Bollitics: VT General Election Poll #2

[kidlewis]

Drug policy is one thing I've never been able to nail a stance on.

Cannabis I don't believe is spectacularly dangerous and I've known many people who've enjoyed a casual spliff on a fairly regular occasion and they've largely been great people. Useless after a blunt but great people. Heads screwed on. After beyond cannabis I get a bit more derisory. Cocaine is a mugs drug, fashionable, expensive, largely pointless, does damage if you get unlucky. And so on up the scale.

But cannabis, largely, as a substance, fine. But you bring with it a criminal aspect that Snowy has made reference to. Is that going away if you legalise it? I doubt it. And it is the gateway drug. Both myself and my friends have seen people, not many admittedly, who push past cannabis, get into the harder stuff and wind up, well... **** in at least 1 case. And other friends, who have their head screwed on, have admitted that the desire remains to try the new stuff even though they know the consequences.

It's that, along with the criminal aspect, that makes me wary to legalsie cannabis.

Again though, I'd have to say this is probably a failing of my politcal feeling than anything else.

you have to remember though CHindie that drug dealers don't just do weed therefore it is easy to get hold of other drugs off a cannabis dealer.

If it was regulated then that option is cut out. Because you regulate the strength, the amounts, the price to ensure that dealing drugs is more expensive for a drug dealer to do it than the state.

of course there would be a significant rise in the first few years of users, but it would then settle down.

[tonyh29]

Luckily it seems that the UK public are starting to see through the waffle

no sooner did you post than 2 more polls came out :-)

Opinium's figures put the Conservatives on 39%, Labour down two to 28% and the Liberal Democrats on 16%. This result would translate into a 40-seat majority for the Tories, according to the paper.

The ICM poll gives the Tories 40% - up three on last month's survey. Labour had the support of 31%, and the Liberal Democrats received 20%.

[bickster]

Agreed. Get this from the Independent - also available in many other none right wing news outlets too:

Shock as British deficit equals that of Greece

I believe it's actually projected that Britain is now in an even worse position.

Bit like saying that Marks and Spencers has the same debt level as Mr Patel's Minimart

[mjmooney]

[snowychap]

Ed Miliband promises radical Labour election manifesto

Labour will pledge an end to the era of extortionate credit in its election manifesto, and is considering big increases in the minimum wage, the introduction of free school meals for all and a reduction in the voting age to 16, Ed Miliband, the cabinet minister responsible for its drafting, reveals today.

In a Guardian interview trailing Labour's manifesto for an unprecedented fourth term, Miliband reveals that the prospectus will be about showing that Labour can lead the country to "the next phase of national renewal" and that the party "will reform both the market and the state".

The manifesto will also set out proposals for a new model of banking built round a People's Bank, drawing on the post office network, and a possible cap on credit interest rates.

Miliband said one aim would be to show that Labour's rights and responsibilities agenda "needs to go all the way to the top". The manifesto would "not promise the earth", but he said: "One of the profound issues in this election is: in a world of tough decisions, in whose interests do you make those decisions? We are going to be very clear about where money comes from in this manifesto."

The energy and climate change secretary likens the introduction of a People's Bank, in the wake of the banking crisis, to the creation of the Sure Start network of children's centres – an institutional reform that meets new demands in society and brings together poor and middle-class people. Built round the 12,000-strong network of post offices, the bank would provide capital for the hundreds of credit unions in the UK, he disclosed.

He argued: "Institutions are the things that define governments. The 1945 government was defined by its relationship with the NHS. The 1997 government was defined around rebuilding the fabric of communities through institutions like Sure Start. I think the idea of the People's Bank … is one of those ideas."

Ministers are completing talks with the Post Office on the range of banking services to be provided, and the scale of its initial capitalisation.

Miliband said: "Frankly banks have let down low-income consumers. The People's Bank can be a very serious financial institution and a competitor to the conventional private sector. One of the exciting ideas is for the People's Bank to provide the network of credit unions access to funds, but it can also become a banking alternative for a significantly wider group than just the low-income consumers. It is part of a bigger reform we need in the relationship between individuals and financial institutions."

Some consumer groups have warned that a cap on interest rates might see the suppliers of credit refuse to provide it to poor people altogether. But access to an alternative supplier of credit would reduce that risk, making a cap easier to introduce.

Miliband said: "We are looking more widely at a cap on interest rates. There is a real issue about the way in which low- income groups are being ripped off."

A review into credit card companies this month proposed smaller-scale reforms, but government sources said the option of a cap was likely to be in the manifesto. Despite historically low Bank of England base rates, the average interest charged on a credit card has reached 18.8% – the highest level since 1998. Some consumers are now paying more than 40% on the cash they have borrowed.

Miliband has been working on the manifesto for three years, and says it will offer the country a radical response to the banking and political crises.

"What people do not want after these two events is a return to business as usual. They want a sense we have learned lessons from the past. They want the next stage of national renewal," he said. "The task of the manifesto is to show that when it comes to the national renewal we are the people to deliver it, not the Conservatives."

Miliband said he favoured the introduction of votes at 16 to be included as part of a package of constitutional reforms, including changes to the voting system. "Perhaps the opportunity was not there before, but expenses has so brought into focus a sense that politics needs to change and open up. There is a new appetite for political renewal."

He also indicated the possibility of a strengthening of the minimum wage, currently £5.80 an hour, saying that reforms would go beyond tighter enforcement to examining a radical increase in its level.

He also said that, subject to an affordability test, there was "a strong case for universal free school meals. It makes a big difference in terms of nutrition. It makes a big difference in terms of concentration in classrooms."

The manifesto would also contain proposals for a more open state in which the floodgates of government data are opened to the public, so changing the relationship between citizen and state.

In a speech on Monday, Gordon Brown may suggest making one welfare benefit available exclusively online as a way of encouraging Britain's 10 million digitally excluded towards the internet.

Miliband also trailed a more interventionist European industrial policy, including both infrastructure and green investment banks.

"The old view that the conventional private sector on its own would ensure our infrastructure was built, the right sort of companies were supported and people will get the banking services they need has not worked."

He promised the manifesto would offer fresh guarantees for citizens to seek redress if the health service, police or schools let them down. The government has already announced that it will offer a private sector alternative in the case of NHS failure, a parental ballot in the case of a failing school, and a right to a neighbourhood beat meeting in the case of police.

Miliband said: "We need to be stronger in terms of the redress we offer and you will see that in the manifesto, because people have to have a sense that they are meaningful and will give them power."

It's all allusion but there is some good stuff in there along with some absolute guff.

I am, however, especially concerned with the continued reliance upon the private sector picking up the slack.

I have to say that I am very skeptical about a labour government following through with anything in these suggestions which doesn't favour the corporate environment; it just isn't in their interests.

[tonyh29]

The manifesto would "not promise the earth"

but will no doubt cost an earth

depsite billions being spent all they have done is increase the poverty gap and bankrupt a country ... And yet still they continue

These clowns have had 3 terms and caused the banking crises and now they say oh we have this great idea to make banking safe

sooner they **** off the better and the good news is they can't run for much longer

[snowychap]

caused the banking crises

Hey, that's a bit much.

They didn't do owt to stop it and may have actively encouraged the whole malarkey (as they and we, most of us, were benefiting from what led to it) but 'caused' it? Blimey, mate - that's a bit bloody bollocks.

BTW, I think you missed the idea that a manifesto might 'promise' something. :winkold:

[TheWalletInspector]

Can I vote for Hangus the monkey?

[Condimentalist]

So who's watching the program on Nick Clegg on ITV starting now instead of the footie?

Just me?

Probably.

[avfc443]

actually, may vote green TBH. Green or Lib Dem. Won't matter in my constituency, as The Jam party always get in. Too many rich rocket polishers in this area of Cheshire, sadly .....

Yes if only you lived in a poor, poverty stricken council estate, you unlucky thing.

[Condimentalist]

actually, may vote green TBH. Green or Lib Dem. Won't matter in my constituency, as The Jam party always get in. Too many rich rocket polishers in this area of Cheshire, sadly .....

Yes if only you lived in a poor, poverty stricken council estate, you unlucky thing.

I don't think that was the point he was making really, do you?

[Awol]

actually, may vote green TBH. Green or Lib Dem. Won't matter in my constituency, as The Jam party always get in. Too many rich rocket polishers in this area of Cheshire, sadly .....

Yes if only you lived in a poor, poverty stricken council estate, you unlucky thing.

I don't think that was the point he was making really, do you?

No it wasn't, but the idea that only a "rich rocket polisher" would vote Conservative is well, a bit silly.

Anyway seems we have moved from the Conservatives 'Cash for Questions' onto Labours' 'Cash for Policy'. Luuuverly.

Revealed: Labour’s cash for influence scandal

A FORMER Labour cabinet minister has boasted about how he used his government contacts to change policies in favour of businesses.

Stephen Byers, former trade and transport secretary, was secretly recorded offering himself “like a sort of cab for hire” for up £5,000 a day. He also suggested bringing Tony Blair to meet clients.

He was among several politicians recorded by an undercover reporter posing as a company executive looking to hire MPs for lobbying work.

The others included:

- Patricia Hewitt, a former health secretary, who claimed she helped to obtain a key seat on a government advisory group for a client paying her £3,000 a day.

- Geoff Hoon, the former defence secretary, offered to lead delegations to ministers and told the reporter that he was looking to turn his knowledge and contacts into “something that frankly makes money”. He said he charged £3,000 a day.

- Margaret Moran, the Luton MP who was forced to pay back £22,500 in expenses, boasted that she could ring a “girls’ gang” of colleagues on behalf of clients. Among those she named were: Jacqui Smith, the former home secretary; Hazel Blears, the former communities secretary; and Harriet Harman, the deputy leader of the Labour party.

The interviews were part of a joint investigation by The Sunday Times and Channel 4’s Dispatches programme in which 13 Labour MPs and seven Conservatives were approached.

The disclosures will raise questions about the relationship between the large number of MPs leaving parliament next month and their contacts who remain in government. It comes after David Cameron, the Conservative leader, last month said that lobbying was the next political scandal waiting to happen.

Byers, who held three cabinet portfolios from 1998 to 2002, gave specific examples of how he claimed he had changed government policy by lobbying his cabinet friends.

He claimed to have struck a secret deal with Lord Adonis, the transport secretary, last year on behalf of National Express, which he said was seeking to jettison a loss-making East Coast rail franchise without penalties. Byers said: “We agreed with Andrew ... he would be publicly very critical of National Express” as long as he agreed terms which favoured the company. The decision to terminate the franchise in July last year left a burden on the taxpayer of hundreds of millions of pounds.

Byers also claimed he could use his friendship with Lord Mandelson, the business secretary, as his “trump card” to squash government plans that did not suit his clients.

On one occasion Byers says he phoned Mandelson to put a stop to “massively bureaucratic” food labelling regulations after he had been contacted by Tesco. “Peter got it delayed and then got it amended,” Byers said. He also boasted he could get confidential information from Downing Street and could help firms which were price-fixing to get around the law.

On Friday Byers issued a statement saying that he had “exaggerated” his claims and had retracted them the day after the meeting in an email. Tesco denied any deal.

Lord Adonis and National Express denied there was any deal. However, a source close to Richard Bowker, who was chief executive at the time, said that the Byers version given to the undercover reporter was “pretty accurate”.

Hewitt offered a service helping clients to influence legislation. “If you’ve got a client who needs a particular regulation removed, then we can often package that up [for a minister],” she said.

On Friday Hewitt issued a statement saying she was offering to do the work only after she left the Commons. “I am always willing to give advice to companies who have something positive to offer our country,” she said.

Hoon revealed that he had already been offered a chairmanship of a foreign defence firm for an “embarrassing” amount of money. While making clear that he did not want a job that was predominantly lobbying, he offered to find out information on the defence policy from civil servants and said he would introduce fee-paying clients to ministers.

On Friday a lawyer for Hoon said his comments had been misrepresented and he denied ever offering to give confidential information.

A good job that Labour Ministers haven't been desperately trying to climb on the "rich rocket polisher" bandwagon and personally profit at massive expense to the tax payer, isn't it?

This country is fast turning into something resembling a banana republic.

[leviramsey]

This country is fast turning into something resembling a banana republic.

Banana republics generally have better weather though...

[Gringo]

On Friday Hewitt issued a statement saying she was offering to do the work only after she left the Commons. “I am always willing to give advice to companies who have something positive to offer our country,” she said.

hewitt's being whoring herself around since jumping ship..

A while back Gringo"]All aboard the gravy train

The former health secretary Patricia Hewitt has taken advisory jobs with two companies involved in providing medical services.

She will work as a special consultant for pharmacy group Alliance Boots and as a senior adviser for private equity firm Cinven,....

She will be working fewer days per year for Cinven, a private equity company which has taken over 25 Bupa hospitals in the UK.

...

The spokeswoman would not comment on claims that Hewitt could be paid more than £100,000 a year for the two jobs. ....

Ms Hewitt was always a keen advocate of the NHS using private sector facilities.

[Jon]

No it wasn't, but the idea that only a "rich rocket polisher" would vote Conservative is well, a bit silly.

Indeed it is. Can you point out where i've said that?

What i will say, and what i was inferring (but which you seemingly failed to grasp) was that the wealthy are more likely to vote for the tories than the poor are. That the tories draw the majority of their support from those who are "better off".

It ain't rocket science.

[Awol]

hewitt's being whoring herself around since jumping ship..

It's notable that those stupid enough to get caught have been from the New Labour tree - although maybe not surprising given the dominance of their faction within Government over the past decade. It shows that when you give up any pretence of supporting a political ideology all that remains is greed and personal ambition. When are Mandleson and Adonis being investigated for these allegations, I wonder?

This Government has been more sleazy than the Tories ever were, in itself is a remarkable display of sustained avarice and the prostitution of all principles at the expense of us, the public.

The funny thing is (as the poll on this thread indicates) many people are clearly fcuking stupid enough to consider voting them back in!

[Awol]

No it wasn't, but the idea that only a "rich rocket polisher" would vote Conservative is well, a bit silly.

Indeed it is. Can you point out where i've said that?

Oh right, I thought your statement that it "Won't matter in my constituency, as The Jam party always get in. Too many rich rocket polishers in this area of Cheshire" implied some connection between being a rich rocket polisher (how very dare they have a few bob) and voting Conservative. My mistake.

What i will say, and what i was inferring (but which you seemingly failed to grasp) was that the wealthy are more likely to vote for the tories than the poor are. That the tories draw the majority of their support from those who are "better off".

I don't think there is any longer such a class identification with voting for a political party, after all many "middle class" voters who supported the Tories in the 80's and 90's jumped ship to New Labour in 1997. It is therefore not inconceivable that many "working class" people may vote Tory, given how utterly Labour have failed to represent their interests while in office.

It ain't rocket science.

Perhaps voting demographics are not quite as simple as you wish to portray them, Jon?

[tonyh29]

Didn't the 3 happen to be the 3 who spoke out about Gordon as Leader a little while back

More payback from Mandy ??

The funny thing is (as the poll on this thread indicates) many people are clearly fcuking stupid enough to consider voting them back in!

I saw an article over the weekend written by Max Hastings that said something along the lines of the fact that Brown isn't dead an buried for this election means the British public are as deluded as brown is and are in denial as to how bad a shape the country

he probably has a point .... but I also think given the British public's goldfish span when it comes to politics nothing will really get decided until the few weeks leading to the election when the Murdoch offensive hammers it down our throats and helps the goldfish see sense

Oh right, I thought your statement that it "Won't matter in my constituency, as The Jam party always get in. Too many rich rocket polishers in this area of Cheshire" implied some connection between being a rich rocket polisher (how very dare they have a few bob) and voting Conservative. My mistake.

tbf it's an easy mistake to make , knowing Jon I also automatically assumed he the was making the implied correlation between the 2 :winkold:

[Gringo]

Oh right, I thought your statement that it "Won't matter in my constituency, as The Jam party always get in. Too many rich rocket polishers in this area of Cheshire" implied some connection between being a rich rocket polisher (how very dare they have a few bob) and voting Conservative. My mistake.

tbf it's an easy mistake to make , knowing Jon I also automatically assumed he the was making the implied correlation between the 2 :winkold:

Are people trying to say that the rich don't vote tory in the bucketloads? Or are they trying to say not all tory voters are rich rocket polishers?

[Gringo]

Didn't the 3 happen to be the 3 who spoke out about Gordon as Leader a little while back

More payback from Mandy ??

call me dave"]David Cameron warns lobbying is next political scandal

David Cameron will introduce measures to curb the lobbying industry to ensure that attempts by business to seek influence on Government policy does not become the next big political scandal.

Published: 4:00PM GMT 08 Feb 2010

Not sure about mandy - it would appear that it was wavey davey who had been given the nod and or the wink that the sting was on. It's lucky he has lots of contacts in the media to help keep him informed.....