Made In Aston Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: This be a great idea. But obviously likes of city Newcastle united wont agree to this You would think most other clubs would agree to it though. It's getting to the point where the middle-east state owned clubs are in their own mini league. When you have got clubs as big and rich as Liverpool or Man Utd struggling to be competitive then you know there is a problem. Edited June 13, 2023 by Made In Aston Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted June 13, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted June 13, 2023 Who's gonna vote against? You'd assume Citeh, United, NUFC, Chelsea maybe - but Spurs and Liverpool surely would welcome it, and then you'd think everyone else.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 14 minutes ago, duke313 said: I'm sure the likes of City, United etc will find creative ways around a cap. The only way around it is falsifying accounts and finding ways to pay players secretly not through the club. The former is illegal in law, that's a financial crime. The latter is a creative way around the rules. I can assume they'll try to find ways. But with a football regulator and the threat of Super League gone. There's a lot more power with the League than with the big clubs. The dynamic has shifted 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 4 minutes ago, CVByrne said: The only way around it is falsifying accounts and finding ways to pay players secretly not through the club. The former is illegal in law, that's a financial crime. The latter is a creative way around the rules. I can assume they'll try to find ways. But with a football regulator and the threat of Super League gone. There's a lot more power with the League than with the big clubs. The dynamic has shifted Don't know the details yet, but couldn't they just increase incentive bonuses? Things like goal bonuses, clean sheet etc, unless there is cap on them also. Signing on bonuses would go up massively, again unless they capped them. 3rd part sponsorships? Don't think increasing any of them would be fraud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Folski Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 6 minutes ago, duke313 said: Don't know the details yet, but couldn't they just increase incentive bonuses? Things like goal bonuses, clean sheet etc, unless there is cap on them also. Signing on bonuses would go up massively, again unless they capped them. 3rd part sponsorships? Don't think increasing any of them would be fraud. It's all part of a salary, simply put payments to players would be capped. Maybe they can pay their wives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 22 minutes ago, Nigel said: does it need unanimous support? I believe it has to have a 16-4 vote in favour to win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QldVilla Posted June 13, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted June 13, 2023 7 minutes ago, duke313 said: Don't know the details yet, but couldn't they just increase incentive bonuses? Things like goal bonuses, clean sheet etc, unless there is cap on them also. Signing on bonuses would go up massively, again unless they capped them. 3rd part sponsorships? Don't think increasing any of them would be fraud. If they’re going to the player, they would be considered part of the players salary. If this came to fruition, the clubs would have to leave some room under their salary cap to cater for player goal bonuses etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 The proposal is for the bottom placed teams TV money to be used as an "anchor". Teams could then spend up to 4 times this in player wages. Official Premier League figures for the 2021-22 season show the team finishing 20th, Norwich City, were paid £100.6 million in TV money, so if wage bills were restricted to four times that sum it would set the maximum at £402.4 million. The club with the highest wage bill that season were Manchester United, with £384 million, which would have been inside the hypothetical limit. So, it's not going to have any impact at all then then unless the TV money goes down drastically. Waste of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 5 minutes ago, QldVilla said: If they’re going to the player, they would be considered part of the players salary. If this came to fruition, the clubs would have to leave some room under their salary cap to cater for player goal bonuses etc. How can you factor in the number of goals somebody will score? Or clean sheets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted June 13, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted June 13, 2023 Just now, duke313 said: How can you factor in the number of goals somebody will score? Or clean sheets? Ask Ivan Toney? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted June 13, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted June 13, 2023 8 minutes ago, duke313 said: The proposal is for the bottom placed teams TV money to be used as an "anchor". Teams could then spend up to 4 times this in player wages. Official Premier League figures for the 2021-22 season show the team finishing 20th, Norwich City, were paid £100.6 million in TV money, so if wage bills were restricted to four times that sum it would set the maximum at £402.4 million. The club with the highest wage bill that season were Manchester United, with £384 million, which would have been inside the hypothetical limit. So, it's not going to have any impact at all then then unless the TV money goes down drastically. Waste of time. Unless they set it at x3.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 18 minutes ago, duke313 said: Don't know the details yet, but couldn't they just increase incentive bonuses? Things like goal bonuses, clean sheet etc, unless there is cap on them also. Signing on bonuses would go up massively, again unless they capped them. 3rd part sponsorships? Don't think increasing any of them would be fraud. No squad cost is all money paid to players and head coach and any transfer fee amortisation and agent fees. That's the definition. So bonuses would be included. I imagine it would be like La Liga where teams submit projections and then end of season there's a validation (ie look back on actuals). All the information is kept centrally by the Premier League. Bonuses would be tied to prize money. As long as the total possible bonuses keeps squad cost below the cap then it's fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 14 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: I believe it has to have a 16-4 vote in favour to win Where did you find this out? I thought it was just a 14-6 required Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 Just now, CVByrne said: Where did you find this out? I thought it was just a 14-6 required Im sure i read something that it needs 16 votes to get passed through but not 100% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 10 minutes ago, duke313 said: The proposal is for the bottom placed teams TV money to be used as an "anchor". Teams could then spend up to 4 times this in player wages. Official Premier League figures for the 2021-22 season show the team finishing 20th, Norwich City, were paid £100.6 million in TV money, so if wage bills were restricted to four times that sum it would set the maximum at £402.4 million. The club with the highest wage bill that season were Manchester United, with £384 million, which would have been inside the hypothetical limit. So, it's not going to have any impact at all then then unless the TV money goes down drastically. Waste of time. Firstly it'll be squad cost and not wages. Same calculation as how UEFA require. Secondly it's not clear if the cap is set permanently as 4 x the current TV revenue of bottom club or if it is always 4 x of the TV revenue at that time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 2 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: Im sure i read something that it needs 16 votes to get passed through but not 100% Quote The Premier League AGM takes place at the close of each season, at which time the relegated clubs transfer their shares to the clubs promoted into the Premier League from the Football League Championship. Clubs have the opportunity to propose new rules or amendments at the Shareholder meeting. Each Member Club is entitled to one vote and all rule changes and major commercial contracts require the support of at least a two-thirds vote, or 14 clubs, to be agreed. About the Premier League - Organising Body of the Competition 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 1 minute ago, CVByrne said: Thanks 14 ia even better as barring the 3 state clubs united newcastle and city could only see chelsea siding with them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke313 Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 1 minute ago, Demitri_C said: Thanks 14 ia even better as barring the 3 state clubs united newcastle and city could only see chelsea siding with them I think it would only be those 4 anyway. Liverpool, Spurs and Arsenal would probably welcome a cap, to reel City in. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QldVilla Posted June 13, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted June 13, 2023 15 minutes ago, duke313 said: How can you factor in the number of goals somebody will score? Or clean sheets? You would get an idea of previous seasons with a player and work on those numbers. It’s never at exact science, but Watkins for example, if you worked on 17 goals a season you wouldn’t be far off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted June 13, 2023 Share Posted June 13, 2023 32 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: Thanks 14 ia even better as barring the 3 state clubs united newcastle and city could only see chelsea siding with them Yes, Liverpool Spurs and Arsenal would be in favour. They can't compete financially with the others so there's like 3 tiers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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