Celebrity Scandals

[Rugeley Villa]

1 minute ago, ml1dch said:

It's not legal to sexually assault one, which is what he has been accused of. 

I know that . Of course that’s wrong but I was making a point also that it’s morally not right for a 31 year old to go with a 16 year old . 

[StefanAVFC]

4 minutes ago, El Segundo said:

I didn't get it exactly right but but on the Peterson thread you said:

"Carl Benjamin classes himself as a ‘Sensible Centrist’ so I really think we shouldn’t be listening to what people class themselves as, and look at their politics instead." 

I was being incredibly sarcastic. Villa’s fan base is stereotypically known to be more Tory and right wing. It was an ironic comment aimed at your ironic comment 

do I really have to explain this? 

[El Segundo]

2 minutes ago, Seat68 said:

Its easy enough to do one with hard left views, you haven't done that, but you could easily do it. But is it relevant to this thread. There is a Labour thread, where I am sure you will think as we are all left wingers is full of back slapping bonhomie rejoicing the workers. You would be wrong, but thats perhaps a better place for a left wing bingo card.

Well it was in response to a right wing cliche bingo card, so apologies if it is considered off topic. I happen to think it is very relevant to the kind of attitudes seem to be informing a lot of the posts about celebrity scandals.  But point taken.

[Seat68]

6 minutes ago, El Segundo said:

Well it was in response to a right wing cliche bingo card, so apologies if it is considered off topic. I happen to think it is very relevant to the kind of attitudes seem to be informing a lot of the posts about celebrity scandals.  But point taken.

It may seem as if it is political, it isn't though, the posters on here are hard left, centrist, right wing, right wing but doesnt realise they are, left wing but doesnt realise they are. There is a broad cross section. Its not politically motivated I assure you.

[El Segundo]

3 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said:

I was being incredibly sarcastic. Villa’s fan base is stereotypically known to be more Tory and right wing. It was an ironic comment aimed at your ironic comment 

do I really have to explain this? 

It didn't look sarcastic to me, but if you say so, then apologies.  Does that mean you do think we should accept people are what they claim to be rather than what they say and do?   

And this isn't Villa's fan base, it's a tiny sub-set of them, and there are posts on the Brand thread and the Peterson thread that, to me at least,  suggest some rather extreme left wing views. 

As you say it's a stereotypical view to say the majority of Villa fans come from a couple of posh areas, and that as such they would be right wing or Tories.  It's patently not true - for example what about  Erdington, Kingstanding, Great Barr?  I live in Sutton Coldfield, I've never voted Tory in my life and would never do so.  I regard myself as a moderate, left of centre, a "soft" socialist.  I have dislike and distaste for extreme political views of all hues.  I also disagree quite strongly with a lot of what the so-called progressive left do and say.  Not the principles, which I can see are are based on kindness, inclusivity, equality, supporting the disenfranchised and marginalised, it's more the authoritarian, brook no dissent way some of them go about policing the application of those principles.      

[StefanAVFC]

1 minute ago, El Segundo said:

It didn't look sarcastic to me, but if you say so, then apologies.  Does that mean you do think we should accept people are what they claim to be rather than what they say and do?   

And this isn't Villa's fan base, it's a tiny sub-set of them, and there are posts on the Brand thread and the Peterson thread that, to me at least,  suggest some rather extreme left wing views. 

As you say it's a stereotypical view to say the majority of Villa fans come from a couple of posh areas, and that as such they would be right wing or Tories.  It's patently not true - for example what about  Erdington, Kingstanding, Great Barr?  I live in Sutton Coldfield, I've never voted Tory in my life and would never do so.  I regard myself as a moderate, left of centre, a "soft" socialist.  I have dislike and distaste for extreme political views of all hues.  I also disagree quite strongly with a lot of what the so-called progressive left do and say.  Not the principles, which I can see are are based on kindness, inclusivity, equality, supporting the disenfranchised and marginalised, it's more the authoritarian, brook no dissent way some of them go about policing the application of those principles.      

**** hell man I’m not interested in a huge debate about a throwaway joke. 
 

Stop taking everything so seriously. 

Edited September 20, 2023 by StefanAVFC

[El Segundo]

Just now, StefanAVFC said:

**** hell man I’m not interested in a huge debate about a throwaway joke. 

There's a joke thread you know.  Try and make them funny though eh?

[StefanAVFC]

3 minutes ago, El Segundo said:

There's a joke thread you know.  Try and make them funny though eh?

Sorry I forgot that you can only make jokey comments in the designated joke thread. I presume one of the mods will be along to give me warning points soon. It’s like 1984 again. 

[El Segundo]

2 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said:

Sorry I forgot that you can only make jokey comments in the designated joke thread. I presume one of the mods will be along to give me warning points soon. It’s like 1984 again. 

Well you say that, I assume sarcastically, but....

[Xela]

15 hours ago, chrisp65 said:

Imagine my disappointment as I’m scrolling to the end to write ‘the ugly ones’.

I did ponder about posting it. Is it bad taste?

I'm glad I went with it. 

[Rugeley Villa]

Villa’s fan base is more right wing. Let’s get one thing clear though there’s a difference between right wing and the far right. I consider myself centre leaning more towards the right. I always thought Brand was a leftie but turns out he’s moved across to the right. 

Edited September 20, 2023 by Rugeley Villa

[Xela]

1 hour ago, KentVillan said:

I’m willing to believe much of Russell Brand’s sex life was consensual fun with women who knew what they were getting into and never got pressured into much.

But that story about the 16-year-old school girl has really bothered me. I don’t know how you can hear that and not think this is very nasty behaviour.

100%. His behaviour when leaving that voicemail for Andrew Sachs was nasty as well. 

[Rugeley Villa]

2 minutes ago, Xela said:

100%. His behaviour when leaving that voicemail for Andrew Sachs was nasty as well. 

I remember that . Jonathan Ross, too? That was aired on the radio I believe too. All seen as good banter back then 

[AvfcRigo82]

15 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said:

I know that . Of course that’s wrong but I was making a point also that it’s morally not right for a 31 year old to go with a 16 year old . 

Sticking with this claimant in question, Correct and 100% it's a moral eye raiser indeed. Legally consensual or not. I guess others will voice that it's no different to a 24yr old dating/marrying a 39yr old and the whole "age is just a number" metaphor is swung. But for me, it's still morally wrong. To a sex crazed famous person who probably feels untouchable and they can do what they want? Obviously not. They do because they can, whilst still playing the legal age and consent card.

It's interestingly scary to see how some young girls look older than they are too when donning certain attire and make up etc. it enhances appearance of age on most occasions and easily pass off as 19/20 when they're only actually 15/16.

Another interesting thing is the fact that they dated for a number of months!

My take on it so far is that it's not like she wasn't aware of who and what she was getting involved with really was it? Combined with the fact he's older and famous which would come as a buzz to these younger generation females I would imagine. (I'm 16 and im getting off with a celebrity!! Im the bollocks!) However, She also could have not got involved with him to start with and said no upon his advances if it was ever a concern to her at any time.

It appears that there could be a few  scenarios at play now on this (conspiracy theories here we come) where either Brand called it off eventually and she didnt like it how it ended and that she was probably just discarded? Has she remained bitter about getting involved in the relationship in the first place or now seconds thoughts all these years later? Is it she being targeted and financially persuaded now to anoymously cry wolf against him? (Which has since came to light that is how the people behind producing the this program on RB apparantly attempted to get people to speak in a negative light against him or sod off basically). Is she using something he joked about in a DVD against him because it ties in with her accusation? She dated him for a few months ffs!

It also doesn't rule out that it also what the claimant describes genuinely did take place and that's the reason it ended?

However, if eventually found guilty of other untoward against him then that remains to be seen and justice will rightly have it's day.

The claimant at question on this accusation perhaps went into the whole thing to start with slightly cocky and naive at such an age?, and when obviously getting involved with such a famous showbiz person - and notorious and self confessed sex addict - it was always going to be quite the fairground. I'm not quite sure how they anticipated or expected things would be in dating such a animated character.. nor end?

Again, For clarity, I am not discarding the allegations made by the claimant on this occasion in anyway, just trying to keep to a neutral side of the debate.

[Rugeley Villa]

At 16 you’re still not fully matured and probably don’t fully know what you want .

[AvfcRigo82]

24 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said:

I remember that . Jonathan Ross, too? That was aired on the radio I believe too. All seen as good banter back then 

Yep. That was an idiotic act for sure.

Talking of banyer back then, We are going back to the years where woman were sexing themselves across FHM, Zoo, Maxim etc. Boobs getting enhanced etc.

Joking about sex and innuendos was "the in thing".. But because we've been taught what is morally not accceptable over time since then, the way we think and see things nowadays makes it now suddenly "outdated and not in good taste".

I suppose Jimmy Carr is in for it and going to look like the devil incarnate in 20years when we look back on his views and humour and his stand-ups etc. that currently still appear to be humorous and morally accepted within society - or the current bantz and the norm of today.

[Davkaus]

11 minutes ago, AvfcRigo82 said:

 

My take on it so far is that it's not like she wasn't aware of who and what she was getting involved with really was it? Combined with the fact he's older and famous which would come as a buzz to these younger generation females I would imagine. (I'm 16 and im getting off with a celebrity!! Im the bollocks!) However, She also could have not got involved with him to start with and said no upon his advances if it was ever a concern to her at any time.

 

While this is one of the allegations that isn't (not my knowledge) a crime - she could legally consent - I think this is a very charitable perspective towards Brand.

She could have said no at any point, hell, the taxi driver tried to talk her out of going in because he knew what was happening, but in my eyes based on what is alleged, even if she's above the age of consent, she was groomed.

It's the behaviour of a sexual predator to "date" a 16 year old when you're 31 (it's legal - it shouldn't be). It's the behaviour of a sexual predator to tell your 16 year old girlfriend to not tell any of their friends about you. It's the behaviour of a sexual predator to prep your girlfriend with lies to tell her family to hide your relationship. It's the behaviour of a knowing sexual predator to know he was in the clear legally but to emphasise to her that she shouldn't send any naughty photos, because he knew he'd get done for child porn (I've already made the point it's disgusting that our laws enable an adult to shag a person when they can't legally look at a photo of their tits). and that's without getting into the alleged physical abuse.

She was legal, but there's a power imbalance there, and the controlling and calculated behaviour to hide their relationship has all the hallmarks of a groomer. Frankly, if he hasn't broken the law, then the laws may not be fit for purpose.

Edited September 20, 2023 by Davkaus

[AvfcRigo82]

Yep, It's not good.

6 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

the laws may not be fit for purpose.

And how many times have we heard this before.

[Chindie]

The 16yo stuff (sexual assault set aside) generally, is not illegal but is immoral and 'dodgy', and did have the hallmarks of grooming. It's a bad look and gives a bad impression of ones character thing rather than something that is a criminal matter.

I'm sure it's perfectly possible, if very rare, for a genuine and balanced relationship between a 16yo and a 31yo to occur. There are mature minded 16yos, that are worldly and intelligent beyond what their age would suggest, but there's not many of them. As such generally that kind of relationship is going to have an element of the older party using the younger, because the dynamic isn't equal, the parties aren't balanced in what they bring to the relationship and the influence they can have on the other, which makes it grim. 

[Oaks]

I don't think many clubs have political leanings in this country. Maybe Liverpool for obvious reasons. To suggest Villa is a more right leaning club blatantly comes from them lot across the city to try and create this working class of the city vibe.