TRO Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 1 hour ago, Sam-AVFC said: It didn't factor in passion or getting stuck in. you have some front, coming out with that.....and wondering why folk respond adversely. people who live in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 1 hour ago, daft said: Well, according to that table we are taller than Bournemouth. Average height is not the issue....height in crucial situations, relating to marking is. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, TRO said: Right now, its hard to see past your comments.....but up until I Jan 2022, folk would have laughed at that. Something has happened, since the last Window. Yes, as SG said that was a mini preseason for him in that January. First time he could get his ideas into those players. Since then we have been poor! Edited August 11, 2022 by nick76 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 14 minutes ago, Tom13 said: Not true. McGinn shouldn't be present in there, Luiz should be a regular in there. His strength is keeping the ball, and he can do that in tight spaces. McGinn is very important to our ball progression which was shown in his sky high stats in that department last season. Luiz is also very capable and in an 8 position he should do well this season. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Sam-AVFC Posted August 11, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted August 11, 2022 16 minutes ago, TRO said: you have some front, coming out with that.....and wondering why folk respond adversely. people who live in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones. It's a joke. All this talk of mentally weak players for you to go and show yourself up as very easily offended! I haven't wondered why people respond adversely as no one has because I've ignored most of the debates in here for months. I have a few who have firmly placed themselves on my 'don't bother' list by repeating the same trite nonsense year after year. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daft Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 26 minutes ago, TRO said: Average height is not the issue....height in crucial situations, relating to marking is. Indeed. It was general poor defending that cost us more than height to be fair. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daft Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 15 minutes ago, CVByrne said: McGinn is very important to our ball progression which was shown in his sky high stats in that department last season. Luiz is also very capable and in an 8 position he should do well this season. Luiz is in the 34th percentile in progressive passer per 90 and 41st in progressive carries per 90. McGinn is 76th and 49th respectively. Granted, that is compared to all the top 5 European leagues, not just the Premier League. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 15 minutes ago, daft said: Luiz is in the 34th percentile in progressive passer per 90 and 41st in progressive carries per 90. McGinn is 76th and 49th respectively. Granted, that is compared to all the top 5 European leagues, not just the Premier League. You can check the PL option in fbref. No player outside of top 6 had as much ball progression as McGinnin PL last season. Also his share of the overall teams ball progression was the highest in the league. So basically he is one of best ball progressors and he's doing the majority of it himself for Villa. We just focus on his poor short passing and him getting caught in possession. We really need someone else in there to help progress the ball. Luiz can be given the chance to do that at 8. He wasn't going to be doing that at 6 last season. We do need a new signing though to chip in with this though 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daft Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 Just now, CVByrne said: You can check the PL option in fbref. No player outside of top 6 had as much ball progression as McGinnin PL last season. Also his share of the overall teams ball progression was the highest in the league. So basically he is one of best ball progressors and he's doing the majority of it himself for Villa. We just focus on his poor short passing and him getting caught in possession. We really need someone else in there to help progress the ball. Luiz can be given the chance to do that at 8. He wasn't going to be doing that at 6 last season. We do need a new signing though to chip in with this though Fully agreed. And an anchor for the massive hole in midfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVByrne Posted August 12, 2022 Share Posted August 12, 2022 I feel his future hinges on him changing how we set up. We need to change the midfield set up, tweak the full backs and play two up top. We need one box to box 8 and two more defensive minded so Luiz and Kamara are must starts with our current squad. We need Watkins and Ings up top to provide a goal threat one or the other are too limited for various reasons without goal scoring inside forwards flanking them. McGinn needs to start on left side of Midfield 3 and if Ramsey starts it's to be on the right. One of them is the box to box to get into the forward line. Gerrard has a philosophy which doesn't work for a mid table Premier League team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Delphinho123 Posted August 12, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted August 12, 2022 I think this picture says it all with regards to Gerrards tactics - or lack of them. Where the f*** is our midfield? We can't just play with Kamara and then two no.8's who bomb on - especially as the fullbacks push so far forward. Honestly, tactically, we're a mess. Kamara is going to be hung out to dry this season unless we tweak the way we're playing or sign another defensive midfielder. We're an absolute mess in the middle of the park. Teams are just going to run through us. Wakey wakey, Villa. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PieFacE Posted August 12, 2022 VT Supporter Share Posted August 12, 2022 40 minutes ago, Delphinho123 said: I think this picture says it all with regards to Gerrards tactics - or lack of them. Where the f*** is our midfield? We can't just play with Kamara and then two no.8's who bomb on - especially as the fullbacks push so far forward. Honestly, tactically, we're a mess. Kamara is going to be hung out to dry this season unless we tweak the way we're playing or sign another defensive midfielder. We're an absolute mess in the middle of the park. Teams are just going to run through us. Wakey wakey, Villa. Yeah absolutely. Most other teams appear to move up and down the pitch as a unit, but we just don't do that. Huge gaps everywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anything11 Posted August 12, 2022 Share Posted August 12, 2022 42 minutes ago, Delphinho123 said: I think this picture says it all with regards to Gerrards tactics - or lack of them. Where the f*** is our midfield? We can't just play with Kamara and then two no.8's who bomb on - especially as the fullbacks push so far forward. Honestly, tactically, we're a mess. Kamara is going to be hung out to dry this season unless we tweak the way we're playing or sign another defensive midfielder. We're an absolute mess in the middle of the park. Teams are just going to run through us. Wakey wakey, Villa. Pay attention to every time the ball goes to a full back. It often looks like this - however Digne does a good job on the left to progress play when he receives it here or recycle it. If you think about pressing structures they often want the ball to go to the fullback or out to either side to trigger a press (using the sideline as an extra man). We do it to teams all game. However we often end up in the same position due to a what appears to be a weak midfield. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul33 Posted August 12, 2022 Share Posted August 12, 2022 53 minutes ago, Delphinho123 said: I think this picture says it all with regards to Gerrards tactics - or lack of them. Where the f*** is our midfield? We can't just play with Kamara and then two no.8's who bomb on - especially as the fullbacks push so far forward. Honestly, tactically, we're a mess. Kamara is going to be hung out to dry this season unless we tweak the way we're playing or sign another defensive midfielder. We're an absolute mess in the middle of the park. Teams are just going to run through us. Wakey wakey, Villa. Where do you expect them to be when playing against a 10-man low block ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted August 12, 2022 Share Posted August 12, 2022 51 minutes ago, Delphinho123 said: I think this picture says it all with regards to Gerrards tactics - or lack of them. Where the f*** is our midfield? We can't just play with Kamara and then two no.8's who bomb on - especially as the fullbacks push so far forward. Honestly, tactically, we're a mess. Kamara is going to be hung out to dry this season unless we tweak the way we're playing or sign another defensive midfielder. We're an absolute mess in the middle of the park. Teams are just going to run through us. Wakey wakey, Villa. It's the players that will be thrown under the buss (and rightly so sometimes) but the tactic is flawed and no player however tall, aggressive, or fast is going to fix it. Said it when we signed Kamara he's going to be dismissed as not good enough for the PL because the job is impossible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post bose Posted August 12, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted August 12, 2022 1 hour ago, Delphinho123 said: I think this picture says it all with regards to Gerrards tactics - or lack of them. Where the f*** is our midfield? We can't just play with Kamara and then two no.8's who bomb on - especially as the fullbacks push so far forward. Honestly, tactically, we're a mess. Kamara is going to be hung out to dry this season unless we tweak the way we're playing or sign another defensive midfielder. We're an absolute mess in the middle of the park. Teams are just going to run through us. Wakey wakey, Villa. This could easily be fixed with taller and angrier players. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted August 12, 2022 Share Posted August 12, 2022 1 hour ago, Delphinho123 said: I think this picture says it all with regards to Gerrards tactics - or lack of them. Where the f*** is our midfield? We can't just play with Kamara and then two no.8's who bomb on - especially as the fullbacks push so far forward. Honestly, tactically, we're a mess. Kamara is going to be hung out to dry this season unless we tweak the way we're playing or sign another defensive midfielder. We're an absolute mess in the middle of the park. Teams are just going to run through us. Wakey wakey, Villa. HOOF ball I thought was only a Mings thing, percentage Pulis ball stuff that the guy behind Bailey will win the 2nd ball Is it McGinn behind Bailey, whoever it is has zero tactical awareness of football Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken Field Posted August 12, 2022 Share Posted August 12, 2022 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Paul33 said: Where do you expect them to be when playing against a 10-man low block ? I think the last thing you want to do against a team defending like that is, to have players hiding and going in to bloated areas. youd expect and want your midfielders to offer options and progress the ball forwards, in to dangerous areas on the pitch, not just hoof it and hope for the best Edited August 12, 2022 by Chicken Field 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daft Posted August 12, 2022 Share Posted August 12, 2022 Just now, Chicken Field said: I think the last thing you want to do against a team defending like that is, for players to hide, youd expect and want your midfielders to offer options and progress the ball forwards, in to dangerous areas on the pitch, not just hoof it and hope for the best I think you need to try and create overloads in key areas, drawing some of their defenders out with movement to create space. The first we can at least try to do, the second I don't think we have the players for, which could explain why we suddenly tried lifted crosses instead of low cut-backs from closer to goal, created by overloads out wide or in the half-spaces. Just some thoughts. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anything11 Posted August 12, 2022 Share Posted August 12, 2022 9 minutes ago, daft said: I think you need to try and create overloads in key areas, drawing some of their defenders out with movement to create space. The first we can at least try to do, the second I don't think we have the players for, which could explain why we suddenly tried lifted crosses instead of low cut-backs from closer to goal, created by overloads out wide or in the half-spaces. Just some thoughts. Ding Ding Ding However on the first point - Gerrard system involves overloading wide space using fullbacks which we definitely try to do. The contention is where is it breaking down and why. I am unconvinced it is all Gerrard or all the players as I have seen convincing evidence and arguments that things aren't working in more than one area. However, the midfield does appear to be a particular problem. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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