Dr_Pangloss Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 As much as I hate the Tories I personally think it (Fallon) is trivial, and the 'victim' of this has said as much. It's a non story and a smokescreen for what is to come. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted October 31, 2017 Author Moderator Share Posted October 31, 2017 59 minutes ago, bickster said: ...Low level sexual assault like this.. You're right "it" is unacceptable. I wonder though whether the term "sexual assault" really does anyone any favours, when used to mean "a hand on a knee". It's creepy, unwanted, seedy etc. but it's not "assault" of any kind, surely. People who are genuinely victims of actual sexual assault kind of deserve better than to have their experiences taken less seriously/downgraded because people think Sexual assault might have meant someone once touched them on the knee. Fallon's an absolute tube, by the way, so I'm not defending him or 'owt. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted October 31, 2017 Moderator Share Posted October 31, 2017 18 minutes ago, blandy said: You're right "it" is unacceptable. I wonder though whether the term "sexual assault" really does anyone any favours, when used to mean "a hand on a knee". It's creepy, unwanted, seedy etc. but it's not "assault" of any kind, surely. People who are genuinely victims of actual sexual assault kind of deserve better than to have their experiences taken less seriously/downgraded because people think Sexual assault might have meant someone once touched them on the knee. Fallon's an absolute tube, by the way, so I'm not defending him or 'owt. Legally, that is exactly what it is. Take away the sexual aspect, you touch someone in an unwanted way, it’s classed as assault. With the sexual aspect which here has been admitted to, its sexual assault. If it isn't then we start introducing grey areas and that’s the last thing I presume anyone wants Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrenm Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 Unredacted list making the rounds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 1 hour ago, bickster said: Legally, that is exactly what it is. Take away the sexual aspect, you touch someone in an unwanted way, it’s classed as assault. With the sexual aspect which here has been admitted to, its sexual assault. If it isn't then we start introducing grey areas and that’s the last thing I presume anyone wants Legally I don't think that is the case ? .. There can be no assault if the act does not produce a true apprehension of harm in the victim.... so a gentle hand on a knee would struggle to qualify as assault .... unless perhaps it's carrying a machete at the time 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 One of the comments on Guido's page about one of the Cabinent ministers who we'd all be immensely surprised if they aren't on the list but I won't name ***** is strange. He could defecate on a monkey for sexual pleasure and people would let him off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 3 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: Legally I don't think that is the case ? .. There can be no assault if the act does not produce a true apprehension of harm in the victim.... Go up to a woman in the street, place your head gently between her breasts and see what charge you end up on. I imagine shouting that you caused no "apprehension of harm in the victim" will not help your cause. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choffer Posted October 31, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted October 31, 2017 2 minutes ago, tonyh29 said: ***** is strange. He could defecate on a monkey for sexual pleasure and people would let him off. Give over - he's well funny that *****. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 (edited) 33 minutes ago, ml1dch said: Go up to a woman in the street, place your head gently between her breasts and see what charge you end up on. I imagine shouting that you caused no "apprehension of harm in the victim" will not help your cause. Bicks stated " Take away the sexual aspect, you touch someone in an unwanted way, it’s classed as assault" I was questioning that conclusion that he reached , (hence the ? ) what you've done is add the sexual aspect , and thus move from assault back to something covered under the Sexual Offences Act 2003 Edited October 31, 2017 by tonyh29 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted October 31, 2017 Moderator Share Posted October 31, 2017 Well the list is out there, took me one google using a two-word search Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PompeyVillan Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 "Video exists of 3 men urinating on him". Whatever floats your boat and all that, that's not harming anyone. "Likes to make have intercourse with men wearing females purfume". Let's not demonise someone for having a consensual kink or being gay. We're past that. Although the piss thing is quite funny. It's the flippant 'handsy' stuff that bothers me and the 'Inappropriate' stuff that needs looking into. It's of little surprise given the entitled attitude of some MPs. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted October 31, 2017 Moderator Share Posted October 31, 2017 2 minutes ago, PompeyVillan said: "Video exists of 3 men urinating on him". Whatever floats your boat and all that, that's not harming anyone. "Likes to make have intercourse with men wearing females purfume". Let's not demonise someone for having a consensual kink or being gay. We're past that. Although the piss thing is quite funny. It's the flippant 'handsy' stuff that bothers me and the 'Inappropriate' stuff that needs looking into. It's of little surprise given the entitled attitude of some MPs. Yep agree, some of the stuff on there is no ones business but their own 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 4 hours ago, PompeyVillan said: "Video exists of 3 men urinating on him". Whatever floats your boat and all that, that's not harming anyone. I must say I took that to be a regular meeting of the 1922 Committee. But that unredacted list would seem quite tame to the Tory party of the 70s and 80s, I suspect. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterms Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 I am reminded of a tale told by a close friend who worked in the HoC, walking one day through the building with the vile assistant of one of the most disloyal and toxic MPs ever to disgrace the Labour benches, with the object in question giving a running commentary, sotto voce, "I've had her. I've had her. I've had him". As they say, it's not about sex, it's about exerting power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 20 hours ago, chrisp65 said: I don't know the detail, but taken at face value, one hand on one knee, once. If that's always sexual assault with no excuses and no extenuating circumstances, then we're in trouble. Indeed. All of this is getting a bit silly. Still, it means the headlines can be about the 'Westminster scandal' of some people making unwanted passes at others rather than the story of a woman being encouraged not to report a rape by a party official (Bex Bailey/Labour). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrenm Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 Lisa Nandy asked May 3 times to hold an investigation as home secretary about parliamentary abuse and power exerting information held by whips. May did nothing obviously. The list is mostly nothing but some stuff is potentially very nasty indeed and May doing nothing allowed it to continue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted November 1, 2017 Moderator Share Posted November 1, 2017 Bye bye Michael Fallon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 (edited) 16 minutes ago, bickster said: Bye bye Michael Fallon Over the Hartley-Brewer thing? I'm certainly not shedding a tear as he's a ghastly piece of work but still... Edit: Has he taken one for the team? Edited November 1, 2017 by snowychap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bickster Posted November 1, 2017 Moderator Share Posted November 1, 2017 10 minutes ago, snowychap said: Over the Hartley-Brewer thing? I'm certainly not shedding a tear as he's a ghastly piece of work but still... Edit: Has he taken one for the team? It seems so and yes they probably think he’s taken one for the team but there’s far worse on that list... made someone have an abortion!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ml1dch Posted November 1, 2017 Share Posted November 1, 2017 12 minutes ago, bickster said: It seems so and yes they probably think he’s taken one for the team but there’s far worse on that list... made someone have an abortion!!!! Please please please let it be Rees-Mogg. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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