Villa Park redevelopment

[dotcomsimon]

https://trainingground.guru/articles/aston-villa-submit-plans-for-inner-city-academy

Quote

ASTON VILLA have submitted plans for a new ‘Inner City Academy’ in Birmingham, which will be targeted at youngsters living close to their Villa Park stadium.

The proposal has been put forward to Birmingham City Council and includes a full-size indoor 3G pitch, an outdoor floodlit 3G pitch, plus a purpose built two-storey building that will house six changing rooms, a lounge for players and parents, and an office.

it’s the inner city training academy 

[DaveAV1]

2 hours ago, Sulberto21 said:

Eleventy seventy thousand!

Thousand? Stop thinking small time. 

[villan-scott]

5 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

Well, as we're about to unveil plans for a mahoosive new North Stand at Villa Park, I think we're safe from movement for at least the next twenty years or so.

Is this inside info ahead of public release from your AGM links, or just assumptions based on previous info/meetings?

[OutByEaster?]

1 minute ago, villan-scott said:

Is this inside info ahead of public release from your AGM links, or just assumptions based on previous info/meetings?

The club have spoken publicly about redevelopment and put a timeline out there, they've also mentioned it at supporters group meetings. 

The twenty years thing is me assuming that we won't spend four years redeveloping one end of the ground and then bugger off sharpish.

 

[Demitri_C]

They wont demolish villa park. Its going to cost TOO MUCH and then we will have the same problems like spurs massive debts and lower investment in the 1st team. 

Nothing will get done until they sort the shambolic transport system out. Its going to take years to come to a solution 

[VillaJ100]

Honestly I can't think of a great solution that doesn't involve underground parking. I'm sure it's technically possible albeit a massive pain in the arse 

[thabucks]

We have the space to copy spurs and build behind a New North stand with an underground car park and could also fit a retractable pitch - It would make VP a true multi use stadium .

Issue is costs involved would no doubt be prohibitive for the return … My pie on the sky dream scenario would be a complete renovation like the Bernabeu with retractable roof and pitch - the works . One can but dream … 

[villa4europe]

The basement at spurs is a major cause of why they lost so much money on the stadium 

The ground is where the majority of the risk is in construction 

[Follyfoot]

On 29/01/2022 at 12:47, sidcow said:

It's true, the oldest part of Villa Park is actually The North Stand and that's what everyone is desperate to get knocked down. 

Once that's gone the whole stadium is little more than 25 years old, hardly historic. 

The pitch is relayed every few years so it's hardly the same hallowed turf. 

So what is it? Clearly a football ground is more than just a piece of grass and a collection of buildings. 

Villa Park remains a historic stadium despite all that.  So I conclude essentially it's a collection of memories. 

We came back against Tranmere at Villa Park, it still occurred there despite the buildings all changing, It's still Villa Park that has hosted more FA Cup semi finals than any other football ground, that Ryan Giggs wonder goal was still scored in front of The Holte End as was the Alan Hutton Wonder goal against Blues. 

We still won all those games in Villa Park on our way to our last Championship and The European Cup final....... It all happened at Villa Park. 

The rituals and journeys I've undertaken most of my life and my dad before me were to that same place. 

Each stand has been rebuilt at different times but each in turn linking to the past in a continuous unbroken chain. 

So the buildings may change, but for me it's still the same Villa Park, still our home, still the very essence of Aston Villa and a new shiny stadium elsewhere would just fill me with emptiness. 

I still miss the fish and chip shop at the top of Witton Lane (Holte End end) and the Jamaican private club next to it

[thabucks]

7 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

The basement at spurs is a major cause of why they lost so much money on the stadium 

The ground is where the majority of the risk is in construction 

Isn’t rule of thumb x2 costs building down as up? A retractable pitch and underground parking would be great, but the sheer costs and rate of payback make it highly unlikely I know… interesting video on Madrid’s pitch stacking system which must be costing a ridiculous amount. 

 

Edited January 30, 2022 by thabucks

[OutByEaster?]

20 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

The basement at spurs is a major cause of why they lost so much money on the stadium 

The ground is where the majority of the risk is in construction 

Villa Park was built over a pool - I'm sure I read somewhere that the water table isn't too far down. I'm not sure how much heffect that would have in terms of keeping underground parking watertight - probably nothing I guess, I know nothing about underground construction.

 

[Follyfoot]

6 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

Villa Park was built over a pool - I'm sure I read somewhere that the water table isn't too far down. I'm not sure how much heffect that would have in terms of keeping underground parking watertight - probably nothing I guess, I know nothing about underground construction.

 

Would that not help with the theme park? Ready-made log flume?

[villa4europe]

7 minutes ago, OutByEaster? said:

Villa Park was built over a pool - I'm sure I read somewhere that the water table isn't too far down. I'm not sure how much heffect that would have in terms of keeping underground parking watertight - probably nothing I guess, I know nothing about underground construction.

All you need to know is that it costs money! It's where the uncertainty is and usually its something that stays with the client rather than the contractor 

[thabucks]

So to do anything of note to Villa park will cost Millions to overcome the hurdles . At what point do you think is it worth it for the ROI and look maybe afresh. Yes we would take on a load more debt with a new stadium but the increase in turnover could be decisive.

Birmingham as a city has been poor at marketing itself as Englands central and second city and will continue to lose out to Manchester unless they start to think big(ger). A huge new Multi-use stadium luring big concerts/ in the mix for boxing events etc will help Brum compete and continue to evolve. 

[DaveAV1]

1 hour ago, OutByEaster? said:

Villa Park was built over a pool - I'm sure I read somewhere that the water table isn't too far down. I'm not sure how much heffect that would have in terms of keeping underground parking watertight - probably nothing I guess, I know nothing about underground construction.

 

Couple of hours parking and a car wash for a tenner gov. Everyone’s a winner. 

[sidcow]

There is 1 other city centre site up for development in the medium to long term and that is Martineau Galleries which covers the multi story car park/office building above HMV Vault/Where Toys R Us used to be plus the old Argos / Oasis / Hummingbird block. 

It's owned by Hammerson who own The Bullring.  Original plans were for a new big Shopping Centre which obviously fell through when Retail died, then they were looking at a new Office cluster, well again that's probably difficult now. 

So basically it's all just been on hold for years. 

I'm sure someone like Fortress could buy it and develop a multi use area with a stadium, bars, tall apartment blocks, some retail element etc. 

Very central, easily big enough, right on the door of HS2, The Metro, Moor Street and New Street stations. 

In many ways it would actually be the perfect city Centre location in the central area that needs development the most. 

I would 100% use public transport to go to matches then. 

The main problem would be the cost to buy it, depends on how confident Hammerson are that they can really turn it into something highly profitable for them or if they think its all a gamble and would prefer to just sell it on. 

[AvonVillain]

4 hours ago, VillaJ100 said:

Honestly I can't think of a great solution that doesn't involve underground parking. I'm sure it's technically possible albeit a massive pain in the arse 

I wonder if there isn't scope to send the city centre tram system down to Villa Park?

[thabucks]

32 minutes ago, sidcow said:

There is 1 other city centre site up for development in the medium to long term and that is Martineau Galleries which covers the multi story car park/office building above HMV Vault/Where Toys R Us used to be plus the old Argos / Oasis / Hummingbird block. 

It's owned by Hammerson who own The Bullring.  Original plans were for a new big Shopping Centre which obviously fell through when Retail died, then they were looking at a new Office cluster, well again that's probably difficult now. 

So basically it's all just been on hold for years. 

I'm sure someone like Fortress could buy it and develop a multi use area with a stadium, bars, tall apartment blocks, some retail element etc. 

Very central, easily big enough, right on the door of HS2, The Metro, Moor Street and New Street stations. 

In many ways it would actually be the perfect city Centre location in the central area that needs development the most. 

I would 100% use public transport to go to matches then. 

The main problem would be the cost to buy it, depends on how confident Hammerson are that they can really turn it into something highly profitable for them or if they think its all a gamble and would prefer to just sell it on. 

That would be the perfect site location wise but the plot isn't big enough and it’s too valuable for housing. The Smithfield site wound be another fantastic. Central location but again plans already afoot … 

Edited January 30, 2022 by thabucks

[sidcow]

28 minutes ago, AvonVillain said:

I wonder if there isn't scope to send the city centre tram system down to Villa Park?

It would seem an obvious route but it just doesn't seem to be on the cards. I've not even seen long term plans to go down there.  You would think a route to Star City via Villa Park would be reasonably easy to build and help regeneration along the route. 

[sidcow]

4 minutes ago, thabucks said:

That would be the perfect site location wise but the plot isn't big enough and it’s too valuable for housing. The Smithfield site wound be another fantastic. Central location but again plans already afoot … 

I would say its definitely big enough but yes, we'd have to compete with the housing developers. 

But Hammerson just don't seem to be doing anything to it. Lot's of bold plans but hardly anything happened since 2019.   HS2 is really starting now, you would think they would want to get at least demolition started and start advancing plans to coincide with HS2. 

There are 50 story towers planned for the area but they themselves don't seem to be planning to go very high. 

Fortress have extremely deep pockets. Maybe they could sacrifice the greater area for a stadium and max out on towers. 

The shops and bars could be actually built into the stands and be in use 24 hours a day, a whole new destination in its own right. 

To fit the stadium in they would have to either close or reconfigure Dale End Road.  I'm not sure that actually needs to be a through road in future though, just becomes an access Road to the North and South side of the plot.