Bollitics: VT General Election Poll #2

[peterms]

Well, could I propose an idea? Drug abuse has many unpleasant consequences, such as the effect on individuals, on neighbours, on victims of crime, and more widely on national economies and international relations.

But all that is as nothing compared to the effect of energy policy. If you could translate one into the terms of the other, Dubya and his oil mates would be the biggest gangsta in the playground, dealing to the pre-school kids and shooting the teacher who asked them to tone it down a little.

These are the people who are the real problem, who should be locked up in a deep hole on some deserted island, for all our sakes.

To ignore these international criminals and focus on some street corner **** Mr Big is entirely, shockingly, missing the point.

[snowychap]

To ignore these international criminals and focus on some street corner **** Mr Big is entirely, shockingly, missing the point.

To think that missing the bullets/blades flying in front of one's face is 'entirely missing the point' in favour of some flimsy international viewpoint is, I fear, more than just getting it wrong - it is fundamentally missing the point of international socialism.

[peterms]

To ignore these international criminals and focus on some street corner **** Mr Big is entirely, shockingly, missing the point.

To think that missing the bullets/blades flying in front of one's face is 'entirely missing the point' in favour of some flimsy international viewpoint is, I fear, more than just getting it wrong - it is fundamentally missing the point of international socialism.

Could you expand on your point a bit more?

[snowychap]

To ignore these international criminals and focus on some street corner **** Mr Big is entirely, shockingly, missing the point.

To think that missing the bullets/blades flying in front of one's face is 'entirely missing the point' in favour of some flimsy international viewpoint is, I fear, more than just getting it wrong - it is fundamentally missing the point of international socialism.

Could you expand on your point a bit more?

Which one, Peter?

[Reality]

It really is about working out the worst of two evils. Three evils if you really count the Lib Dems, but we all know they don't..so two.

[rjw63]

p.s. Beware the bear!!!!!

Pedo Bear

Or the Bear Jew?

[kidlewis]

Effectively the same entity, one wears red the other blue. New Labour (the New bit is important) has been in power since 1997 and hasn't been an atrocious failure but neither has it done much to sing the praises of and it's done a lot thats worth derision. Sent us into Iraq, monetary policy has left us, along with the rest of the world, a bit buggered. Should be the party of the common man, but actually has courted big business more. Spent a lot on public services and imo made them better but also brought with that more problems.

All that and the control freakery / big brother / invasion of civil liberties shit that both Brown and Bliar have implemented (and tried to extend further and failed)

and NuLabs return for your tax money is pretty shit as well.

'we improved the NHS' yeah you have in some areas, but the cost of it is double what it was in 2002.

Labour have made improvements, but they haven't invested wisely. Bigger government = more opportunities to waste cash, and there's that a plenty.

I think the war obviously hasn't helped. Whilst most military chiefs who were in charge in the respective war countries in the past decade have said they faced issues over equipment, government basically says that's bull and there's plenty of cash and equipment to go around.

Which if you don't count boots or body armor as equipment I guess that is true. Oh and some vehicles that are about as useful as a P reg mondeo in Iraq.

Surely Gordie was pissed of when we went in, I bet he thought 'shit thats the balance sheet screwed up ya big teethed mofo'

[snowychap]

'we improved the NHS' yeah you have in some areas, but the cost of it is double what it was in 2002.

Or what we also might call, inflation. :?

[bickster]

'we improved the NHS' yeah you have in some areas, but the cost of it is double what it was in 2002.

Or what we also might call, inflation. :?

They did spectacularly **** up on the IT side because "it sounded good" despite being told "it wont work"

[Chindie]

Drug policy is one thing I've never been able to nail a stance on.

Cannabis I don't believe is spectacularly dangerous and I've known many people who've enjoyed a casual spliff on a fairly regular occasion and they've largely been great people. Useless after a blunt but great people. Heads screwed on. After beyond cannabis I get a bit more derisory. Cocaine is a mugs drug, fashionable, expensive, largely pointless, does damage if you get unlucky. And so on up the scale.

But cannabis, largely, as a substance, fine. But you bring with it a criminal aspect that Snowy has made reference to. Is that going away if you legalise it? I doubt it. And it is the gateway drug. Both myself and my friends have seen people, not many admittedly, who push past cannabis, get into the harder stuff and wind up, well... **** in at least 1 case. And other friends, who have their head screwed on, have admitted that the desire remains to try the new stuff even though they know the consequences.

It's that, along with the criminal aspect, that makes me wary to legalsie cannabis.

Again though, I'd have to say this is probably a failing of my politcal feeling than anything else.

[leviramsey]

Hmmm, I was just reading this "BNP is free from a Ukip challenge in 80 per cent of the seats it is contesting, while Ukip has no BNP challenger in 85 per cent of the seats in which it is standing." Rather interesting.

The BNP are just UKIP in jeans

The fear when Lord Pearson got elected as the new Leader of The UK Independence Party was that UKIP would turn into a BNP Lite. Well, it seems that hasn't happened. In fact I would now say that BNP is the watered down version of UKIP.

Lord Pearson has called out for the ultimate ban on the Burka and Niqab:

“We are taking expert advice on how we could do it. It makes sense to ban the burka — or anything which conceals a woman’s face — in public buildings. But we want to make it possible to ban them in private buildings. It isn’t right that you can’t see someone’s face in an airport.”

Sound a bit extreme banning the Burka in Public and PRIVATE places (eg. your home)?

Well it sounds even more extreme when you compare it to the BNP's policy on the Burka:

BNP- Ban the Burka in all Schools.

UKIP- Ban the Burka in all public and private buildings

Lord Pearson: “We are not Muslim bashing, but this is incompatible with Britain’s values of freedom and democracy.”

The value of freedom and democracy is indeed a fantastic value to have, I agree. It is a shame how ignorant and thoughtless his comment is in context to what he is actually saying.

Lord Pearson's personal war on Islam is disgusting and unforgivable. This should not be happening in what was a Eurosceptic, Libertarian leaning Political Party in the 21st Century.

The blogger is a former UKIP activist who defected to the recently formed Libertarian Party

I got involved with The UK Independence Party at the start of last year because I believed they were the only Eurosceptic, Libertarian UK Political Party and had the best chance of getting places.

I have been involved with The UK Independence Party for a year now. In that time I worked heavily locally at the European Elections June 2009. I helped out at the Norwich North By-Election in July where I met a wide array of UKIP supporters and members. In the next few weeks I was in the pipeline to becoming Canterbury and Coast UKIP Branch Secratery and Press Officer. I am also planning on standing in the 2011 Local Elections as the UK's youngest City Council Candidate, where if elected I will become the UK's youngest City Councillor ever at the age of 18years and 6 weeks old. I would have been proud to do this under the UKIP banner, however recent changes in the Party have made me loose alot of faith and support for the Party.

I cannot stand by and watch UKIP go down the road of attacking Islam and the Burka. (See previous Blog Post "The BNP are just UKIP in jeans"). I did not join UKIP with the intention of fighting a General Election on policies that smell identical to The BNP's.

For this reason, I have decided to shift my loyalty from The UK Independence Party to The Libertarian Party (UK). I believe The Libertarian Party hold true to my core values of self ownership, liberty, freedom and democracy. They may not be ready to get representatives elected at National, European or Local Elections yet, but with work, I feel they could be a strong voice for all true Liberals in the future in UK Politics.

I look forward to working with the team at The Libertarian Party, and would also like to thank everyone who has helped me along the way at UKIP, especially the local team around Canterbury, whom I have thanked and talked to in person about this.

Thank you.

As far as a description of the libdems, I'm not sure that there is one... that party is schizophrenic by birth (being the merger of two political philosophies that mutually disagree on major issues with varying levels of vehemence).

[leviramsey]

Unfortunately sensible drug policy is also unelectable in this country. Sadly I can't see us making any serious progress on that front for a while.

Drugs are bad m'kay.

Even the US is making progress, though (with decriminalization of marijuana possession (up to 1 oz. at a time) in Massachusetts)... surely the UK can make progress as well?

I'm of the legalize everything school. I want to see heroin vending machines in stores, damn it!

[leviramsey]

'we improved the NHS' yeah you have in some areas, but the cost of it is double what it was in 2002.

Or what we also might call, inflation. :?

Outside of bubbly property, what has doubled in seven or eight years? That's an 8-10% annual rate of increase, btw... I realize that government statistics on inflation are not always the most reliable, but I'd be rather surprised if UK inflation ever ran at that rate in the past decade.

[leviramsey]

But cannabis, largely, as a substance, fine. But you bring with it a criminal aspect that Snowy has made reference to. Is that going away if you legalise it?

The US tried alcohol prohibition. The criminal element came in and took control with the associated mayhem. Alcohol was legalized. Fairly quickly the booze production, distribution, and retailing industries became about as criminal-controlled as any other industry (it varies from tier to tier... I doubt that there's any Mafia involvement with AB InBev or Diageo, but it's next to impossible to get a pouring license in my city if you don't give the Brunos a piece of the action... even then you don't exactly see the bar owners of Springfield shooting each other over turf.

[Awol]

Hmmm, I was just reading this "BNP is free from a Ukip challenge in 80 per cent of the seats it is contesting, while Ukip has no BNP challenger in 85 per cent of the seats in which it is standing." Rather interesting.

Not really, IF you ignore the hype and look at the relative positions of both parties. If previous local/euro election results are replicated in the GE then the BNP will gain in Labour heartlands, not exactly fertile territory for a party like UKIP that is to the right of the Tories. Conversely, UKIP will gain in Tory areas where traditional right wing voters are disaffected with call me Dave and Co. They would not be voting for a party that is to the political left of Labour in most aspects. Where they cross over in terms of fielding candidates will be seats that are considered up for grabs by everyone. No conspiracy here.

The comparisons between UKIP and the BNP are very weak. The single, massive overriding issue at this election is the economy. Make the wrong choices there and everything else is stuffed regardless. In that context then, the BNP economic policy is the most left wing prospectus on the political slate, a position it certainly does not share with UKIP.

As for Lord Pearson's 'personal war on Islam'...what a crock.. Whether we like it or not he is reflecting the views of a very large constituency in the UK which in itself quite a novelty really. It's also worth noting that the blogger Levi references is 16 years old. Patronising as it may be, I'll not be taking political advice from someone who is yet to sit their GCSE's.

But on the real issue:

Curb your spending, Brussels tells Gordon Brown

Gordon Brown was dealt an embarrassing blow last night when Brussels gave warning that Britain must do more to curb its spiralling debt.

The European Commission wants Labour to outline further spending cuts and spell out where the axe will fall.

The intervention, a week before the Budget, will electrify the debate over the economy. David Cameron promised in a BBC interview last night to fight the election campaign by going farther than Mr Brown in saying where cuts will be made.

The Commission is due to release its latest assessment of Britain’s plans to reduce the deficit tomorrow, but a leaked draft makes uncomfortable reading for the Prime Minister and Alistair Darling, the Chancellor.

It states: “The fiscal strategy in the convergence programme is not sufficiently ambitious and needs to be significantly reinforced.

"A credible timeframe for restoring public finances to a sustainable position requires additional fiscal tightening measures beyond those currently planned.”

It says that plans to cut spending in the current year are sufficient but raises doubts over official growth forecasts. It says that the size of the taxpayers’ stake in Britain’s banking sector is adding to worries over whether the Government can scale back its borrowing.

Figures on Thursday will show whether Britain has plunged farther into the red than the £178 billion Mr Darling forecast last December.

More on link

They may not be prepared to talk about it, but the scale of public spending cuts that are required to stave off disaster will be unparalleled in modern British history. This is the issue, but many seem happy to be distracted by relatively trivial carp.

[drat01]

The comparisons between UKIP and the BNP are very weak

Sorry Jon but they are not. There have been various UKIP members who have had links / been members of the BNP / NF before. Their policies on immigration are very alike etc

Also you cannot now start saying that the EU and its "demands" are something to consider and then be a fervent supporter of UKIP - surely that is a major contradiction?

The report if you actually read it - or what you can read to date - says that the "It says that plans to cut spending in the current year are sufficient" - which is totally against the bias of Gideon and his media friends are reporting. The EU are concerned following the issues with member states such as Greece and rightly so. The policies of Gideon (and the UKIP and BNP it would seem) are now being shot down by a lot of areas outside of the political sphere and again this is showing that a vote that brings in a Tory government will be a bad one. Luckily it seems that the UK public are starting to see through the waffle and power hungry statements of the Tory led media of Murdoch and the Mail / Torygraph etc and are now seeing that the Tory party are not the ones to take this country forward

[tonyh29]

Tory led media of Murdoch

I can't rem if i ever posted it or not but i saw some figures with UKIP's share of the vote from the local elections ..it's jumped from something like 5% to 25% in 4 years .. The BNP seem to have struck a cord with Labour heartland ,bouyed on by brown and his British jobs for British workers and other right wing policies ... and it might damage Labours vote , UKIP might damage the Tory vote ..we could be in for one crazy election

but whilst Brown carries on his scorched earth policy and ducking the election there is still a lot that could happen ...

[blandy]

...The single, massive overriding issue at this election is the economy....

It might be for you, AWOL, but it won't be for many.

And then there will be people who think it is, but who feel that of the possible candidates, there's not that much difference between what they'll actually do on the economy, so then the next most important issue becomes their discriminator.

ANd there'll be a heck of a lot of people who accept it is the most important, who feel that (say) "cuts are needed" but then think "hold on, cuts = me no job" and vote against what they may think is in the national interest in favour of what they think is in their personal interest.

And then there's things like this long read from the Indie which give another picture.

[Awol]

The comparisons between UKIP and the BNP are very weak

Sorry Jon but they are not. There have been various UKIP members who have had links / been members of the BNP / NF before. Their policies on immigration are very alike etc

Not sure if you plan to produce any evidence supporting the NF accusation mate (it's pretty serious libel otherwise) but even if you did/could, being a former member of something doesn't disqualify you from altering either your allegiance or opinion - or both. For example, many of the PLP were formerly members of the Communist Party or full on Marxists - Jack Straw and Bob Ainsworth being immediate examples of people fitting that criteria.

If UKIP were calling for repatriation I might agree they had a similar immigration policy to the BNP, but they are not. As for the "etc" well what "etc", exactly? As stated the BNP are left of Labour economically, UKIP certainly aren't, and the attempt to lump them in together with the Tories as some kind of block is simply incorrect.

Also you cannot now start saying that the EU and its "demands" are something to consider and then be a fervent supporter of UKIP - surely that is a major contradiction?

You know my feelings on the EU, that doesn't mean their warnings about our terrifying debt spiral are not valid. They are supported from very many other sources too, hardly a voice in the wilderness and the "contradiction" argument means nothing at all frankly, mate.

The report if you actually read it - or what you can read to date - says that the "It says that plans to cut spending in the current year are sufficient"

....If clearer plans are in place to go further in the following years, thereby reassuring our creditors. Currently those plans are not in place. The context of quotations are important really.

which is totally against the bias of Gideon and his media friends are reporting. The EU are concerned following the issues with member states such as Greece and rightly so.

Agreed. Get this from the Independent - also available in many other none right wing news outlets too:

Shock as British deficit equals that of Greece

I believe it's actually projected that Britain is now in an even worse position.

[kidlewis]

'we improved the NHS' yeah you have in some areas, but the cost of it is double what it was in 2002.

Or what we also might call, inflation. :?

so £110bn today is only worth £60bn in 2002?