Eastie Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 2 minutes ago, JE- said: Why do people keep comparing rdm? He had hardly any time half his players were injured for half his games and he was badly unlucky in the last few mins of games... There is alot more evidence of rdm turning us around the Bruce.. Bruce lost 5 games in a row vs rdm who lost late goal in almost 5 games from winning positions Bruce benefited from this in his early stages then when he decided to brucify us with this boring 352 he put us in a relegation scrap Rdm had all the mess to sort out Bruce has it way easier RDM had a pre season - he won 1 in 11 - Bruce has won 10 in 25 - a far better ratio and as for injuries we currently have 9 players out so if you are using that as an excuse for RDM you should be doing the same for Bruce. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 (edited) 6 hours ago, vreitti said: Having witnessed what in a sense could be described as the 'game of all times' yesterday, it's clear to me this should be the aim of all football clubs. Obviously, I'm not talking about emulating Barca or their footballing philosophy. What I'm advocating is emulating the same desire, will and determination to be(come) successful. I look at our recent years, our lackluster campaign this season, and keep thinking where on earth do these great teams get this motivation, drive and fighting spirit from, when our group of players mostly lack these fundamental characteristics, and at times simply look disinterested and spineless. It clearly isn't just about money or ability either, and the difference between a world class player and a championship standard player. Sure ability breeds confidence, which inherently is another trait we of course severely lack. I keep thinking about the significance a manager at a football club has, and whichever way I twist and turn, it never amounts to a small part, of what ultimately will constitute success. Then again, perhaps I am slightly exaggerating the role; Chelsea did after all arguably win the CL without a manager, because they already had all the other key components in place. Lacking this sort of foundation and footballing culture, that the top teams in the world have, is undoubtedly our biggest concern, and the more I think about it, I keep coming back to one key element, that of stability. Honestly, I really dislike the word, as it’s used all too easily as an excuse for other failings. I’m now resigned to the fact that Bruce will be with us for the foreseeable future. Whilst I do not rate him as a football manager, and would most definitely take Wagner, or whatever other up and coming, modern manager with the infamous ‘continental approach’ instead, I have to acknowledge the notion that stability, at this point in time, simply is the single most important factor. FWIW I cannot fathom it’s taken me this long to come to this conclusion, when it’s so bloody apparent. I suppose I just don't ever again want to suffer these past few years, or to have to wait 10+ years for things to turn around. I won’t however stop being critical of Bruce, if and when I feel it’s justified, then again I’ll surely give him credit, when credit is due. Here’s hoping that I only have to contemplate the latter, starting with Saturday. That is primarily what Steve Bruce is trying to change and equally that is the thing that takes time to change......its not like practicing taking corners.....its trying to instill a belief and winning mentality.......its happening, but slowly,slowly catch a monkey......... he will do it. Edited March 9, 2017 by TRO 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thabucks Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 16 minutes ago, Eastie said: RDM had a pre season - he won 1 in 11 - Bruce has won 10 in 25 - a far better ratio and as for injuries we currently have 9 players out so if you are using that as an excuse for RDM you should be doing the same for Bruce. Just out of interest how many of those 25 games has Bruce lost and how does that loss ratio compare ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 1 minute ago, thabucks said: Just out of interest how many of those 25 games has Bruce lost and how does that loss ratio compare ? Surely the only thing that matters is the points per game ratio - you are better off winning and losing one in 2 than drawing 8 from 11 . the aim is to win games not afford defeat. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 (edited) 6 hours ago, Stevo985 said: Newcastle were a top 6 side when they wanted him. What manager are you suggesting we could get who would be wanted by a side higher than that? I don't even know why I'm discussing this. The original point I was debating was that Bruce has NEVER been wanted by another club. Ever. I've already proved that that is utter tosh. JE just moved the goalposts to save face. I think this debate is like painting the forth bridge. They have their views and intervention from Friedrich Nietzsche or John Stuart Mill on our behalf ,would make not a scrap of difference. Edited March 9, 2017 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 (edited) 5 hours ago, JE- said: Hi mate Well I didn't expect promotion for bruce this season... But what I did expect was a big fight for top 6..His target when appointed was top 6 We are 15th... He's fcked it up All on his own, without any help from no one. ....... you are a charmer, I'll grant you that. ps what do you do, when you're not haunting houses? Edited March 9, 2017 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 6 minutes ago, TRO said: I think this debate is like painting the forth bridge. They have their views and intervention from Friedrich Nietzsche or John Stuart Mill on our behalf ,would make not a scrap of difference. You seem pretty set in your opinion too TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JE- Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 (edited) Rdm had a pre season? Rdm had a massive job in the pre season to sort out and he didn't have a full one at thst either Most his signings were at the end of the transfer window also like kodja etc.. Rmc was also late Incredible statement And to add he should have had at least had till Jan to show what he could do... I'd have rdm over Bruce any day.. At least we attacked sides Edited March 9, 2017 by JE- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastie Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 1 minute ago, JE- said: Rdm had a pre season? Rdm had a massive job in the pre season to sort out and he didn't have a full one at thst either Most his signings were at the end of the transfer window also like kodja etc.. Rmc was also late Incredible statement Sorry but there's no point arguing with you - ignore button it is . 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 (edited) 8 minutes ago, sne said: You seem pretty set in your opinion too TRO My opinion always has been give him a chance to turn around, a very difficult football club derived from years of demise. but you are right.....everyone has an opinion and the right to it. However, I think its a bit hard nosed to bark out intransigence, when we are only asking for the guy to be given a chance. Ps ......but one of us is right. Edited March 9, 2017 by TRO 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NottingVilla Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Where would be in the league if you take SB's average points total with us and spread it across the 11 games RDM was in charge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted March 9, 2017 Author Share Posted March 9, 2017 On 08/03/2017 at 10:04, sonic_bouma said: I went to the game. We didn't deserve to lose. In the first half we nullified Huddersfield very well and managed to create 3 good chances which all could have ended up in the back of the net. Story of many games this season. The football wasn't scintillating (people need to make peace that it never will be with Bruce) in the first half but it was proving to be a perfect away performance. What was very impressive was our pressing high up the pitch led by hourihane. I'd like to see more of that. The second half was poorer from us. Too many hopeful long balls not much cohesion.however we were not under real pressure at any point. They shot they scored once again story of our season in many ways. This game shouldn't be used as a stick to beat Bruce with. People usin stats who didn't go to the game need to put their keyboard down. They bare no relevance whatsoever to last nights game. Dislike Bruce or not the fact is We were unlucky. Get over it. Unless Huddersfield go up., I honestly think they won't finish anywhere near us next season. Both games been so lucky esp at villa park Luck only gets you so far 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 5 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: Unless Huddersfield go up., I honestly think they won't finish anywhere near us next season. Both games been so lucky esp at villa park Luck only gets you so far I think the likely scenario is that Wagner goes on to bigger and better things if they're not promoted. If he goes I'm sure they'll struggle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JE- Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 Ignore button because I challenge your thinking Amazing stuff 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mjvilla Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 4 minutes ago, JE- said: Ignore button because I challenge your thinking Amazing stuff I think it's more to do with the constant changing of argument... to be proved wrong, to move onto something else... to be proved wrong. To then tell us some complete conjecture about next season and then to say 'we're 15th, Bruce **** up' put together a well-reasoned, though out argument and I'm sure you will have people's ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAMAICAN-VILLAN Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 The board want stability, and to build loyalty, family atmosphere etc. However XIA is not stupid. If Bruce does not get us up next season he will be gone. (Arguably would have already been too late and a complete cock up) If he gets us up and there is no sign of progression re: ethos etc, he will be gone. I wouldn't be surprised if the master plan was for him to stabilise us in the Premier League then look for fresh impetus, and if he is not replaced it would be a sign that he is doing very well. Like others, I am a little scared that we won't go up, and also miss the chance to get a "modern young manager" in. At one point I even said "I have never wanted a manager out as much as I want Bruce out". But having accepted the reality that we won't be going up this year, and observing improvement I've gotten a little more patient. I'm cautiously optimistic, we really are a top GK, A Jedi clone/understudy/replacement and perhaps a Good Target (Really think Gestede could have been a plus) man away from being a very, very good side. We have dropped up to 15 points via GK error! Easily could have been on 55 - 60 points. The end of this season, as well as injuries has blessed us with being able to see and blood our talented youngsters. I really feel when all of these lads get a preseason together, and we have a fully fit squad, perhaps even a couple of the loanees back? We will see a revatalised Aston Villa! *** Or this is all pie in the sky and we'll be shit again. Moral of the story, we just need to accept our circumstances and get behind the team, there has been definite improvement, we are the 12th man, if we all pull together the sky is the limit! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JE- Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 2 minutes ago, Mjvilla said: I think it's more to do with the constant changing of argument... to be proved wrong, to move onto something else... to be proved wrong. To then tell us some complete conjecture about next season and then to say 'we're 15th, Bruce **** up' put together a well-reasoned, though out argument and I'm sure you will have people's ears. Sorry that's not right at all.. Proven 'wrong' can't see one element of that People come across as Bruce can do no wrong but rdm has done alot wrong which is complete nonsense I'd rather we kept rdm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JE- Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 You know what we will see next season under bruce? More of the same boring dire dull negative anti football that no fan wishes to see It's no coincidence the best teams also play the more entertaining football 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mjvilla Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 6 minutes ago, JE- said: Sorry that's not right at all.. Proven 'wrong' can't see one element of that People come across as Bruce can do no wrong but rdm has done alot wrong which is complete nonsense I'd rather we kept rdm Really not? You should take a long read through a number of posts. Stevos springs to mind. Also, there are other threads other than the Bruce one! I'm sure your contribution will be welcome in all of those rather than the broken record Bruce statements. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted March 9, 2017 Share Posted March 9, 2017 1 hour ago, JE- said: Why do people keep comparing rdm? He had hardly any time half his players were injured for half his games and he was badly unlucky in the last few mins of games... There is alot more evidence of rdm turning us around the Bruce.. Bruce lost 5 games in a row vs rdm who lost late goal in almost 5 games from winning positions Bruce benefited from this in his early stages then when he decided to brucify us with this boring 352 he put us in a relegation scrap Rdm had all the mess to sort out Bruce has it way easier Table don't lie, he was the bottom few in the league with less than a point per game, with a net spend that dwarfed Bruce's. Awful manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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