Premier League 2019-2020 Thread

[sidcow]

4 hours ago, Mark_1989 said:

Agreed - this notion of starting again is a coping mechanism strategy.

Sounds great but in reality never happens like that - just a way for people to kid themselves and try to feel better about life.

Actually it does, Newcastle twice in recent history and West Ham came back first time of asking. 

We won't though, it'll be another difficult and horrendous time for us if we go down again because we never do anything easily. 

[sidcow]

3 hours ago, useless said:

Not sure how me saying that there's apparently a legal agreement between the Premier league and the football league saying that three teams have to come up and three go down, means that I'm desperate for us to be relegated... I literally just composed the following passage on the previous page of this thread...

 

I meant that pretty much every post you put on this thread is about either how the league has to be finished when most feel it should be voided, or that they will auto relegate us if they don't complete the league.  It was not meant about this post in isolation, just the prevailing theme. It's puzzling. 

[useless]

The Dutch league hasn't been voided the league as it stands now after twenty six games is going to stand as the final table, they've just decided not relegate anyone as presumably they feel that would be unfair, and they're not awarding anyone the title either as it's so close, AZ Alkmaar and Ajax are on the same points, but they are using the table as it stands now to determine who will qualify for Europe.

[useless]

I've never said that the league has to be finshed, I've said that the footballing authorites will be desperate for it to be finished. I've also only said that I believe that te league is more likely to be decided on the table as it stands now or using PPG average, than the season being null and voided. Not sure how any of those things equate to me being desperate for us to be relegated.

Would like to see even just one of my posts quoted from this thread or any other that looks anything remotely like I'm 'desperate for us to be relegated' or that's any kind of 'prevailing theme',  also ironic that that post is liked by someone who's constantly going on about not minding  us being back in the championship because they hate the premier league so much.

Edited April 25, 2020 by useless

[sidcow]

2 hours ago, Nabby said:

I wonder also if legally not relegating teams is a better position for the PL than relegating and dealing with legal challenges. 

Yes, exactly this.

And the EFL would also have legal challenges from the teams not chosen for promotion who feel they may have got a chance of promotion.  Just choosing who goes up and who goes down on an arbitrary decision would be madness. 

[VillaChris]

5 hours ago, nick76 said:

Took us three years last time and look how far behind the rest of the PL now after spending 140m.  That also included having some quality loans signings to get us up.  Nah, I think it’ll be a disaster to go down. Always sounds great, rebuilding with talent and all that but it’s a slog, very hard and not nice.

I'm not really bothered. We went down last time in a state of chaos and not like we really sorted out those issues in first half of the season yet we still rebuilt well enough to be one game from going up 18 months later. 3 years to bounce back isn't that long when you compare us to Leeds, Forest and Sheff Weds. Stoke are struggling to get back aswell. I've said before we have a much better squad than last time we went down aswell. Add in still  being able to attract good loans like last time.

Think the issue for me is majority of next season will be BCD so you we'll all get detached a fair bit whether you have a season ticket, get down for the midweek games and odd Saturday one like I have been doing this season or you're just a one trip a season fan. We're all in the same boat.

One thing that dosen't add up to me. All the praise for the owners yet people expecting a pretty poor season back down in the championship. Last time we went down Lerner had no interest and sold up within days and we then had the kid in sweet shop style of Xia with next to no long term planning (especially if we didn't go up within two years).

Do people not have confidence in Wes and Nas to let DS go if they don't think he's capable of top 2 finish, either in the summer or early on in the season? Or change our transfer strategy so we can make signings that hit the ground running, that is much easier in championship than premier league. Usually clubs with good owners and clear decision making are the ones at the top of the championship.

I'd rather stay in premier league of course but it feels a bit pointless to me if we continue gambling on unproven players with majority of our summer dealings. Will most likely be another bottom 6 season whenever next season is especially with a likely Grealish void. Need to start flexing our muscle sooner or later.

Edited April 24, 2020 by VillaChris

[Mantis]

If we did go down there are no guarantees, but we'd be in a much better shape to go straight back up automatically than we were last time, although I think Smith would definitely have to go.

[Mark_1989]

40 minutes ago, sidcow said:

Actually it does, Newcastle twice in recent history and West Ham came back first time of asking. 

We won't though, it'll be another difficult and horrendous time for us if we go down again because we never do anything easily. 

I would hardly say either them have re grouped and  come back a success. Newcastle now have optimism with likely new owners but their team is just as bad as ours and they dislike Bruce - except for a few fortunate wins they could easily be fighting relegation and West Ham utter shambles too. 

[Zatman]

28 minutes ago, Mantis said:

If we did go down there are no guarantees, but we'd be in a much better shape to go straight back up automatically than we were last time, although I think Smith would definitely have to go.

if we go down due to a technicality then it would be stupid to sack Smith. A. it would be undeserved and b. I cant think of any managers available except the Warnock/Bruce bullshit type that are promotion experts 

[sidcow]

5 minutes ago, Mark_1989 said:

I would hardly say either them have re grouped and  come back a success. Newcastle now have optimism with likely new owners but their team is just as bad as ours and they dislike Bruce - except for a few fortunate wins they could easily be fighting relegation and West Ham utter shambles too. 

I was talking about coming straight back up again instead of staying down a few years. 

[PaulC]

The decision by Eredivisie is totally unfair on Cambuur and I think if they were to do it with the Premier League Leeds and West Brom would be in a much stronger position to sue. 

[Zatman]

3 minutes ago, PaulC said:

The decision by Eredivisie is totally unfair on Cambuur and I think if they were to do it with the Premier League Leeds and West Brom would be in a much stronger position to sue. 

the coronavirus has killed many people and ruined lives forever, I am sure an extra season of playing football in 2nd division will be OK for Cambuur and West Brom though not sure whats so special about either status

[Nabby]

14 minutes ago, Zatman said:

if we go down due to a technicality then it would be stupid to sack Smith. A. it would be undeserved and b. I cant think of any managers available except the Warnock/Bruce bullshit type that are promotion experts 

We are 2nd Bottom any technicality in going down will be based on that , he has to be judged on that.In terms of manager , Leeds got Bielsa ,Wolves Nuno we could get someone just as left field /off the radar also Warnock retired /Bruce been here and sacked so off the top of my head I can't think of any manager like that that is around now. TBH if your going down the route of proven promotion maybe Jokanovic if he fancied leaving Qatar.

Anyway the Sun seem to think the league will start again but their reasoning , it needs to end to get the transfer window open to allow money to flow seems rather flawed when other papers are reporting money is tight and even United say they won't spend alot.Which is why if the Newcastle take over goes ahead I think they will have it alot easier in terms of money being spent that City as will be little competition for transfers

[PaulC]

16 minutes ago, Zatman said:

the coronavirus has killed many people and ruined lives forever, I am sure an extra season of playing football in 2nd division will be OK for Cambuur and West Brom though not sure whats so special about either status

May as well make this thread null and void then because none of it matters anyway. 

[sidcow]

32 minutes ago, PaulC said:

The decision by Eredivisie is totally unfair on Cambuur and I think if they were to do it with the Premier League Leeds and West Brom would be in a much stronger position to sue. 

If the season is voided I don't see Leeds or West Brom have ANY chance of success in suing. 

We however 100% would if relegated. 

[useless]

Albion are only six points ahead of Fulham, Leeds are only seven points ahead of them, in fact there was a not too far fetched scenario where either of Leeds or Albion could have dropped out of the top two within a week if the season had have carried on as normal. If it's wrong to relegate us based on an incomplete season (which it is), then it's equally wrong to promote either of those two based on an incomplete season.

As for us going down it should never be seen as acceptable, and certainly not being out of the premier league for three years, the likes of Leeds, Wednesday and Forest were in much less advantageous positions than us when they went down, a more direct comparison to our relegation would be Newcastle and West Ham when they were relegated, both of whom came straight back up. Frankly we need to get back to a place where battling relegation from the premeir league is seen as unacceptable

[VillaChris]

1 hour ago, Mantis said:

If we did go down there are no guarantees, but we'd be in a much better shape to go straight back up automatically than we were last time, although I think Smith would definitely have to go.

I can't see him getting sacked if we were just relegated on the spot with no more games played. Yes not great to be in relegation zone in mid March but many teams have still stayed up from that point so think board would give him the chance again next season.

He'd have same timescale than as Steve Bruce. Shouldn't be a massive overhaul of squad so first 10 games up to October to get us firmly in top 6. SB didn't so he was on his way. Think that would be fair enough.

[useless]

It wouldn't be the greatest surprise if he was sacked, John Percy was tweeting that his job was on the line if we didn't get a positive result against Chelsea, and there were also stories about Pitarch losing his job as well, so it seems those running the club weren't pleased with the way things were going. Think that our form last season in the championship will probably save him, but I'd expect the minimum requirement to be a top two challenge, none of this keeping him in a job if we're hovering just beneath the top six because we might sneak into the play-offs, that's the mistake we made the last time we were in the championship, were too happy to challenge for top six rather than top two, and as a consequence kept Bruce for too long.

[VillaChris]

In normal circumstances I'd be stay up at all costs but more of next season will be BCD than not so for a viewing experience it will be bizarre and more artificial than normal. Struggling to sum up that much enthusiasm unless there's a miracle and we can get back to full crowds by at least November but that is very very unlikely to happen.

If you're a fan who hardly goes for whatever reason then fair enough it won't be much different but I pity the fans who've barely missed a game in last 20-30 years. Of course aswell matchday dosen't just include 90 minutes, it's the social side either end of the game and with the way we've generally been in the last decade the match has usually been the worst part. Will certainly be a big void in that regard over next 12 months even if football comes back.

Anyway I've said if we do go down, I'd expect a top 2 finish and good enough to avoid the play offs this time. Would be disappointed in ownership if they couldn't make the decisions to get that, Mike Ashley and Gold/Sullivan did so we're not talking about outstanding leadership here.

Not convinced our transfer strategy will change much in the summer judging by Purslow comments so I fear next season will be more of the side in the premier league, bit like the Lambert years where we always thought we'd kick on with a bit more experience but it never happened.

[Mantis]

1 hour ago, Zatman said:

if we go down due to a technicality then it would be stupid to sack Smith. A. it would be undeserved and b. I cant think of any managers available except the Warnock/Bruce bullshit type that are promotion experts 

I was more talking if the season finished and we went down that way.

I'd still be uneasy with Smith thought even if we do go down on a technicality (which I don't think will happen). I don't think I'll ever have much faith in him again tbh.