VillaCas Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 What i'm getting at the moment is utter confusion. We have had a poster state the constraints Lambert is currently working under so must we take that as being the absolute truth of the matter. I have asked the question if this is so why did Lambert leave Norwich for a club on it's apparent financial knees and therefore in a worse position than the club he left? The suggestion has been that he has had the rug pulled from underneath him. Now if that is the case why hasn't Lambert walked? He has walked before for a lot less than being lied to! As far as the players that have been let go are concerned think about this. If Lambert was told in discusions prior to becoming our new manager that he would have to get the high wage earners of the wage bill and then replace those players with a measly 17m-20m do you think he would have left Norwich who had soundly beaten us at the end of last season? Its not as if he was a manager out of work and desperate for a job. Lastly if he came to us knowing the constraints and had only 20m to spend over the next two windows why did he spend 7m on Benteke and more on Bowery who we didn't need when we had Bent. Are you trying to tell me that our chairman tried to attract our new incoming manager by telling him that our best striker had to be sold? If that was the case, why wasn't Bent sold at the start of the season to accomodate Benteke? I tend to think that Lerner was going to back Lambert but has seen what a disastrous job he has done and has pulled the plug like he did with O'Neill for slightly different reasons and thats what i believe at the moment. The board has lost faith with Lambert and are probably awaiting the outcome of the next two games before deciding whether to back the manager again, or indeed sack him. - I think he left Norwich because he felt that he had taken them as far as he could and that longer term we were the better bet - Watch SSN if you want to see PL talking about the financial pressure he is under - I don't think he has been lied to, but i do think that the existing squad didn't live up to expectations and he needs a little more than he first thought - He bought Benteke thinking he could play alongside Bent but Bent didn't live up to the billing - Lerner has not lost faith and there is no chance of Lambert being sacked - There are no siginings because we have gone to our first choices and they all want too much money (Sissoko's agent for example has asked for £75k a week - fact). They are playing poker now waiting to see who will crack first. Us if results keep going the way they are, them if no other clubs come in for them. If we can't do a deal then we will go to our second or third choice options but that will be later in the window Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciggiesnbeer Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 I think Morpheus does raise some good questions which people don't seem to have an answer for. At the end of the day you choose to believe the ITK rumours or not but with the actual evidence that's out there I think what Morpheous puts across is fair to ask. He also doesn't seem to resort to insults no matter how many respond to him that way. And after so many people absolutely loved jumping on him when we beat Liverpool I think right now he has every right to give it the big "I told you so" but again he hasn't done that. I agree with this. He has been a consistent doubter of PL, so far he is being proven right. I dont believe Lambert is on some strict budget either, in fact he has said as much. Lerner has already given him a massive transfer fund and I believe has backed him again this window. Thing is Lambert is consistent in his philosophy, he wants a young team and he wants willing workers. We can invent conspiracies all we want but I think Lambert means what he says. This is the way he wants to run the team, its how he wants to progress. Like I think he meant what he said about Darren Bent, he didnt think he was better than the other forwards for those games, some other games he might be. Thats who he is. I admit he has balls of steel, I am shitting myself and have been since Wigan, if I was him I would have made some panic buys by now. He hasnt, either he will look like a principled winner or a damn fool by the end of the season. I hope its the former, I am beginning to fear it is the latter. Never dull though is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaCas Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 I think Morpheus does raise some good questions which people don't seem to have an answer for. At the end of the day you choose to believe the ITK rumours or not but with the actual evidence that's out there I think what Morpheous puts across is fair to ask. He also doesn't seem to resort to insults no matter how many respond to him that way. And after so many people absolutely loved jumping on him when we beat Liverpool I think right now he has every right to give it the big "I told you so" but again he hasn't done that. You're dead wrong - If PL was the problem you might have a point but sadly we have a very good manager working with very poor resources. The "good questions" should have been asked of MON, Houllier, McL, RL and PF long long before this. If PL were to walk Villa are in serious serious trouble - be careful what you wish for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 I wouldn't think Lerner is close to sacking Lambert. Lambert may be closer to walking IMO. I think we are trying to get deals on the cheap - whilst selling clubs hold all the aces. Whilst I as fan fear amegedon if we loose tommorow. Lambert is paid not to panic - whatever players come and go - if Lambert starts running round like a headless chicken - it will only make things worse. My feeling is that Lambert hoped to sell at least one big name player, Gabby, Bent, Ireland, Nzog - The package presented to him of £20m - plus the sale of one of those between 7 -12m (August Prices!) may have give Lambert close on £30m to spend. I still reckon Randy and Lerner fear a couple of big name playerson £3m a year - than they do relegation - and every player being on £25k max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacbuddies Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) If PL were to walk Villa are in serious serious trouble - be careful what you wish for It's not a case of 'what you wish for'. If PL walks it won't be because of anything said on here or any fans wish it will be because, to use your words, 'Villa are in serious serious trouble'. Edited January 11, 2013 by pacbuddies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaCas Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Lerner has already given him a massive transfer fund LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smetrov Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Your are rarley lied to in business - its just the interpretation of what is said. For example where I work we were told:- "there will be no redundancies due to gov't spending cuts" Phew - but then some people were made redundant .......but 'not because of gov't spending cuts' Lambert might have said "I Need £30m to keep us in the prem" - he then finds out he only has £20m - but there is no stipulation stated that he keeps us in the prem ! (its probably not that precisely)- but both Chairman and manager need 'wiggle room') Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeyp102 Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 - There are no siginings because we have gone to our first choices and they all want too much money (Sissoko's agent for example has asked for £75k a week - fact). They are playing poker now waiting to see who will crack first. Us if results keep going the way they are, them if no other clubs come in for them. If we can't do a deal then we will go to our second or third choice options but that will be later in the window I can see what your saying but why could this not have been established prior to the window opening (other clubs could be contacted prior) this would have then given us the opportunity to speak to the second choices early on within the window Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciggiesnbeer Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 What a **** badge of honour......he must be so **** proud Don't try to find anything good, always look for the worst, be constant and insistent in your criticism........just the kind of supporter clubs dream of How many here were consistent doubters of McLeish? I seem to remember a lot. Morpheus is well entitled to support the team but believe we hired the wrong man as manager. Personally still think Lambert will come good with his approach, but he isnt making it easy on me thats for sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacbuddies Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 That's why there were " " marks around "talent" Cheap shot It's time..............for a sense of humour transplant! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Burgundy Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 laughable I Always forget sarcasm and irony don't really work only here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacbuddies Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 I Always forget sarcasm and irony don't really work only here I'm good at sarcasm and irony, honest! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalfTimePost Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Because we've played best as a 4-2-3-1, because Wiemann has been scoring from that position, because Wiemann has the workrate to play in that position and because we seem to get overrun in the middle when we play 4-4-2. Not to mention the fact that we don't have any decent wingers (N'Zogbia hasn't played well on the wing since his Wigan days). He hasnt been scoring from that position. He scores when he is played up front with Benteke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheltenham_villa Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 I wouldn't think Lerner is close to sacking Lambert. Lambert may be closer to walking IMO. I think we are trying to get deals on the cheap - whilst selling clubs hold all the aces. Whilst I as fan fear amegedon if we loose tommorow. Lambert is paid not to panic - whatever players come and go - if Lambert starts running round like a headless chicken - it will only make things worse. My feeling is that Lambert hoped to sell at least one big name player, Gabby, Bent, Ireland, Nzog - The package presented to him of £20m - plus the sale of one of those between 7 -12m (August Prices!) may have give Lambert close on £30m to spend. I still reckon Randy and Lerner fear a couple of big name playerson £3m a year - than they do relegation - and every player being on £25k max Randy and Lerner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Do you think that should we lose our next 2 games and that Lambert does indeed get fired, that Lerner already has a replacement lined up? I simply don't know. Wish I could be more constructive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) John, will i pick some holes in it? Firstly, why pay £7m on Benteke when Bent was already there? Is he for real? Benteke could be sold tomorrow for quite a profit. Bent is injured again...has been injured constantly and has missed as many sitters as anyone (through one-on-one in the 4-1 win away to Norwich and missed a sitter the other night early in the game). Manager's don't come out and slaughter the board. Not unless they plan on leaving or have already left. Why did he leave Norwich City? Maybe felt he had taken them as far as he could and wanted a new challenge? Or he wanted to join a club with a lot more potential - if he could get through a difficult first year or two? Who knows there could be several reasons. Does he also think when a manager agrees to join a club he demands to know exactly what money is there to spend? Yes, you are probably given a fair idea but maybe Villa were banking on getting some high earners off the books and that hasn't happened. Why can't that be the reason for the lack of funds available as opposed to the owner changing his mind? These are questions he isn't considering or debating. To address your point on Benteke first. You seem to be forgetting that Bent's downturn in form happened after Benteke arrived. So Lambert had no idea that Bent would suffer a loss in form before buying Benteke, hence my point on why would Lambert splash 7m of his restricted budget on another striker when there were outstanding weaknesses elsewhere. I also didn't say Lambert should slaughter the board. I said he could state that there was no money available to improve the squad. I have heard other managers saying this while defending poor results. It's not attacking the board, but actually defending his own position. The rumour at the time of him leaving Norwich was insufficient funding to push Norwich forward hence my previous point. Lastly what manager doesn't enquire about money available especially concerning a club in our position last season and I didn't reply to your other post because it didn't deserve it. Edited January 11, 2013 by Morpheus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 For me if we don't buy players capable of keeping us up then season ticket holders or not my son and I quite probably won't bother going to any games after January. My son has already indicated, after 7 seasons, that he won't be renewing next season. He's had it with the season upon season of failure, broken hopes, shit results, Lerners complete mismanagement of the club and a succession of poor managers. You and me both. My 16 year old son sees almost as a punishment to go and watch the shit we are served up at Villa Park at every home game. I dread what will happen at most games these days and I rarely bother to watch / listen to away games as I am virtually guaranteed disappointment. I watched the Bradford game on Tuesday little believing we could be comprehensively turned over by a League 2 side but hang on this is Aston Villa now securely placed in the media as the laughing stock and whipping boys of the Premiership. Has anyone seen the joke doing the rounds on Twitter? Beef stock, chicken stock and laughing stock with the Villa badge next to it. That's how far we have fallen. I'm sick to death with most things Villa these days and I'm sick of work colleagues taking the piss. I don't bother with a programme now, we spend next to nothing on merchandise and very little on food and drink at the games. Why..I just haven't got the heart anymore. Its just so so depressing. Funnily enough I don't blame Lambert. I think, as I said in a previous post, that he has made some bad calls selection and formation wise but the root cause is the fundamental mismanagement of the club by our owner. To think that not long after MON was appointed he was held up as the model owner. He knows **** all about football and even less about Aston Villa. Seemingly he now expects the earth with the pile of shit that apparently are the professional footballers who play for our club. Where we find ourselves today is the product of the comprehensive mis management of the club since the very first day he became the owner. Trust me without investment we will be relegated, the club already has the smell of death around it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 It's taken a few years but its good that people can finally see the sort of owner we really have. Like I said in another thread there is no one for him to hide behind or to shift the blame to now. Hopefully the more fans that realise the more pressure will be on for him to do what needs to be done or sell up and **** off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villarocker Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 I'm beginning to think that the worst thing Ellis ever did to us was to sell up to Lerner. Lambert needs to really work his magic here on in. Although, wins this month really damage is claim for needing to add to our squad. He really is in a no win situation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaForever1970 Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 It's taken a few years but its good that people can finally see the sort of owner we really have. Like I said in another thread there is no one for him to hide behind or to shift the blame to now. Hopefully the more fans that realise the more pressure will be on for him to do what needs to be done or sell up and **** off. You mean when he stopped having endless cash? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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