bickster Posted October 19, 2021 Moderator Share Posted October 19, 2021 Posted for the poll result in the tweet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAuthority Posted October 19, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted October 19, 2021 1 hour ago, bickster said: Posted for the poll result in the tweet Obviously I'm watching from afar so forgive me if this is a stupid question. Has anyone (politician) suggested going back in yet? Are there people celebrating it still and arguing that it's working? If the UK did go back in what would that process look like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 In theory, we'd need to apply to join as brand new members, a process that takes many years. I do suspect if it happened in the next few years, with us remaining aligned with EU regs, there'd be a push to rapidly establish a rejoin process, but it'll take brexit coming home to roost rather more than it has for it to be politically viable to even contemplate at the moment, I think. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post sidcow Posted October 19, 2021 VT Supporter Popular Post Share Posted October 19, 2021 7 minutes ago, TheAuthority said: If the UK did go back in what would that process look like? 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted October 19, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted October 19, 2021 (edited) That poll is a shocker bearing in mind where it came from. Here's another interesting one from a few weeks ago https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-transition-eu-uk-poll-b1930061.html Only four per cent of Britons think Brexit has gone ‘very well’ YouGov poll finds 32 per cent of Britons think it has turned out ‘very badly’ Quote Only 4 per cent of Britons think that Brexit has gone “very well” since the end of the transition period, a new YouGov poll has suggested. A total of 6546 people responded to the pollster on Wednesday, answering the question of whether Britain had fared “well or badly” since 31 December last year. While 14 per cent of respondents believed things had gone “fairly well”, 21 per cent of those asked said the effects of Brexit had been neither positive nor negative. Quote On the other hand, 21 per cent of those polled believed the post-Brexit period had gone “fairly badly”, with another 32 per cent judging it to have turned out “very badly”. The remaining 8 per cent who were surveyed said they were unsure whether Brexit had been beneficial or detrimental so far. One would imagine as bad news stories continue to dominate headlines, and pretty much zero good news stories are reported. And as people continue to see it hitting their pockets more and more people will realise what a huge **** up it was. At some point a return movement will begin and gather pace pretty quickly. When a few years have elapsed people can have selective memory loss about that they did/said/voted for before. However the real problem will be the rejoin terms. I think people would accept a lot of stuff but the pound will be a real line most wouldn't cross I think. I'd vote for it just for the cheap mobile phone calls from abroad. Why not? It's as good a reason to go back in as most people's reasons for leaving. Edited October 19, 2021 by sidcow 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 Quite an interesting thread on the logistics / economics of picking / harvesting. I'm sure everyone will be shocked to learn that "just get the unemployed to do it" isn't really going to work. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 2 hours ago, TheAuthority said: Obviously I'm watching from afar so forgive me if this is a stupid question. Has anyone (politician) suggested going back in yet? Are there people celebrating it still and arguing that it's working? If the UK did go back in what would that process look like? I’m surprised no “Brejoin” party has gathered any traction. I realise there’s a lot of head winds for such a campaign, but then who’d have thought Brexit would get off the ground, and win given it was a **** mental idea pushed by known bullshitters. Its a matter of time. We have to wait for the current regime to move on and then draw a line under it all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 The good news seems to be we’re utterly useless at negotiating trade deals with other countries which should make a return to the EU more straight forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 What makes you think that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 8 minutes ago, colhint said: What makes you think that? think what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 were useless at trade deals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xann Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 45 minutes ago, colhint said: were useless at trade deals Efforts were stepped up to negotiate trade deals when Fox was Secretary of State for International Trade 5 years ago. Envoys were dispatched worldwide. Have you heard much about it? No. Trouble is, everyone knows we're desperate. A very poor negotiating position. They can just sit, and wait. Ball's in their court, you see? Eventually we'll sign anything. Quote Former trade negotiator Dmitry Grozoubinski celebrates the "virtually unprecedented result" for Australia in the trade deal with the UK, telling James O'Brien "we've not heard" any benefits for Brits. The conversation comes as the UK agrees a free trade deal with Australia which will see a cap on tariff-free imports for 15 years, while other "safeguards" will be brought in to protect British farmers. Speaking to James O'Brien, Mr Grozoubinski said: "The one thing Australia wants out of trade deals, the reason we do them, the marching orders we used to get, is access into agricultural markets abroad. "I don't think we have ever done as well as this. Getting rid of all tariffs and quotas forever, is virtually an unprecedented result. It's as good as you could possibly get from Australia's perspective in a free trade agreement with the United Kingdom, but not transformational for our economy - you guys are pretty far away." "But that means the UK must've secured some pretty spectacular wins in return?" James asked. Mr Grozoubinski replied: "Well if they have, those wins are hiding inside a giant cake and planning to jump out... because we have not heard any of them. "Even today Minister Truss was tweeting about the deal, the way she tries to sell it is to say you'll get cheaper Australian products. But that, in trade negotiation terms, was a concession by the United Kingdom - it's agreeing to get rid of a tax on Australian imports." James then said there is currently about £14 billion worth of UK Australia trade at the moment, asking Dmitry: "How much might we expect that figure to go up?" "It's really hard to say," he replied. "The thing is, Australia doesn't have that many barriers to selling it's stuff, in terms of ones that a free trade agreement can actually touch. Australia doesn't have many tariffs, so there's not that much to get rid of." LBC What makes things worse still is that senior civil servants and envoys are getting pissed off with working under Boris's idiot cabinet. That experience, and the goodwill they've garnered over decades, will be making for the door given the opportunity. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 But what is the measure for useless at trade deals? I don't think we could sign any until we left and have signed nearly 70 since we left. Compare that to the Murcosur trade deal between the EU and the largest South American economies, which took 20 years in the making 26 of the 27 countries wanted it but Austria backed by Ireland blocked it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted October 19, 2021 Author Moderator Share Posted October 19, 2021 7 minutes ago, colhint said: But what is the measure for useless at trade deals? I don't think we could sign any until we left and have signed nearly 70 since we left. The measure is if we're getting better deals after Brexit than we got when in the EU. The answer is no, we're not. The vast majority have been, in essence, keep most of what the deals we already had provided. There is no improvement now we're "free" of the EU. Exports are way down (some of that due to covid, admittedly, but a significant part is due to Brexit). 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 Wasn't the question why do you think we are useless at trade deals? The measure isn't are we getting better deals if we thought the original deal was fine. Just sign the deal. Which we have done. So in essence we liked the deal we had and got the same deal as before, no on said you have to have a worse deal because you're not in the EU. But in the Future we can sign deals which the EU cant. As they only have to suit us. If we want deals with emerging Asian economies, we dont have to consider the impact on Italian olive growers, Irish cattle farming, German manufacturing, Spanish winemaking etc. Only recently The AUKUS deal transferred a nuclear sub deal from France to UK and US and the French are pissed about it. The EU deal with Japan was signed in 2018. the UK deal with Japan was signed in 2020, the UK deal will increase trade with us by about £15b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 46 minutes ago, colhint said: the UK deal will increase trade with us by about £15 Maybe the headline claim doesn't stand up to proper scrutiny. Quote Ms Truss has also claimed a boost to trade with Japan worth £15.7bn over the next 15 years – but that is in comparison with no deal, not with the EU deal. The government then acknowledged that 83 per cent of those gains would go to Japanese exporters, with only 17 per cent to the UK’s. ... Professor Winters said that “to all intents and purposes in terms of tariffs, there is almost no difference between the UK-Japan and EU-Japan free trade agreements”. Link 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted October 19, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted October 19, 2021 1 minute ago, snowychap said: Maybe the headline claim doesn't stand up to proper scrutiny. Link Yeah, I'm certain that if we had signed better trade deals you wouldn't have seemingly endless stories from exporters saying "this is not what I voted for" I'm pretty sure most of them are worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 So if the above 2 posts are true, then the worst we can expect is the same deal as the EU get. So how do you get to the position I'm pretty sure most of them are worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted October 19, 2021 Moderator Share Posted October 19, 2021 1 hour ago, colhint said: Only recently The AUKUS deal transferred a nuclear sub deal from France to UK and US and the French are pissed about it. This is absolutely irrelevant. It has nothing to do with being in or out of the EU and has nothing to do with a trade deal We’re going to send them a second hand very old nuclear powered sub as part of a defence pact it has absolutely nothing to do with a trade deal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colhint Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 (edited) And the other seven will be built in Australia, will not require any parts or technologies made in the UK. Wonder why the French are so annoyed. A second hand nuclear sub probably goes for about the same as a Ford escort I guess. I'm sure the US want cheap old shit patrolling the South China seas as a backup. So we sign a trade deal with the Aussies, The French lose a contract, we and the US gain more work, and it's nothing to do with a trade deal? Edited October 19, 2021 by colhint typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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