NurembergVillan Posted December 11, 2017 Moderator Share Posted December 11, 2017 40 minutes ago, snowychap said: I see the Master Negotiator has been on the airwaves today trying to negotiate himself out of the shit he got himself in to yesterday. What an arse. He thinks he's Mr Fiddler... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Xann Posted December 11, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted December 11, 2017 3 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Really, why doesn't that toad Lawson just piss off? Sitting up there so he can be observed, instead of just watching it through the internal system. Talk about Banquo's ghost. Probably wants journos to ask him what he thought of the debate. He screwed up big time as Chancellor, and nowadays we can't escape him playing the wise elder statesman, imparting advice to his successors in a tone of gravitas that is intended to disguise his vast and unfathomable ignorance. That's when he's not pretending to know something about climate change and get invited to speak by foolish BBC producers keen to demonstrate that they think "balance" means that for every scientist interviewed, they must have some absolute horse's arse disagreeing with them. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enda Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 11 minutes ago, peterms said: Talk about Banquo's ghost. Is this a hard Brexit I see before me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 1 minute ago, Enda said: Is this a hard Brexit I see before me? No, Mr Davis is just pleased to see you. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 3 hours ago, HanoiVillan said: If it hasn't already reached that point, I'm not sure that I can take anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 My god! Those sneaky Europeans have somehow found out about Mr Davis and his views on unilateral flexibility of commitments, and they don't like it! Why, it's almost as if they don't trust us. Cheeky beggars. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted December 12, 2017 Moderator Share Posted December 12, 2017 Someone hold him down and force him to drink orange juice and do us all a favour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Xann Posted December 12, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted December 12, 2017 7 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 We will not accept any backtracking from the UK from commitments in the joint report. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HanoiVillan Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 On 12/11/2017 at 16:50, Davkaus said: If it hasn't already reached that point, I'm not sure that I can take anymore. I think we may be very shortly about to reach that point, if we didn't this morning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Is there any poor bastard in the UK actually called Cliff Edge? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just to keep some sort of perspective, whilst I'm not a fan of David Grimaldi Davis. It's also worth stating that Guy Verhofstadt is not your friend. He's a euro superstate egotistical prick. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Brexit debate: how many MPs does it take to fill eight hours of dead air? Quote Brexit can often have the air of a tired TV game show in the Commons. One hosted for the most part by children’s TV presenters who are well past their sell-by date. On Monday we were treated to the prime minister dropping by to update the house on what had already been decided elsewhere. Everyone was just going through the motions. The best that could be said for it was that it made for a rather nauseating spectacle as Tory MPs, who had spent months briefing against Theresa May, fell over themselves to praise her brilliance. Tuesday was another case in point, with parliament debating day six of the committee stage of the EU withdrawal bill. Barely 30 Conservative MPs bothered to make the effort to turn up. Not because they didn’t care about Brexit but because there was no need. The session was to be an eight-hour charade. A mere formality as the government had long since made trifling concessions to stave off any rebellion from its own side. The votes were in the bag. The opposition benches were rather fuller. In Westminster there’s no such thing as dead air. If there are eight hours to fill, there’s never any shortage of MPs to fill them. Even if they know they are by and large wasting their time, there’s always the hope of landing a few glancing blows. Labour’s Chris Leslie began the session by observing that the government didn’t appear to have thought through the constitutional implications of its so-called Henry VIII powers, which would allow it to pass primary legislation by statutory instruments. The country hadn’t voted to take back control from the EU only to let the British government do whatever it felt like without the need to consult parliament. The Brexit minister, Steve Baker, couldn’t bring himself to look up from the files he was colouring in with highlighter pens. Neither he nor the government cared about what the country thought it had voted for. There was a chance of a land grab and it would be stupid not to take it. They had had to square off a few bleeding hearts in their own ranks by agreeing to the formation of a sifting committee. But as the committee would be top loaded with Tory MPs it could be relied on to do whatever the government wanted. “You ought to be embarrassed by the extent of the powers being appropriated,” Leslie continued. “The government is even allowing itself to amend the act itself by secondary legislation.” Several Tory MPs smirked. They weren’t in the slightest bit embarrassed by this. Anything to make Brexit less accountable to parliament could only be good. The Conservative opening remarks in the debate were entrusted to Oliver Letwin. A curious choice. He has the reputation for being one of the brightest people in parliament but frequently goes out of his way to appear one of the dimmest. He is also unquestionably one of the most trusting and gullible. A true naïf, Westminster’s very own idiot savant. There was no need for anyone to be concerned because everything was for the best in the best of all possible worlds, he insisted. He was well aware that the government had over-reached itself in clause 393... “It’s clause 397,” Leslie interrupted. “Of course, yes. Clause 397. I got the number wrong,” Letwin conceded. He definitely knew what he was talking about even when he didn’t. Where was he? Oh yes, the government may have over-reached itself, but everything would be fine because the government had promised him it wouldn’t use the powers it was going out of its way to give itself and he believed it could be trusted. There was a moment’s pause as everyone absorbed Letwin’s flawed logic. Having gone out of his way to point out that being stupid was no bar to being the Brexit secretary, David Davis had then set out to prove it by first contradicting himself within 24 hours and then letting slip that he considered the first stage of the Brexit negotiations to be barely worth the paper they were written on. The government couldn’t have done more over the past few days to underline just how untrustworthy it wanted to be considered. Or creatively ambiguous as it preferred to call it. Labour’s Mary Creagh then asked about environmental protections. Letwin threw his arms in the air. No one loved the environment more than Michael Gove. The country was lucky to have an environment minister who cared so much. Mikey had watched every episode of Blue Planet and sobbed when the dolphin got caught in a net. He had even asked the prime minister to appoint a couple of otters to cabinet. On the basis they couldn’t do any worse than the current lot. So no environmental protections would be diminished on his watch. Letwin trusted Mikey. Just like he trusted everyone. So it went on. Labour continued to raise doubts while the Tories promised to be trustworthy. It was all much ado about nothing. Though on the plus side, Baker got to finish his colouring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 From the Grauniad live blog: Quote Raab says clause 9 can only be used to implement the withdrawal agreement. And there are restrictions on the power, including those saying it cannot be used to levy taxes. And the power only applies until Brexit day. So it will only last for about six months. That is shorter than the time limit applying to other powers in the bill, he says. The clause itself, though, says: Regulations under this section may make any provision that could be made by an Act of Parliament (including modifying this Act). Surely that means that it could amend itself and remove 9 (4) where it says about regulations may not be made under this section after exit day? Alternatively, it could, surely, also be used to amend the date of exit day and thus extend the period during which these powers could be used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 Looks like it's going to be close. Could even be a tie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 (edited) 23 minutes ago, ml1dch said: Looks like it's going to be close. Could even be a tie. Then, apparently, it'll be: Big bad John - Bercow vid. Edit: Ah, it may have been Lindsay Hoyle as it's at committee stage. Edited December 13, 2017 by snowychap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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