Dodgyknees Posted December 17, 2013 Share Posted December 17, 2013 (edited) I saw Stokes play for Durham 2nds when he was 17. obvious huge talent! I wondered whether he was good enougn to bat at 6 at this stage of his career but he looks the total package. Possibly going to be our best allrounder since Botham. Only thing i blame Cook for is his own form. Captain can only have a certain amount of infleuence on a team. Ask Michael Clarke! look at his record before this series! Big diff is Lehman! Flower out! I disagree, when I played Cricket, the captain was the most important person in that dressing room, when heads dropped he was there, when catches were dropped he was the one who made sure we did more (usually I, strange as now I can catch well but probably couldn't hit a hippo!) I played across Hampshire up to age 18 and the most important captain we had was the one who grouped us together, made the plans, changed the plans, spoke to us all and got what he wanted from us. He left for "Oop North" when I was 17 and we were a VERY good team, a few got scouted for Hampshire and a few went on to play County Cricket. The Captain for my final year was completely different, made mistakes with field placements, choices etc and it showed as he went from scores averaging 70 to hardly anything and we fell apart, won 3 games in 18 that season and struggled to get to the standard we had done under the previous Captain (when I spoke to him a year later, he had taken an under 21 team to their first every trophy!) So don't rule out how important a captain can be. He was the best captain I played under in any sport and got the best out of me for sure. Edited December 17, 2013 by dodgyknees Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted December 17, 2013 Share Posted December 17, 2013 Ok do you think another Captain would have changed the result of this series? I do think Cook should be relinquished the captaincy duties because of the effect his having on his form and he is probably our most important batsman. All this talk of KP being our best player. He averages 36 since his reintegration! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted December 17, 2013 Share Posted December 17, 2013 I think we have been in decline for 18 months now, I also think another captain should have been put in place instead of Cook. He might have been touted "Future England captain" by the media some 5 years ago, but that does not mean he has the mentality for the job. Great player when on form though. He just needs to be taken away from the captain duty... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dAVe80 Posted December 17, 2013 Share Posted December 17, 2013 (edited) I saw Stokes play for Durham 2nds when he was 17. obvious huge talent! I wondered whether he was good enougn to bat at 6 at this stage of his career but he looks the total package. Possibly going to be our best allrounder since Botham. Yeah I've seen a fair bit of Stokes, living up here. I get to Chester Le Street on a regular basis. They've been talking about this lad for a long time. He's had his share of trouble (sent home from an A tour), but he's really knuckled down and got on with his cricket. He's come on leaps and bounds in the past 12 months. His maiden ton was great to see, and one ray of sunshine in yet another horror show from England. Edited December 17, 2013 by dAVe80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avfc96 Posted December 17, 2013 Share Posted December 17, 2013 (edited) I can totally agree with Dodgyknees about how the captain affects the team and the performances as a result. 2 and a bit of years ago at the age of 16 we started to take our cricket seriously but we had a pretty shit captain. He was the leading wicket taker in the team in the seasons before he was made captain however when he was made captain he wasn't able to motivate the team when people dropped catches and missed run out opportunities etc and therefore we all suffered as a team. Hos bowling suffered and he got carted around the ground as a result. However, we changed captain half way through the season to one of our batsmen and we won every game for the rest of the season. The difference was he was able to set correct field placings and was more of a proactive captain than a reactive one. When someone dropped a catch it didn't have the same affect and he was able to motivate the team and keep our spirits up aswell. The former captain also got his form back and has been our leading wicket taker for the past two seasons as a result of not having the pressure of being captain anymore. Edited December 17, 2013 by Avfc96 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veloman Posted December 17, 2013 Share Posted December 17, 2013 Whilst very rarely disagreeing with PaulC, I do reckon that the captain can have a huge impact on the team. Those of us who are old enough will remember the influence Mike Brearley (sp) had on the England team. I didn't think he was that great a batsman but he was a great captain and Botham, IMO, was a much better player with him in charge. Problem though is who comes in as captain ? Sir Ian perhaps ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunRickyRun Posted December 17, 2013 Share Posted December 17, 2013 Congratulations to the Aussies. I hope that Stokes goes on from this performance - a lot to like about the way he batted for his ton. Yep. Congratulations Australia. Some cracking cricket played by your lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted December 19, 2013 Share Posted December 19, 2013 Whilst very rarely disagreeing with PaulC, I do reckon that the captain can have a huge impact on the team. Those of us who are old enough will remember the influence Mike Brearley (sp) had on the England team. I didn't think he was that great a batsman but he was a great captain and Botham, IMO, was a much better player with him in charge. Problem though is who comes in as captain ? Sir Ian perhaps ? Mike Brearley was a brilliant captain i agree. Was it down to him though the winning of that ashes series. Shackles off Botham hit one of the best test innings of all time and then Willis bowled like a demon 2nd innings and the whole series turned from that point. No doubt Brearley had an influence but how great i don't know! That said i don't rate Cook as a captain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villarule123 Posted December 22, 2013 VT Supporter Share Posted December 22, 2013 Swann has just retired! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyM3000 Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 Was just searching the pages for this thread. Swanny was my fav player, England are falling apart in more ways than we could have ever predicted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8pints Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 Swann has just retired! So the Ashes were his Swann song. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 (edited) Edited December 22, 2013 by snowychap 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lp_villa830 Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 Is this the worst tour down under ever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjw63 Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Quitting half way through a tour is a bit weak 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisp65 Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 yep, got to agree that's weak, we've lost so I'm not finishing this, I'm going home I guess I had a similar attitude when I was about 7 never mind, years of question of sport and splash! ahead to pay the bills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 ive always felt that Swann was a prick of the highest order from how he comes across and im not really surprised by this decision or its timing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 (edited) Thats harsh I think his reasons are very honest. He's had his injury problems and hes been struggling for some time and if he can't bowl,a lot of overs at max then hes not a lot of use to England. Edited December 23, 2013 by PaulC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drat01 Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Thats harsh I think his reasons are very honest. He's had his injury problems and hes been struggling for some time and if he can't bowl,a lot of overs at max then hes not a lot of use to England. There is also an argument that as the series is lost now is actually a very good time to quit because the replacements can be seen in a tough test match to see what they can do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Thats harsh I think his reasons are very honest. He's had his injury problems and hes been struggling for some time and if he can't bowl,a lot of overs at max then hes not a lot of use to England. There is also an argument that as the series is lost now is actually a very good time to quit because the replacements can be seen in a tough test match to see what they can do Maybe. Treadwell is crap. 17 wickets at 57 last season. Scott Borthwick is quite a prospect though. Top order batsman as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderPower_14 Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 How boring was the end of the South Africa v India test? 3 overs to go on day 5, South Africa need 16 runs, India need 3 wickets, all the makings of a classic and Philander and Steyn block it out for the draw. What a disgrace. I stayed up to watch it for nothing. I'd be livid if Australia did that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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