Dean Smith

[peterw]

2 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

So if we are bottom three after 10 games we shouldnt pull the trigger? Of course we should in that scenario. 

You cant keep a under performing manager in place. 

When spurs appoined poch during the season that didnt work out to bad for them did it?

 

Depends on the circumstances. Bottom three - cut adrift- playing poorly. Then, yes, he'd be under real pressure.

Bottom 3 = jack out/Martinez out/ Konsa out/Mings out./ Watkins out etc- then there's an exception to the curcisumatcnes

similarly - bottom 3 but 4 or 5 points from 10th? then again, I wouldn't jump.

football is never just black and white. Appointed Poch and then sacked him? How has that worked out for Tottenham, better? worse? the same?

[Jas10]

2 minutes ago, HKP90 said:

After a long think, I don’t think officals are corrupt, they have just coped disastrously with the implementation of VAR. 

They use it as a crutch against making decisions that they would otherwise have done. Incompetence or lack of training? Not sure.

 

[DCJonah]

27 minutes ago, TRO said:

I think there is more than one argument going on here and its blurring the lines.

League table is one thing, form and the contents of our play is another.....8th or 9th will be great, but we have to stop giving the ball away cheaply and stop retreating when we get pressed....Thats some of the work we need to get fixed.

There are humpteen reasons why that is and some of the reasons are personnel, I accept, we have what we have.....But the groundswell of opinion is now turning to that player, a leader with the ability to control who has a football  brain to direct the passages of play, call him an enforcer or what you like, but we need control in the middle of the park.......will we sign one?, that is a concern of mine, I am genuinely not sure what they see. Dean loves the flanks, and flirts around with wingers to his hearts content, nothing wrong with that, I love wingers too....but we need substance in the middle too.

We need a Gareth Barry.........Type, Maybe Teun Koopmeiners would fit that bill....we have to go for one of these players with determination and Gusto.

We can only comment properly, when the summer business is complete and we see where the strengthening is focused.

I want to see the content of our play improve, before I busy myself with League tables.....Scoring goals is the holy grail, its what we all get excited about, but they can mask over poor play too.....We have to get better on the ball, in looking after the ball and keeping hold of it....we have to get better at passing and not giving it away on a whim....and just as important, we have to be more astute and streetwise, without the ball and improve our positioning as a group, working together in synchronisation.

Then we can start having a craft peep at the league table......

As an analogy......We keep looking at our Bank Balance and we haven't got a well paid  job......first things first.

Why? 

Would you be happier if we were playing better but sitting 16th? Would you prefer us to be Brighton this season?

The end result is what matters. The journey is important don't get me wrong, but ultimately where we finish after 38 games is the key thing. 

This is a long term plan, we keep improving aspects of our player and continue building a squad. There's really no reason to think that other issues won't be addressed. 

[Zatman]

2 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

There is examples of failures and successes in both cases.

Look at pearson he bought watford out of rock bottom to almost keeping them up until they stupidly sacked him.

The point in is if your in rut and your not doing well your likely to sack your manager.

 

You could have used a better example like maybe Dean Smith taking over at Villa

Maybe doesn't fit the current anti Smith agenda

[M_Afro]

13 minutes ago, Zatman said:

We have 23 points from the last 21games which is 2nd half of our season. We played City twice in that time, had a fixture pile up others didnt and we lost to United, City and Liverpool with very questionable calls

How is 21 games the second half of the season? We only play 38 matches. All of those other things are true but still........I am shocked.

[peterw]

I remember seeing the fixture list at the start of the season and hoping we had points in the bag as we had a horrible run-in. I genuinely feared for us.

Liverpool A Man U home Everton A  Man City H Tottenham A Arsenal H Chelsea H 

Most sides facing that run of teams (in whichever order) would struggle. That we have been competitive in every game thus far - and taking points again for me shows we are moving in the right area, not that our form during that run of teams has suffered.

[Zatman]

Just now, M_Afro said:

How is 21 games the second half of the season? We only play 38 matches. All of those other things are true but still........I am shocked.

We had a 3 week Covid break from New Years to late January. It literally split our season in 2 so all games after were 2nd half

[Zatman]

2 minutes ago, peterw said:

I remember seeing the fixture list at the start of the season and hoping we had points in the bag as we had a horrible run-in. I genuinely feared for us.

Liverpool A Man U home Everton A  Man City H Tottenham A Arsenal H Chelsea H 

Most sides facing that run of teams (in whichever order) would struggle. That we have been competitive in every game thus far - and taking points again for me shows we are moving in the right area, not that our form during that run of teams has suffered.

From them games we have 6 points from 5 so far, should have been 7.

Last season we got 4

[Jas10]

[Phil Silvers]

7 minutes ago, HKP90 said:

After a long think, I don’t think officals are corrupt, they have just coped disastrously with the implementation of VAR. 

They use it as a crutch against making decisions that they would otherwise have done. Incompetence or lack of training? Not sure.

I really do think there is corruption, not all of them but enough to be able to manipulate results enough to make enough difference. 

Then there are a few that literally do have an agenda against us or some of our players, Lansburys disallowed goal by Kevin friend for example, there was something way off there for sure.

All of which has made our season worse then it should be and so puts pressure of the manager.

[Demitri_C]

2 minutes ago, Zatman said:

You could have used a better example like maybe Dean Smith taking over at Villa

Maybe doesn't fit the current anti Smith agenda

Yawn this is getting very boring

Its not like i havent explained my reasons why about 1000 times

Its not like i have said i wanted smith sacked

Its not like i said i wanted a replacement in

Its not like i havent said i want smith to turn it around

If anyone has an agenda its you putting words in peoples mouths and spin it to suit your own argument

Show me a post where i have said smith should be sacked due to the current form at the end of the season?

[M_Afro]

6 minutes ago, MaVilla said:

We have 23 points from our last 22 games, aka 1.04 PPG, aka a 39/40 point season based on those last 22 games.

If we lose against Spurs & Chelsea, thats 2 wins in the last 14, and 6 wins in 24.

We currently have 2 wins in the last 12, and 6 wins in the last 22.

Our first 14 games were way above what we could have reasonably expected, so well done there as that early form is what has ensured our season isnt a semi dog fight, but the last 22 games have been way...way below what i think is reasonably acceptable, our last 22 games have been relegation dogfight form.

I know you can’t ignore the early season form. We were ace up until Christmas. Way better than anyone expected, but when you get such a long spell of poor form, the pressure is going to be there from the people who have invested £300m or whatever it is on new players.

I know people don’t like to hear it but it’s true. I said after the CP match that I wanted a change. I have obviously calmed down a bit now and can see things from a wider perspective but those kind of stats will grab the attention of the owners and not in a good way. Whether any of us think it’s right or wrong, another 2 performances like Sunday and I would not be surprised to see Dean sacked.

Just for the record, what I would like to see are 2 very good performances, regardless of results, that show we are on the right track. If we get those then I will be happy. 

[DCJonah]

1 minute ago, Demitri_C said:

Yawn this is getting very boring

Its not like i havent explained my reasons why about 1000 times

Its not like i have said i wanted smith sacked

Its not like i said i wanted a replacement in

Its not like i havent said i want smith to turn it around

If anyone has an agenda its you putting words in peoples mouths and spin it to suit your own argument

Show me a post where i have said smith should be sacked due to the current form at the end of the season?

Without being funny, I find it odd that you don't want him sacked. 

If I felt he was so poor I needed to criticise him as much as he gets on here, I'd want him sacked. 

 

[Demitri_C]

11 minutes ago, peterw said:

Depends on the circumstances. Bottom three - cut adrift- playing poorly. Then, yes, he'd be under real pressure.

Bottom 3 = jack out/Martinez out/ Konsa out/Mings out./ Watkins out etc- then there's an exception to the curcisumatcnes

similarly - bottom 3 but 4 or 5 points from 10th? then again, I wouldn't jump.

football is never just black and white. Appointed Poch and then sacked him? How has that worked out for Tottenham, better? worse? the same?

I agree with most of that peter.

With your question regarding poch they totally messaged that up. I couldnt believe they sacked him for joss. That was always going to be a disaster 

[DCJonah]

Just now, M_Afro said:

I know you can’t ignore the early season form. We were ace up until Christmas. Way better than anyone expected, but when you get such a long spell of poor form, the pressure is going to be there from the people who have invested £300m or whatever it is on new players.

I know people don’t like to hear it but it’s true. I said after the CP match that I wanted a change. I have obviously calmed down a bit now and can see things from a wider perspective but those kind of stats will grab the attention of the owners and not in a good way. Whether any of us think it’s right or wrong, another 2 performances like Sunday and I would not be surprised to see Dean sacked.

Just for the record, what I would like to see are 2 very good performances, regardless of results, that show we are on the right track. If we get those then I will be happy. 

There is no chance Dean Smith gets sacked, regardless of the next two games. 

I doubt there is a single pundit or neutral fan who thinks Smith's job is on the line. 

[Demitri_C]

Just now, DCJonah said:

Without being funny, I find it odd that you don't want him sacked. 

If I felt he was so poor I needed to criticise him as much as he gets on here, I'd want him sacked. 

 

As ive said the criticism started when jack got injured as smith had no answers to turn it around. 

If grealish gets injured for 3-4 months next season we all going to excuss smith that the poor form is without jack.?

Not good enough for me if that happened. I would expect to see us getting results with jack

Not losing to the worst team in the league who had ten men

[HKP90]

14 minutes ago, Demitri_C said:

Was that poch or levy?

Spurs. 

After sacking Poch for Mourinho they are currently in the same place in the league that they were the year before his appointment (6th). If West Ham finish strong, they are potentially going to finish in their lowest position since 2008.

You can't use the example of Poch's appointment as an argument for sacking managers during a bad spell, without also using the example of sacking Poch for Mourinho during a bad spell, which has left them worse off than they were before Poch. 

[HKP90]

9 minutes ago, Phil Silvers said:

I really do think there is corruption, not all of them but enough to be able to manipulate results enough to make enough difference. 

Then there are a few that literally do have an agenda against us or some of our players, Lansburys disallowed goal by Kevin friend for example, there was something way off there for sure.

All of which has made our season worse then it should be and so puts pressure of the manager.

Hope you are wrong. You could be right. 

[Demitri_C]

2 minutes ago, HKP90 said:

Spurs. 

After sacking Poch for Mourinho they are currently in the same place in the league that they were the year before his appointment (6th). If West Ham finish strong, they are potentially going to finish in their lowest position since 2008.

You can't use the example of Poch's appointment as an argument for sacking managers during a bad spell, without also using the example of sacking Poch for Mourinho during a bad spell, which has left them worse off than they were before Poch. 

I was referring to when they apponted poch not sacked him!

 

[Zatman]

This week also will be our 7th time playing 2 games a week since late January which Champions League squads struggle with