The, he's finally GONE! Tell us your thoughts Thread

[The_Lions_Roar]

You mean the same Harry Redknapp who got relegated twice?

McLeish who has the same points tally that MON managed at this point of the season with Villa in his first year?

But unlike MON is not afraid to give the youngsters a chance AND didn't have the problem of losing his two best attacking players, and most certainly doesn't have a massive cheque book to spend. IIRC in this past corresponding window he'd bought Ashley Young & swapped Baros for Carew.

Sorry this McLeish hatred is more about his past than anything else from what I can see of it, no matter what anyone says.

Not sure I agree with the idea that MON was afraid to give the youngsters a chance in his first season (later it is true, but we have to compare with McLeish's first season).

He started Agbonlahor in all but one league games. He also played Luke Moore regularly until Moore **** his shoulder.

Gary Cahill started 19 league matches, while Liam Ridgewell started 19 league matches. Steve Davis started 17 matches and Craig Gardner started 11 league matches. Even Isaiah Osbourne played, he started 6 league matches and appeared in 5 more.

Old players like Aaron Hughes, Kevin Phillips, Djembax2, Patrik Berger, Lee Hendrie and Milan Baros did not play much or was shown the door.

And MON has started that young McLean talent in several matches in Sunderland, so he is not afraid to let the young players play in his first season at a club.

Bruce brought McLean through, it's not like mon has gone in and unearthed a gem!

[dukes]

McLeish who has the same points tally that MON managed at this point of the season with Villa in his first year?

But unlike MON is not afraid to give the youngsters a chance AND didn't have the problem of losing his two best attacking players, and most certainly doesn't have a massive cheque book to spend. IIRC in this past corresponding window he'd bought Ashley Young & swapped Baros for Carew.

Sorry this McLeish hatred is more about his past than anything else from what I can see of it, no matter what anyone says.

What utter rubbish.

I am tired of seeing this utter tripe by some.

MON took over a Villa side that finished 16th. He had no preseason.

McLeish took over a side that finished 9th (which was still a big underachievemnt)with much better squad .Had a preseason , whole summer to buy his own players - including £10 million on N'Zogbia - not too shabby compared to some other sides resources.

To try and compare MON first season with this season with this diabolical manager who has a pathetic previous record in this league is utterly stupid.

Why not compare THIS season?

MON at Sunderland in 11 games has won 7.

McLeish at better Villa squad has won 6 in 24 games.

3 home games all season.

Shambles.

McLeish has a win % of less than 25% in his whole PRemier league career - a truly miserable stat.

So yes his previous rubbish record at Birmingham IS VERY RELEVANT as his record with us is a mirror image.

Wake up.

When Randy took over the whole club was given a huge lift. The atmosphere changed immediately to that of a club and fans being at one for the first time in years. With Ellis and O'Leary gone and the charismatic O'Neill in place we were only ever on the rise. If McLeish had been appointed then, I doubt the result would have been much different, likewise i think under the current circumstances MON would strUggle, I guess he thought the same as he wasnt prepared to work at the club when the spending was stopped and the cuts were required.

In 2006 most managers would have seen the potential at Villa, a new mega rich owner, the nearly finished training ground, a great stadium, and fans united behind the new board mean that even though we had finished in 16th the season before we were in a better position than in 2011.

In 2011 we had finished 9th by the skin of our teeth when the players decided they should actually do some work for their wages. The fans were unhappy that MON the saviour had gone, even more unhappy that Houllier had been appointed. There were fights between senior squad members and the coaching staff. Martinez had very publically decided to not even come and talk about the job. We were left with demotivated players and fans, and a club that needed to cut costs further.

Do you really think McLeish inherited a better situation than MON ?

[dukes]

Not sure I agree with the idea that MON was afraid to give the youngsters a chance in his first season (later it is true, but we have to compare with McLeish's first season).

He started Agbonlahor in all but one league games. He also played Luke Moore regularly until Moore **** his shoulder.

Gary Cahill started 19 league matches, while Liam Ridgewell started 19 league matches. Steve Davis started 17 matches and Craig Gardner started 11 league matches. Even Isaiah Osbourne played, he started 6 league matches and appeared in 5 more.

Old players like Aaron Hughes, Kevin Phillips, Djembax2, Patrik Berger, Lee Hendrie and Milan Baros did not play much or was shown the door.

And MON has started that young McLean talent in several matches in Sunderland, so he is not afraid to let the young players play in his first season at a club.

The fact is that in his first season MON did use the younger players, but generally when he signed players for the first team he looked for experience, so inevitably he signed players in their late twenties and early thirties. These players at their peak demand high transfer fees and contracts, nd generally have one contract at the club before taking advantage of free transfers for one final pay day. That intubation contributed massively to our financial situation.

[macandally]

If McLeish had been appointed then, I doubt the result would have been much different, likewise i think under the current circumstances MON would strggle, I guess he thought the same as he wasnt prepared to work at the club when the spending was stopped and the cuts were required.

I think current circumstances would counter your argument. How much has MON spent at Sunderland to earn his 7 wins out of 10?

McLeish has had close to 20 million. Stop making frankly ridiculous excuses for the man.

[Keyblade]

If I were the board, I'd snap up AVB after he gets sacked. Although Chelsea play the sort of gutless football many Villa fans are complaining about. Meh, the manager pool is so shallow.

[bickster]

If McLeish had been appointed then, I doubt the result would have been much different, likewise i think under the current circumstances MON would strggle, I guess he thought the same as he wasnt prepared to work at the club when the spending was stopped and the cuts were required.

I think current circumstances would counter your argument. How much has MON spent at Sunderland to earn his 7 wins out of 10?

McLeish has had close to 20 million. Stop making frankly ridiculous excuses for the man.

McLeish had to replace Downing and Young with that £20mil… really it does help to have both eyes open when debating points.

[dukes]

If McLeish had been appointed then, I doubt the result would have been much different, likewise i think under the current circumstances MON would strggle, I guess he thought the same as he wasnt prepared to work at the club when the spending was stopped and the cuts were required.

I think current circumstances would counter your argument. How much has MON spent at Sunderland to earn his 7 wins out of 10?

McLeish has had close to 20 million. Stop making frankly ridiculous excuses for the man.

Sunderland signed 11 player in the summer (spending around £25M) and in my opinion have a better squad than us. They were massively under performing under Bruce, and once again MON put himself into a position where he couldn't lose.

[macandally]

If McLeish had been appointed then, I doubt the result would have been much different, likewise i think under the current circumstances MON would strggle, I guess he thought the same as he wasnt prepared to work at the club when the spending was stopped and the cuts were required.

I think current circumstances would counter your argument. How much has MON spent at Sunderland to earn his 7 wins out of 10?

McLeish has had close to 20 million. Stop making frankly ridiculous excuses for the man.

McLeish had to replace Downing and Young with that £20mil… really it does help to have both eyes open when debating points.

I think that point is a little too black and white.

20 million can be spent in a number of different ways. Give McLeish the money and he tries to fill holes created in a system put in place by ONeill.

Give Lambert, Martinez or Poyet the money and they would l suggest use it to bring in players from other leagues that are comfortable on the ball, technically capable and young enough to be bedded into a new system and way of playing.

Therein lies the issue. McLeish is systematic of an old school coaching system, the aforementioned managers are representative of a newer coaching culture.

[macandally]

If McLeish had been appointed then, I doubt the result would have been much different, likewise i think under the current circumstances MON would strggle, I guess he thought the same as he wasnt prepared to work at the club when the spending was stopped and the cuts were required.

I think current circumstances would counter your argument. How much has MON spent at Sunderland to earn his 7 wins out of 10?

McLeish has had close to 20 million. Stop making frankly ridiculous excuses for the man.

Sunderland signed 11 player in the summer (spending around £25M) and in my opinion have a better squad than us. They were massively under performing under Bruce, and once again MON put himself into a position where he couldn't lose.

So your suggesting that if MON came back to Villa tomorrow, he wouldnt take this squad into at least the top 8?

Hypothetically speaking of course?

If so, I would take any bet you would care to lay.

[dukes]

If McLeish had been appointed then, I doubt the result would have been much different, likewise i think under the current circumstances MON would strggle, I guess he thought the same as he wasnt prepared to work at the club when the spending was stopped and the cuts were required.

I think current circumstances would counter your argument. How much has MON spent at Sunderland to earn his 7 wins out of 10?

McLeish has had close to 20 million. Stop making frankly ridiculous excuses for the man.

Sunderland signed 11 player in the summer (spending around £25M) and in my opinion have a better squad than us. They were massively under performing under Bruce, and once again MON put himself into a position where he couldn't lose.

So your suggesting that if MON came back to Villa tomorrow, he wouldnt take this squad into at least the top 8?

Hypothetically speaking of course?

If so, I would take any bet you would care to lay.

I'm saying that in my opinion Sunderland have a better squad than we do.

Right now, any manager change would give this club a lift simply because of the hatred being shown to McLeish.

[bickster]

If McLeish had been appointed then, I doubt the result would have been much different, likewise i think under the current circumstances MON would strggle, I guess he thought the same as he wasnt prepared to work at the club when the spending was stopped and the cuts were required.

I think current circumstances would counter your argument. How much has MON spent at Sunderland to earn his 7 wins out of 10?

McLeish has had close to 20 million. Stop making frankly ridiculous excuses for the man.

McLeish had to replace Downing and Young with that £20mil… really it does help to have both eyes open when debating points.

I think that point is a little too black and white.

20 million can be spent in a number of different ways. Give McLeish the money and he tries to fill holes created in a system put in place by ONeill.

Give Lambert, Martinez or Poyet the money and they would l suggest use it to bring in players from other leagues that are comfortable on the ball, technically capable and young enough to be bedded into a new system and way of playing.

Therein lies the issue. McLeish is systematic of an old school coaching system, the aforementioned managers are representative of a newer coaching culture.

And I think your point is utterly nonsensical and unprovable. Are seriously suggesting Young and Downing didn't need replacing? No matter what "system" the manager chose, those players needed replacing

You name some managers (one of whom at least didn't want to come here) and suggest what you think they might do based on… a whole heap of nothing, you have nothing to back up your suggestion, you have no actual proof of what they'd do in the same situation, to claim you do would be a sign of delusion on your behalf. That isn't a debate, it's a playground scrap, it's up there with my Dad's bigger than your Dad. Complete folly of an argument.

[Keyblade]

If McLeish had been appointed then, I doubt the result would have been much different, likewise i think under the current circumstances MON would strggle, I guess he thought the same as he wasnt prepared to work at the club when the spending was stopped and the cuts were required.

I think current circumstances would counter your argument. How much has MON spent at Sunderland to earn his 7 wins out of 10?

McLeish has had close to 20 million. Stop making frankly ridiculous excuses for the man.

McLeish had to replace Downing and Young with that £20mil… really it does help to have both eyes open when debating points.

I think that point is a little too black and white.

20 million can be spent in a number of different ways. Give McLeish the money and he tries to fill holes created in a system put in place by ONeill.

Give Lambert, Martinez or Poyet the money and they would l suggest use it to bring in players from other leagues that are comfortable on the ball, technically capable and young enough to be bedded into a new system and way of playing.

Therein lies the issue. McLeish is systematic of an old school coaching system, the aforementioned managers are representative of a newer coaching culture.

You keep mentioning these managers. What makes you so sure they would build something at Aston Villa?

[cbr600rr]

i ask you this.....if AM was in charge of newcastle would they be 6th from top? not a clucking chance! untill the muppet AM is removed,i expect the same results/performances/playes/low gates etc etc

[bickster]

i ask you this.....if AM was in charge of newcastle would they be 6th from top? not a clucking chance! untill the muppet AM is removed,i expect the same results/performances/playes/low gates etc etc

Ah yes, Alan Pardew, who lost a cup final and got a team promoted once, your argument is actually evidence for giving McLeish a chance as he's actually more successful than Pardew ever has been, you know, based on facts and actual evidence and things like that.

[macandally]

If McLeish had been appointed then, I doubt the result would have been much different, likewise i think under the current circumstances MON would strggle, I guess he thought the same as he wasnt prepared to work at the club when the spending was stopped and the cuts were required.

I think current circumstances would counter your argument. How much has MON spent at Sunderland to earn his 7 wins out of 10?

McLeish has had close to 20 million. Stop making frankly ridiculous excuses for the man.

McLeish had to replace Downing and Young with that £20mil… really it does help to have both eyes open when debating points.

I think that point is a little too black and white.

20 million can be spent in a number of different ways. Give McLeish the money and he tries to fill holes created in a system put in place by ONeill.

Give Lambert, Martinez or Poyet the money and they would l suggest use it to bring in players from other leagues that are comfortable on the ball, technically capable and young enough to be bedded into a new system and way of playing.

Therein lies the issue. McLeish is systematic of an old school coaching system, the aforementioned managers are representative of a newer coaching culture.

And I think your point is utterly nonsensical and unprovable. Are seriously suggesting Young and Downing didn't need replacing? No matter what "system" the manager chose, those players needed replacing

You name some managers (one of whom at least didn't want to come here) and suggest what you think they might do based on… a whole heap of nothing, you have nothing to back up your suggestion, you have no actual proof of what they'd do in the same situation, to claim you do would be a sign of delusion on your behalf. That isn't a debate, it's a playground scrap, it's up there with my Dad's bigger than your Dad. Complete folly of an argument.

Hence why I said your post was black and white, the world actually works in shades of grey and I say again, did we need like for like replacements for Young and Downing?

You ignored that question.

If you change your system from using wide players in a counter attacking role then no you dont need to buy two wingers. Change to a Chelsea system and wingers become obselete, instead your reliant on attacking midfielders and wing back. Buy the players to suit the system, unfortunately, we seem to have a different one everyweek.

Your right I dont know, what I do know is that I would rather have found out with one of those guys than suffer the wholly predictable and short term processes of McLeish.

As for the rest, with all due respect I am not going to bite.

[macandally]

If McLeish had been appointed then, I doubt the result would have been much different, likewise i think under the current circumstances MON would strggle, I guess he thought the same as he wasnt prepared to work at the club when the spending was stopped and the cuts were required.

I think current circumstances would counter your argument. How much has MON spent at Sunderland to earn his 7 wins out of 10?

McLeish has had close to 20 million. Stop making frankly ridiculous excuses for the man.

McLeish had to replace Downing and Young with that £20mil… really it does help to have both eyes open when debating points.

I think that point is a little too black and white.

20 million can be spent in a number of different ways. Give McLeish the money and he tries to fill holes created in a system put in place by ONeill.

Give Lambert, Martinez or Poyet the money and they would l suggest use it to bring in players from other leagues that are comfortable on the ball, technically capable and young enough to be bedded into a new system and way of playing.

Therein lies the issue. McLeish is systematic of an old school coaching system, the aforementioned managers are representative of a newer coaching culture.

You keep mentioning these managers. What makes you so sure they would build something at Aston Villa?

Because coaching, like football constantly progresses.

I dont know if they would be succesful, but I would enjoy finding out a hell of a lot more.

[Hanky]

I still think our squad is decent enough to be up the league. Not wonderful by any stretch but we should be doing better no doubt about it. McLeish has still had some positives in his time here, but negatives are outweighing him at the moment. Think Blackburn next week is crucial assuming we don't get anything from today.

[bickster]

Hence why I said your post was black and white, the world actually works in shades of grey and I say again, did we need like for like replacements for Young and Downing?

You ignored that question.

No I dealt with it, you made one big huge assumption. Did I say like for like replacements? We didn't actually do like for like replacements anyway so your point is utterly irrelevant. NZog is not a like for like replacement for either Downing or Young who are both traditional wingers whereas Nzog is more of an inside forward for want of a better term

[avfc1982]

I'll judge McLeish after he's been backed by Lerner. He took over a club decimated by sales of its better players and all round cut backs. I honestly think he'll get decent money to spend in the summer, and then we'll see what he's made of.

McLeish has shown balls of steel to take over at a club with no real investment (considering where he came from).

[Mantis]

If I were the board, I'd snap up AVB after he gets sacked. Although Chelsea play the sort of gutless football many Villa fans are complaining about. Meh, the manager pool is so shallow.

At least we'd be attacking under him. I expect AVB, like any sane person, would recognise that our defence is poor and that our strength lies in attack.

We'd never get him though.