they build up to Wyatt family (Bray, Luke and Eric) v Bullet Club (Balor, Gallows and Anderson) for Summerslam. I think Summerslam is for both brands so could work!

So many story-lines this could develop, imagine Strowman and AJ then got in the act for a 4 on 4

Dream booking!!

I would be interested in that but I would have it as Bray takes out anderson and then AJ joins them after they invade smackdown. have a lil inter brand for SS

[Wainy316]

The Bray Wyatt formula.

Decides he doesn't like someone.  Randomly attack them.  Spout loads of inane meaningless promos at them usually on the titan tron.  Have feud spanning three PPV matches.  The end.

Repeat.

[Demitri_C]

11 minutes ago, Wainy316 said:

The Bray Wyatt formula.

Decides he doesn't like someone.  Randomly attack them.  Spout loads of inane meaningless promos at them usually on the titan tron.  Have feud spanning three PPV matches.  The end.

Repeat.

Yep boring as hell now, first reigns, then ambrose, then rollins, then orton now balor. yawn 

[sharkyvilla]

2 hours ago, Demitri_C said:

Yep boring as hell now, first reigns, then ambrose, then rollins, then orton now balor. yawn 

I liked the period where Orton joined forces with Wyatt, I wish they could have kept them together for longer with Bray holding the title and dominating for a few months then have their feud rather than rush it for Wrestlemania.  In the end it was hardly worth making Bray champ and what followed with that daft house match was one of the worst things I've ever seen.

[Daweii]

13 hours ago, Wainy316 said:

The Bray Wyatt formula.

Decides he doesn't like someone.  Randomly attack them.  Spout loads of inane meaningless promos at them usually on the titan tron.  Have feud spanning three PPV matches.  The end.

Repeat.

Missed out the bit where Wyatt talks up how fearsome he is only to lose every feud he's ever been in.

Wyatt is a dead character and it's a shame as in the wake of The Undertaker he could have been the next big supernatural character in WWE, but at this point he has no chance. 

[Wainy316]

Yeah he started so well.  I'm now at the point where I fast forward his promos.

I can't really bear him and it's not his fault at all.

 

On another note, have Anderson and Gallows stealthily become baby faces?

[Villaphan04]

Anyone watch SD last night?

Spoiler

that Cena/Nak match made my neck hurt 

 

[omariqy]

38 minutes ago, Villaphan04 said:

Anyone watch SD last night?

  Hide contents

that Cena/Nak match made my neck hurt 

 

Was that when he landed on his neck?

[Villaphan04]

1 hour ago, omariqy said:

Was that when he landed on his neck?

Yep. It looked very bad, but it appears that no bad injury came out of it. 

Edited August 2, 2017 by Villaphan04

[hogso]

Nice debut for Kyle O'Reilly in NXT, as good a singles competitor he is, it'd be nice to see reDDragon re-unite, as the tag division needs it. 

Also seems as though Adam Cole (bay bay) will be making his debut shortly too. For me he's one of the biggest guys in the indies over the last decade who seems ready made for WWE. More so than Owens, Rollins, Ambrose, Roode, any of the '205' division or the Japanese guys...could do very, very well for himself. 

As usual with the transition to WWE, one of the more interesting things to see will be what he uses for a finisher. He has had a knack for some pretty devastating manoeuvres over time, and there's no way he'll be able to use the flipping piledriver out of the corner, or the brainbuster on to the knee... 

Edited August 3, 2017 by hogso

[Demitri_C]

13 hours ago, hogso said:

Nice debut for Kyle O'Reilly in NXT, as good a singles competitor he is, it'd be nice to see reDDragon re-unite, as the tag division needs it. 

Also seems as though Adam Cole (bay bay) will be making his debut shortly too. For me he's one of the biggest guys in the indies over the last decade who seems ready made for WWE. More so than Owens, Rollins, Ambrose, Roode, any of the '205' division or the Japanese guys...could do very, very well for himself. 

As usual with the transition to WWE, one of the more interesting things to see will be what he uses for a finisher. He has had a knack for some pretty devastating manoeuvres over time, and there's no way he'll be able to use the flipping piledriver out of the corner, or the brainbuster on to the knee... 

Wondering when they are bringing Bobbi rude to main roster, they need to and quickly. I would have him come in and cost Samoa Joe the title and turn Joe 

[hogso]

I can't say that would interest me. Have Joe be the man who made Brock leave WWE. From there he could be booked as a face or heel champion. Either would be good. 

Mcintyre beating Roode and then Bobby moving over after Summerslam seems pretty likely at this point. I'm more interested in that setting up a Mcintyre v Black and/or Itami rivalry than whatever happens to Roode, actually. 

Do we believe Nakamura will win the title at Summerslam? At a time when Japanese wrestling is more prominent than ever in America, it'd be interesting to see if WWE try and build more bridges the other way. Has there ever been a Japanese heavyweight champion in America? Thinking...failing...maybe in ROH? 

On the subject of Japanese wrestlers, this weekend marks the start of the retirement tour of Onita - in a match on American soil versus Matt Tremont in CZW. If you only watch one CZW event this year, make it this one. That match will be something, but Janella v Rush will steal the show. 

[Daweii]

49 minutes ago, hogso said:

Do we believe Nakamura will win the title at Summerslam? At a time when Japanese wrestling is more prominent than ever in America, it'd be interesting to see if WWE try and build more bridges the other way. Has there ever been a Japanese heavyweight champion in America? Thinking...failing...maybe in ROH? 

Nakamura will win the title at Summerslam I think WWE are done with the Mahal experiment. 

What is less known is what happens after he wins. Is Corbin going to cash in? If he does is Corbin going to be successful? 

I know the original plan was Cena vs Mahal with Cena winning and Corbin successfully cashing in, but doing that to Cena doesn't hurt him though doing that to Nakamura probably will. 

I don't know what WWE are going to do post-Summerslam once Nakamura has won. Hopefully they have something that allows both Nakamura and Corbin to flourish.