New Club Crest Ideas

[Ingram85]

Kind of makes it look like it’s got make up on or Elton John glasses. 

[est1874]

12 hours ago, NurembergVillan said:

OK, here's my abbreviated version of my perspective on the FCG crest/identity discussion at VP last night -

It was a loooong chat. A guy from the design agency was leading it, and lists PSG and LOSC amongst other clubs he/the agency has recently designed for.

It was a conversation that I'm deeply passionate about, as you can imagine. Whilst one of the members began with "this'll be easy - we just go back to the round one", I was keen to emphasise that it needs deeper thought than that.

As much as the general consensus on the survey was "it was just marketing buzzwords", things made more sense when I began talking about values. As a club, we were historically pioneers and this should be an opportunity to showcase that. If we just "go back to the round one" we're the same as Chelsea and Man City - and they're a couple of Johnny Come-Latelys who want to pretend they've got heritage.

The lion is one of two constants in the history of Aston Villa. The name is the other. Personally, I'd love for our crest to be a lion with Aston Villa written below it. Maybe give the Villa more prominence than the Aston (like Paris and St Germain on their new crest).

I wouldn't have the star. Incorporating it suggests we won't win it again. Liverpool, Real Madrid, Barcelona - no stars. Villa and Forest - stars.  Maybe feature it inside the shirt, behind the badge, or something. It has a role, just not as part of our main identity. Look at Liverpool's official crest, then look at what shows up on the front and back of the shirt. An identity can take various forms so long as they all work together.

I talked about how disjointed our visuals are in general - from Twitter to matchday to around the ground. I requested a bespoke typeface that we can own and use everywhere. I also talked about colour. As you approach VP now, there are countless banners on lampposts. Great, but the top part of them is sky blue and so is most of the crest, so they are largely invisible.  Couple that with no real clarity on what our colours are. No consistency either. My suggestion was to get a 1982 shirt, send it to a company in the US called CSI and have them created the dye recipe and reference number for that claret and that blue. That then becomes the standard.

I also talked about the prestige of the crest and the shirt. I talked a lot. Dave Woodhall was keen to support me in saying that I should be the one talking a lot! As I approach the Holte on a matchday I see the club badge in gold leaf and feel proud. As I leave VP at the end, I'm trampling all over it on burger wrappers and serviettes. It's disrespectful. The badge is our crown jewel. Treat it like that.

Same for the shirt - only the men's and women's first teams should get the main kit. All other age groups have their own version. Pro and replica should be available for sale, but you only get a Villa shirt when you're picked for the first team. It's an honour.

As much as this is my personal view on it, albeit an informed one, I also spoke about the requirements of other fans in different localities and age groups - including potential new fans seeing us for the first time and being able to know who we are. I was part of implementing the new identity of Spurs and the Italian federation, saw first-hand the mess with Everton's first go around at their new badge (and the "please everyone" version they ended up with) AND had to talk Hull City down from the cliff edge when they were looking to implement the whole "Tigers" thing. What they ended up with could've been far, far worse.

I feel like we'll get something good here, something to be proud of, so long as the surveys and feedback don't hamstring it.

A camel is a racehorse designed by committee.

If Dave Woodhall is on your side, you might be on the wrong side.

[The_Steve]

2 hours ago, Lord Willard said:

Anything but a round badge. We have the most unique name in football. Let's not follow the sheep. 

 

Whatever the outcome we need Tom Hanks in the kit launch. He supports us on name value alone. 
 

[The_Steve]

47 minutes ago, Paddywhack said:

@ferguson1 this one?

 

 

I really like that - though I’d drop the star 

[NurembergVillan]

19 minutes ago, est1874 said:

If Dave Woodhall is on your side, you might be on the wrong side.

I've been friends with Dave for a long time.

We may not agree on everything, but anything he says about the club is from a position of what he believes to be best for Aston Villa.

[NurembergVillan]

1 hour ago, Mic09 said:

It's a shape. We can be distinct and special with use of a round badge. Just look at Bayern Munich.

What's distinct and special about theirs?  I've seen a fair few people reference it.

It's nice, but the unique aspect seems to be the Bavarian flag in the middle which is theirs to own.

Ours would have a lion in the middle, like Chelsea.

EDIT - this isn't intended to be spiky or patronising. I'm genuinely interested in the feedback.

I have an educated POV, but I'm far from being the oracle!

[Didiersix]

This is the best crest we've had in my opinion.If we can make a 'modern' version, with a standalone lion and 'Aston Villa' on there, that will do me. Drop the star, drop the shield.

[TheMelvillan]

Right, hear me out:

A gold, star shaped badge with an embossed lions head.

Stands out, incorporates our European success (ever so subtly), isnt round or shield shaped like so many others, and, makes us look look like badass sheriffs from a western.

Done. Now where's my invite to the nest fan consultation

 

[est1874]

I don't get the argument that we shouldn't have a round badge because Citeh and Chelsea have one. They didn't invent them. They simply brought them back into fashion.

We should pick the badge that's best for Villa. The logic appears to be that we shouldn't be seen to be copying the johnny-come-latelys. I think it's just as dangerous to strive to make the opposite choices to those clubs. 

Of course we shouldn't lose our identity. I don't agree that having a circular badge will result in that. There is loads that is unique about our club. Having a shit shield (or a floating lion) that only the hardcore traditionalists are happy with won't safeguard our identity.

Edited August 26, 2022 by est1874

[a m ole]

 

The problem with a round badge is everyone who wants it wants means they want the original Villa one that has hundreds of carbon copies in football. You can do it a bit different like Frankfurt/Ajax or my mock up below:

 

but when people say they want a ‘round badge’ it almost always means the city group template look -

[tomsky_11]

2 minutes ago, TheMelvillan said:

makes us look look like badass sheriffs from a western.

Unfortunately beaten to it...

 

[TheMelvillan]

Just now, tomsky_11 said:

Unfortunately beaten to it...

 

dammit

[The_Steve]

8 minutes ago, NurembergVillan said:

What's distinct and special about theirs?  I've seen a fair few people reference it.

It's nice, but the unique aspect seems to be the Bavarian flag in the middle which is theirs to own.

Ours would have a lion in the middle, like Chelsea.

EDIT - this isn't intended to be spiky or patronising. I'm genuinely interested in the feedback.

I have an educated POV, but I'm far from being the oracle!

I totally agree with you on the marketing side of things. Especially in the club store. For example, the selection of hoodies are terrible in design and branding - some say Villa, some just have the crest, and some a bit of both. They just look cheap and give no indication of the things we aspire to be. Especially for fans who don’t buy the kits - let us show fandom in other ways. I think the NHL does this really well. As they give a lot of attention to the crest and the lineage without it often looking too cheap or a knock off. 
 

Teams like the Penguins have such good marketing and branding outside their core kits E.g. https://www.fanatics.com/nhl/pittsburgh-penguins/pittsburgh-penguins-fanatics-branded-first-battle-power-play-pullover-hoodie-black/o-2462+t-69936343+p-9378095410+z-8-2933480208?_ref=p-DLP:m-GRID:i-r4c2:po-14

Even with the Maple Leafs - just a logo alone on a good quality material makes it pop https://www.fanatics.com/nhl/toronto-maple-leafs/toronto-maple-leafs-majestic-threads-logo-raglan-pullover-hoodie-oatmeal/blue/o-3595+t-69828684+p-15772687167+z-9-2426437896?_ref=p-DLP:m-GRID:i-r2c0:po-6

If we did stuff like this more consistently with the new crest I’d absolutely buy 

Whereas this just looks cheap and derivative and without any branding thought put behind it 

https://shop.avfc.co.uk/en/aston-villa-essentials-wordmark-graphic-overhead-hoodie-navy-unisex/p-6724002116872370+z-80-3961376084?_ref=p-DLP:m-GRID:i-r1c2:po-5

[tomsky_11]

1 minute ago, a m ole said:

 

The problem with a round badge is everyone who wants it wants means they want the original Villa one that has hundreds of carbon copies in football. You can do it a bit different like Frankfurt/Ajax or my mock up below:

 

but when people say they want a ‘round badge’ it almost always means the city group template look -

Really like that in terms of the lion and name but would question what the round outline is necessarily adding? Think minght look better without it, though maybe name would need to move also?

[ferguson1]

2 minutes ago, a m ole said:

 

The problem with a round badge is everyone who wants it wants means they want the original Villa one that has hundreds of carbon copies in football. You can do it a bit different like Frankfurt/Ajax or my mock up below:

 

but when people say they want a ‘round badge’ it almost always means the city group template look -

Or a variation of “round” possibly? Thinking of how the Ajax badge is.

 

 

[a m ole]

1 minute ago, tomsky_11 said:

Really like that in terms of the lion and name but would question what the round outline is necessarily adding? Think minght look better without it, though maybe name would need to move also?

nothing but framing the name, and allowing the background to be a different colour on a white or blue kit where the gold would wash out

Edited August 26, 2022 by a m ole

[The_Steve]

6 minutes ago, a m ole said:

 

The problem with a round badge is everyone who wants it wants means they want the original Villa one that has hundreds of carbon copies in football. You can do it a bit different like Frankfurt/Ajax or my mock up below:

 

but when people say they want a ‘round badge’ it almost always means the city group template look -

Claret lion would be lit love your designs 

[Mic09]

1 minute ago, NurembergVillan said:

What's distinct and special about theirs?  I've seen a fair few people reference it.

It's nice, but the unique aspect seems to be the Bavarian flag in the middle which is theirs to own.

Ours would have a lion in the middle, like Chelsea.

EDIT - this isn't intended to be spiky or patronising. I'm genuinely interested in the feedback.

I have an educated POV, but I'm far from being the oracle!

No worries, nothing spiky or patronising about it at all!

As opposed to you I have no background in design so my opinion is based on 'what I like' more than anything! 

The distinct part is that it screams Bavaria - it's easily marketable but full of history of the region, no other club can claim that heritage (I guess TSV 1860 can, but that is not what their identity is built on). What's important is that when you look at that badge you think BMW, you think the alps, Oktoberfest, you think the old Olympia stadium, you think Phillip Lahm AND Gerd Muller. 

I don't know if it's the clubs successful history that makes you think that, or a clear identity that is somehow capsuled by that simple, round design with distinct colours and actually stating the clubs' name on it. 

Lion is a fairly common theme, so in itself, there is nothing unique about it so we are always gonna be like Chelsea or a million other clubs that use it. Some might scream but I wouldn't mind if the Lion was used as one of our symbols, like the gas lamp, rather than be a badge itself. 

Maybe the badge should be some sort of a lion-shaped design, but not just a lion in a crest, whatever the shape might be. 

I just think that a circle is an eye pleasing shape and looks good on kits and some interesting work can be done with it - look how Ajax have a round badge, but it's not a circle. 

Then again, I'm fairly progressive so I wouldn't mind a Juventus style revolution. 

[NurembergVillan]

42 minutes ago, est1874 said:

I don't get the argument that we shouldn't have a round badge because Citeh and Chelsea have one. They didn't invent them. They simply brought them back into fashion.

We should pick the badge that's best for Villa. The logic appears to be that we shouldn't be seen to be copying the johnny-come-latelys. I think it's just as dangerous to strive to make the opposite choices to those clubs. 

Of course we shouldn't lose our identity. I don't agree that having a circular badge will result in that. There is loads that is unique about our club. Having a shit shield (or a floating lion) that only the hardcore traditionalists are happy with won't safeguard our identity.

I don't disagree with any of this, to be honest.

My argument is (as my colleagues will have seen before) intended to provoke thought.  If we go through the process of "it can't be round" and then end up with round being the best answer, we know we've chosen it for the right reasons.

For me the badge that's best for Villa inspires young/new fans and feels authentic to the die-hards.

It should be less about modern v tradition and more about does it represent what Aston Villa aspires to be. Then it makes sense to everyone.

[ThunderPower_14]

13 hours ago, NurembergVillan said:

OK, here's my abbreviated version of my perspective on the FCG crest/identity discussion at VP last night -

It was a loooong chat. A guy from the design agency was leading it, and lists PSG and LOSC amongst other clubs he/the agency has recently designed for.

It was a conversation that I'm deeply passionate about, as you can imagine. Whilst one of the members began with "this'll be easy - we just go back to the round one", I was keen to emphasise that it needs deeper thought than that.

As much as the general consensus on the survey was "it was just marketing buzzwords", things made more sense when I began talking about values. As a club, we were historically pioneers and this should be an opportunity to showcase that. If we just "go back to the round one" we're the same as Chelsea and Man City - and they're a couple of Johnny Come-Latelys who want to pretend they've got heritage.

The lion is one of two constants in the history of Aston Villa. The name is the other. Personally, I'd love for our crest to be a lion with Aston Villa written below it. Maybe give the Villa more prominence than the Aston (like Paris and St Germain on their new crest).

I wouldn't have the star. Incorporating it suggests we won't win it again. Liverpool, Real Madrid, Barcelona - no stars. Villa and Forest - stars.  Maybe feature it inside the shirt, behind the badge, or something. It has a role, just not as part of our main identity. Look at Liverpool's official crest, then look at what shows up on the front and back of the shirt. An identity can take various forms so long as they all work together.

I talked about how disjointed our visuals are in general - from Twitter to matchday to around the ground. I requested a bespoke typeface that we can own and use everywhere. I also talked about colour. As you approach VP now, there are countless banners on lampposts. Great, but the top part of them is sky blue and so is most of the crest, so they are largely invisible.  Couple that with no real clarity on what our colours are. No consistency either. My suggestion was to get a 1982 shirt, send it to a company in the US called CSI and have them created the dye recipe and reference number for that claret and that blue. That then becomes the standard.

I also talked about the prestige of the crest and the shirt. I talked a lot. Dave Woodhall was keen to support me in saying that I should be the one talking a lot! As I approach the Holte on a matchday I see the club badge in gold leaf and feel proud. As I leave VP at the end, I'm trampling all over it on burger wrappers and serviettes. It's disrespectful. The badge is our crown jewel. Treat it like that.

Same for the shirt - only the men's and women's first teams should get the main kit. All other age groups have their own version. Pro and replica should be available for sale, but you only get a Villa shirt when you're picked for the first team. It's an honour.

As much as this is my personal view on it, albeit an informed one, I also spoke about the requirements of other fans in different localities and age groups - including potential new fans seeing us for the first time and being able to know who we are. I was part of implementing the new identity of Spurs and the Italian federation, saw first-hand the mess with Everton's first go around at their new badge (and the "please everyone" version they ended up with) AND had to talk Hull City down from the cliff edge when they were looking to implement the whole "Tigers" thing. What they ended up with could've been far, far worse.

I feel like we'll get something good here, something to be proud of, so long as the surveys and feedback don't hamstring it.

A camel is a racehorse designed by committee.

 

Really chuffed to have someone of your passion, knowledge and industry experience there representing us as supporters. Agree completely with all of your arguments.

I did the survey, and I was wary going in after the survey for the Lerner badge was all about specific elements, which led to a boring mishmash.

This survey was all about what story we want to tell and what sort of feelings we want to evoke, more a brief for a designer than trying to do their job for them. 

I've got an excellent feeling about how this will turn out.