Indigo Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 The 6/not a 6 debate on seemingly every player we're linked to is wild to me. Regardless of how good he is, how much money he'd cost and whether it'd be worth it, the majority of his best output is done defensively and I just skimmed through Brighton's average positions for the games he played in this season and in more or less all of them he is the deepest of their midfield, with his average position often being around the base of the centre circle in their own half. To all intents and purposes he is a defensive midfielder. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazrim Posted January 30, 2022 Share Posted January 30, 2022 If Bissouma isn't a defensive minded midfielder, he isn't anything really. His attacking output is nothing to write home about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinker Posted January 31, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted January 31, 2022 (edited) 10 hours ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said: Not sure if you're joking or being serious, but something like this wouldn't surprise me. Since the financial meltdown, my guess is Barca have found creative and more.intelligent ways of flexing their power. Identify longer term targets, young with great potential. Dangle enough carrots in front of them to make sure they don't sign new contracts at their clubs. Meaning Barcelona can eventually get them on Frees and nominal fees, slowly rebuilding a new squad for the future. By the time the initial phase of this is ready to go they will be ready to make more ridiculous financial decisions to get back to where they " should be ". Especially for South American players , at the end of the day, Barcelona, is Barcelona. I wasn't joking, his head has definitely been turned for some time and he's turned down countless opportunities to increase his wages by not signing a new deal, his still on his original contract from nearly 3 years ago. Not sure he would do this to sign for Spurs or Arsenal who aren't challenging at the top and don't offer huge wages. Problem for Barcelona will be the huge wage bill , it will be ok if they can build value into players but if they go there and fail then they are stuck with massive overheads with no value... Dougie may flourish with more space in the middle , that the Spanish league offer's. I would rather keep him than not but he's not the most important player we have. The real problem is stopping us losing other players like this, with Jack and Dougie going it may get other players thinking their future is somewhere else and that's a much bigger problem when trying to build . We have to keep the contracts long and get the players to buy into us building to match their ambitions. Edited January 31, 2022 by tinker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MentalM Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 Yesterdays news makes this transfer a no go until the matter with Bissouma is resolved legally to me. Cant fathom anyone believing we should buy him until the police case clears his name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAMAICAN-VILLAN Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 (edited) 17 minutes ago, MentalM said: Yesterdays news makes this transfer a no go until the matter with Bissouma is resolved legally to me. Cant fathom anyone believing we should buy him until the police case clears his name. From what I've heard/read, Bissouma is alleged to have slapped a girl on the butt at a nightclub. Greenwood is alleged to ( With Image, Video and Voice ) Have beat the shit out of a woman and raped her. Massive difference, but from a " sensitivity " standpoint, you might be right ? Edited January 31, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterSw Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 15 minutes ago, MentalM said: Yesterdays news makes this transfer a no go until the matter with Bissouma is resolved legally to me. Cant fathom anyone believing we should buy him until the police case clears his name. 100% Is there any update with the case? Gone very quiet. Would him being able to fly to Africa for AFCON be any indication of the way the case is going? My expert Netflix knowledge tells me that suspects are sometimes asked to surrender passports Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MentalM Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 1 minute ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said: From what I've heard/read, Bissouma is alleged to have slapped a girl on the butt at a nightclub. Greenwood is alleged to ( With Image, Video and Voice ) Have beat the shit out of a woman and raped her. Massive difference, but from a " sensitivity " standpoint, you might be right ? Yeah, but the case yesterday kinda told me what we heard and whats going on isnt the same. The rumours prior to yesterday about MG was that he had slapped his GF, and then the voice recordings come out... I dont believe Bissouma has done anything of that sort, but until the matter is resolved I believe the right thing is to keep a distance. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vive_La_Villa Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 3 minutes ago, MentalM said: Yeah, but the case yesterday kinda told me what we heard and whats going on isnt the same. The rumours prior to yesterday about MG was that he had slapped his GF, and then the voice recordings come out... I dont believe Bissouma has done anything of that sort, but until the matter is resolved I believe the right thing is to keep a distance. If anybody signs him it would suggest the matter is as good as resolved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panto_Villan Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 2 minutes ago, MentalM said: Yeah, but the case yesterday kinda told me what we heard and whats going on isnt the same. The rumours prior to yesterday about MG was that he had slapped his GF, and then the voice recordings come out... I dont believe Bissouma has done anything of that sort, but until the matter is resolved I believe the right thing is to keep a distance. Greenwood was arrested a few hours after the police got involved. Bissouma has been allowed to leave the country, which makes me very sceptical the alleged offences are on anywhere near the same scale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MentalM Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 4 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: If anybody signs him it would suggest the matter is as good as resolved. 3 minutes ago, Panto_Villan said: Greenwood was arrested a few hours after the police got involved. Bissouma has been allowed to leave the country, which makes me very sceptical the alleged offences are on anywhere near the same scale. I still believe it should be 100% resolved before any transfer should be discussed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PerryBarrPet Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 38 minutes ago, MentalM said: Yesterdays news makes this transfer a no go until the matter with Bissouma is resolved legally to me. Cant fathom anyone believing we should buy him until the police case clears his name. What happened yesterday? If he’s not been charged then his name remains clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PerryBarrPet Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 10 minutes ago, MentalM said: I still believe it should be 100% resolved before any transfer should be discussed Guilty till proved innocent huh? Not in this country or any other country not ruled by a tyrannical regime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam-AVFC Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 (edited) 5 minutes ago, PerryBarrPet said: Guilty till proved innocent huh? Not in this country or any other country not ruled by a tyrannical regime. You know people aren't actually innocent until they get the verdict, at which point they become guilty? @MentalM has said nothing about presuming guilt, he's just saying he'd want any investigation to definitely be over so we can be more confident in his character. People use 'innocent until proven guilty' in such a stupid way. It's a principle to make sure people get a fair trial based on robust evidence and is nothing to do with the truth. Otherwise Epstein must be innocent of most of the stuff he was accused of as he died before he was proven guilty, right? Personally I'd also feel uncomfortable us signing someone like Ronaldo who was 'innocent' on a technicality. Edited January 31, 2022 by Sam-AVFC 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MentalM Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 3 minutes ago, PerryBarrPet said: Guilty till proved innocent huh? Not in this country or any other country not ruled by a tyrannical regime. He is under police investigation. Common sense to await a conclusion to the investigation before you hire a person 7 minutes ago, PerryBarrPet said: What happened yesterday? If he’s not been charged then his name remains clear. Yesterday was regarding MG, which give anything regarding sexual assaults a bad taste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PerryBarrPet Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 3 minutes ago, MentalM said: He is under police investigation. Common sense to await a conclusion to the investigation before you hire a person Yesterday was regarding MG, which give anything regarding sexual assaults a bad taste This is nonsense. What MG is involved in has no, repeat no, bearing on the issue here. Sexual assaults leave more than just a bad taste but you cannot question one issue by referring to another disconnected issue - unless of course you prefer the ‘judgement’ of social media. On to Bissouma: what is the present state of the investigation? From previous posts in this thread two people were questioned over the incident - one a 40+ male is on conditional bale, Bissouma is either not on bail or is on unconditional bail. The fact that Bissouma was allowed to leave the country suggests there is little against him. Certainly a sensible employer would want to understand fully the facts around this case so if about to be charged no deal. If charge unlikely then a contract with a break clause could be used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MentalM Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 6 minutes ago, PerryBarrPet said: This is nonsense. What MG is involved in has no, repeat no, bearing on the issue here. Sexual assaults leave more than just a bad taste but you cannot question one issue by referring to another disconnected issue - unless of course you prefer the ‘judgement’ of social media. On to Bissouma: what is the present state of the investigation? From previous posts in this thread two people were questioned over the incident - one a 40+ male is on conditional bale, Bissouma is either not on bail or is on unconditional bail. The fact that Bissouma was allowed to leave the country suggests there is little against him. Certainly a sensible employer would want to understand fully the facts around this case so if about to be charged no deal. If charge unlikely then a contract with a break clause could be used. Then we obviously disagree. The MG case is reminding me on how sickening sexual assaults are, so it reminded me on how much I am against this signing at the current state. to me, its enough that he is under investigation to warrant a no go on a transfer. I dont know the present state of the investigation, but I know there is a investigation thats thats what matters to me in regards of a signing. No different to me if he is allowed to leave the country or not. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PerryBarrPet Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 18 minutes ago, Sam-AVFC said: You know people aren't actually innocent until they get the verdict, at which point they become guilty? @MentalM has said nothing about presuming guilt, he's just saying he'd want any investigation to definitely be over so we can be more confident in his character. People use 'innocent until proven guilty' in such a stupid way. It's a principle to make sure people get a fair trial based on robust evidence and is nothing to do with the truth. Otherwise Epstein must be innocent of most of the stuff he was accused of as he died before he was proven guilty, right? Personally I'd also feel uncomfortable us signing someone like Ronaldo who was 'innocent' on a technicality. No personal insult meant but this is drivel. “People aren’t actually innocent until they get the verdict” no,no,no. In this country any person stands innocent and the burden of proof sits with the prosecution. A not guilty verdict clears them of all charges against them at that time. Innocence is maintained not ‘re-established. Any idea of a separate ‘truth’ is for social media users to debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PerryBarrPet Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 1 minute ago, MentalM said: Then we obviously disagree. The MG case is reminding me on how sickening sexual assaults are, so it reminded me on how much I am against this signing at the current state. to me, its enough that he is under investigation to warrant a no go on a transfer. I dont know the present state of the investigation, but I know there is a investigation thats thats what matters to me in regards of a signing. No different to me if he is allowed to leave the country or not. Fair enough we should agree to disagree. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam-AVFC Posted January 31, 2022 Share Posted January 31, 2022 Just now, PerryBarrPet said: No personal insult meant but this is drivel. “People aren’t actually innocent until they get the verdict” no,no,no. In this country any person stands innocent and the burden of proof sits with the prosecution. A not guilty verdict clears them of all charges against them at that time. Innocence is maintained not ‘re-established. Any idea of a separate ‘truth’ is for social media users to debate. No offence taken. Of course you are innocent until proven guilty in the eyes of the law. I am a social media user, not a court of law so quite happy to debate with you, another social media user. In the Bissouma case we don't really have a clue what happened or what, if anything, is going on with the investigation. I think some people just think it would be good for any investigation to be over before signing him as it means the police don't believe they can prove any guilt, which would ease a lot of concerns. We'd look a bit silly signing someone still innocent, who gets charged a week later and convicted a few months after. As above it's probably best to agree to disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted January 31, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted January 31, 2022 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Sam-AVFC said: I think some people just think it would be good for any investigation to be over Do investigations ever get announced as being over? Surely the investigation would essentially continue indefinitely (even if no one is working on it) until more evidence is brought to light of any alleged claims? Edited January 31, 2022 by PieFacE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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