Moorski Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Liking him has nothing to do with it. If he is not cutting it, he has to be fired, and Mr Lerner knows that. Business is business. My only concern is at what point...... That is all of our concerns and the point of liking him is that he will give him more time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacbuddies Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 He left SHA because he was offered the Villa job,he is unlikely to be offered a better position this summer is he? You're probably right but the FA have a reputation for hiring useless England managers so we can always live in hope! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 In hindsight we didn't need Hutton as Lichaj looks quality And cuellar had proved he could play there. I'm not saying it was ideal but he spent £10 million on nzogbia and bought hutton. Thats not a victim of circumstance. Thats signing a player and failing to get the best out of him and deciding a young player is good enough and failing to get the best out of him. Cuellar is not a specialized FB. Or could it be that N'Zogbia is taking time to settle at a new club? You still haven't answered my question. How do you know he decided that Albrighton was going to be good enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morpheus Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 He had to spend money on a RB as young left. Actually no he didn't. As was said at the time by a number of people including myself RB was the one area of the squad we didn't need to buy someone for even with the departure of Young. McLeish decided to buy one though and use his limited resources to do so. Eh, yes he did. So we were to carry on then with no specialized RB when Young left? I remember another manager receiving untold stick on here playing centrebacks at RB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 There's no rumour from liverplops board Doglish will be sacked, but refer to the results and others think otherwise, even the media in his case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacbuddies Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 There's no rumour from liverplops board Doglish will be sacked, but refer to the results and others think otherwise, even the media in his case Are you in the right Forum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 There's no rumour from liverplops board Doglish will be sacked, but refer to the results and others think otherwise, even the media in his case Are you in the right Forum? It was just reference 'Morski' said the board had no intentions of sacking him. As if we even know what the board are thinking anytime! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacbuddies Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 There's no rumour from liverplops board Doglish will be sacked, but refer to the results and others think otherwise, even the media in his case Are you in the right Forum? It was just reference 'Morski' said the board had no intentions of sacking him. As if we even know what the board are thinking anytime! OK now I understand! Nobody on here knows anything about what our Board are going to do. Everyone just speculates and, in some cases, hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CI Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 I don't think our board know what they're going to do next Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciggiesnbeer Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Kenny has only equaled McLeish's silverware haul. But spend a hundred million quid to get it. I have no point here other than to troll any passing Liverpool fans 8) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrentVilla Posted April 8, 2012 Moderator Share Posted April 8, 2012 Eh, yes he did. So we were to carry on then with no specialized RB when Young left? I remember another manager receiving untold stick on here playing centrebacks at RB. No, no we didn't. McLeish had a choice, in fact he had at least a couple. He had players who could have played RB, he opted not to use them and he opted to sign Hutton. Nobody forced him to sign a RB and nobody forced him to sign Hutton those were his decisions, he wasn't in anyway a victim of circumstance in making them. He I would presume knew what budget he had in terms of signing players and he knew the weakness of the squad but he decided to buy a RB when he could have made do with what he had. Yes O'Neill got stick for playing CB's at RB but that is entirely different. Martin O'Neill had huge amounts of money to spend but for almost 2 years didn't buy a RB. Instead he paid nearly £8m for a CB and pushed him out there. O'Neill deserved the stick he got. If McLeish hadn't signed Hutton and had used the money for other areas I think most would have understood his logic. Next to nobody thought RB was a priority last summer especially given that we had no cover at all for Warnock on the other side of the pitch yet we had at least 3 players able to play RB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 I am not pro McCleish, he wasn't on my list of managerial choice and i don't think he was on any Villa fans, so much of my criticism of Lerner and our situation stems from his staggering arrogance and delusion in appointing a manager no-one wanted. But let's look at it from Eck's viewpoint, he was offered a step up from a Championship side - who from what I gather have been sent backwards by multiple owner changes corruption and meddling in managerial affairs. It was rumored that may signings were not down to him and his relationship with the top brass was broken by the end. Now his stupidity at thinking he could walk the divide between two same City clubs who hate each other is baffling, especially with a record that has been less than stellar in recent years. But I find our intense hatred of him is misplaced. Let's state some facts 1) He inherited a club stripped of it's best players, on the back of a relegation battle that was only won in the last few games. Criminal wages and players alienated by either MON in the past or Houllier in the more recent past. A catalogue of mismanagement, high wages and bad transfer decisions, created a deflated team with very little central technical or creative ability. MON played a system with counter attacking forwards and wingers, there was never a plan B or a central back bone to that team. In my opinion it was more baffling why we failed last season than this season as Milner aside much of the team that MON had were still there last season, some would say Houller did make us play in a much more passing and technical way by the end, but i don't think we would be much better off under him once Downing and Young were gone - nor would we be much worse! 2) I don't think Eck plays negatively on purpose, but there are times you get the impression he doesn't believe in the squad he has - or rather he is still getting to know and understand the players he has. We just expected him to come in on a wave of negative press and vibe with a bunch of players who have seen their team mates sold off or been frozen out of the team. 3) What Eck did wrong was continuously fail to work out how to play the players he has and get the best from Nzogbia, but he needed time and patience, time and patience that we weren't prepared to give him because collectively we are all hurting from what happened with MON, what happened with Houllier and the players who have left, and the manner of his appointment. 4) The cruel irony is when Ireland, Zoggy and Keane were on the pitch we didn't play negatively, Hutton looked ok and you could see what Eck was trying to do. This doesn't excuse all the other terrible performances and tactics deployed but you have to look at what Eck has been given to work with. If Zog, Dunne, Clark, Bent, Petrov were all available i genuinely think we would have found a few more wins by now and be close to safety. I am not saying we be anywhere near the team we should be and Eck embraced and about too live happily ever after, but people have to admit our injury problems this season have been appalling, in fact over the last two seasons they have completely destroyed any sees of hope of momentum we have had, our luck has been a **** disgrace. 5) Eck did manage to get Ireland, Cuellar playing and playing well, Petrov and Gabby looked pretty decent and rejuvenated at times. He brought Warnock back from the brink, ok so the jury is out on Warnock and maybe still on Hutton but both have looked quite solid of late. He has also done pretty well with the youngsters although he hasn't really stuck with any of them through choice, Herd is the only player guaranteed to start when fit, Bannan, Lichaj, Gardener and Baker are all cameos or players who we have no choice but to start. He looks like he has some faith in Weimann though although would he start with Bent fit? Clark seemed to get games before his injury so he has done a reasonable job with the youth. He has failed to get the best out of Zoggy and Albrighton, he has relied on Heskey but for some reason countless manager's have done that! I know you look at Swansea, Newcastle and Norwich and say why can those teams do so well with squads similar or worse than ours. Well those squads have been promoted together under the same manager and have some continuity and consistency of playing staff and leadership - something that is critical in stability and survival (just look at Everton). Yes Brendan Rogers is doing awesomely at Swansea, but he bailed on Watford and did badly at Reading. Lambert also did the dirty on Colchester but he's done superbly at Norwich so i can't criticise him much. Pardew has been awful as a manager in the past but he's found his place at Newcastle and he has a battle hardened squad who have been through some rough times together, something i almost hope will stand us in good stead in the future with or without Eck. I know this rambling nonsense above looks like I am absolving Eck of blame, i'm not, i am just trying to get some headspace where we try and divide up emotion from fact. I don't hate Eck, I don't read negativity into everything he says, his a human being who is trying his hardest to steady a sinking ship with a depleted playing squad and a chairman who had really **** things up badly. I want him to do well for the club because i love this club and i believe he wants to do well for the club and all the while he is at the club i have to hope he can do a job - even when that defies logic. You have to remember how many managers were awful when the first joined their clubs, Fergie is a good example. My hope is we avoid relegation and Eck leaves in the summer, if Lerner decides to put money into the club then i'm not sure if i can see Eck spending it well - but it is impossible to say whether or not given backing his vision for the team would be anywhere near as bad as some would make out. what a long post, sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denis_B Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 You have to remember how many managers were awful when the first joined their clubs, Fergie is a good example Not that one again....he is the only one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daweii Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 Kenny has only equaled McLeish's silverware haul. But spend a hundred million quid to get it. I have no point here other than to troll any passing Liverpool fans 8) How has Kenny managed that.. He has spent £100 million and arguably he now has a squad worse than the one he inherited. Now that takes some skill.. I think even McLeish is looking down on that with a small grin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 You have to remember how many managers were awful when the first joined their clubs, Fergie is a good example Not that one again....he is the only one! ha ha - ummm yeah maybe you can only use that one if a shit manager has become good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 We've seen enough of McLeish over the years to know that he doesn't get better with time. Negative, low-scoring hoofball is his way. He's not going to change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juanpabloangel18 Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 We've seen enough of McLeish over the years to know that he doesn't get better with time. Negative, low-scoring hoofball is his way. He's not going to change. Yeh, I don't think he has any excuses for this. Plenty of managers who work with tight resources attempt to get their team playing attacking and attractive football. This season has been just a painful confirmation of what we all knew about Eck before last season ended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pacbuddies Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 To think that less than 12 months ago we were probably praising McLeish for his contribution to getting SHA relegated and giving us all a big smile on our faces at the last home game versus Liverpool. I can see it as clear as if it were just yesterday, almost the whole of the VP crowd raising and lowering their arms and singing along to the 'Going Up, Going Down' song. Absolutely brilliant. Now here we are hoping that he doesn't weave his perverted magic on us and give the SHA fans the same happy feeling! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_John_10 Posted April 9, 2012 Share Posted April 9, 2012 You still haven't answered my question. How do you know he decided that Albrighton was going to be good enough? Well it's pretty obvious. He lost young and downing and signed nzogbia. Not signing another winter obviously shows he was happy with just having nzogbia and albrighton as his two main wingers. He decided to sign a rb that wasn't needed and got a cm on loan that again wasn't really needed and also stood a good chance of getting injured. If he though albrighton was good enough he is an idiot. If he thought albrighton wasn't good enough and signed Hutton and jenas over a winger then he's an idiot. Either way it was a mistake and to claim he is a victim of circumstance is pathetic. Nzogbia cost as much as we paid for young, and he's failed to get the best out of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumstopdogs Posted April 9, 2012 Share Posted April 9, 2012 Watching those Liverpool highlights was painful as we should have lost by 4 or 5 goals. The only positive to come out the game was we had luck on our side. Mcleish has to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts