Carney Chukwuemeka

[HanoiVillan]

Just now, brummybloke said:

We did that last season and he was offered a new contract and didn't sign.

Needs to be told,  don't sign you won't play 1st team football. It sends a message out that if you are being offered a contract and are part of the first team, you will get your chance just like Ramsey, but mess us around and we won't be held to ransom.

Sure, but there's no benefit to a player who you are not going to play who is running down his contract. That's just wasted money, so sell him this summer.

[fruitvilla]

Just now, HanoiVillan said:

Sure, but there's no benefit to a player who you are not going to play who is running down his contract. That's just wasted money, so sell him this summer.

And if he does not sell showcase him in the U23s or whatever.

[useless]

There's a lot of really ███████████ ████████ in here, people basing their judgements of him on a few minutes here and there in the Premier League, it's not even if he's been bad in those appearances, got a very good assist against Norwich, played his part in the comeback against Man Utd, do people not stop and think that they might be wrong about him and there's a good reason those that watch youth football rate him so highly and all these big clubs are interested in him.

People talke about it's only potential that he has, but with Chukwuemeka it's more than potential, some academy players are so good that it's obvious they're going to make it and become very good players, unless something gets in the way like poor decision making or injuries, Grealish was the same as an academy player, it was obvious that he was going to make the step up to first team football.

Given the circumstances and if we must lost him £20m would be a good fee, but chances are he will be worth much more than that in the not too distant future, so I don't think we'd robbing anyone and certainly not if we got £10m, I'd be surprised if he's not a full England international within the next few seasons.

As I've said previously the thing that most softens the blow of us potentially losing him is that we've got another player in Aaron Ramsey who has shown that he can play at a similar level to Carney, and is actually better than him in some respects, scoring and creating goals, at least at academy level, with him I think the biggest issue is probably size, but has brilliant technical ability, can do things none of our other academy players can do, losing Chukwuemeka will be a big blow, but we're lucky that we have him and his brother as very talented young attacking midfielders still at the club.

[fruitvilla]

4 minutes ago, useless said:

but chances are he will be worth much more than that in the not too distant future

What are the probabilities? Exactly how much more? When?

Can you show your assumptions, calculations, SWOT analyses please.

[useless]

As an encore to the above post as much as I rate Chukwuemeka and think he has, a very very good chance of being a top level footballer at the highest level, I think the same of Jacob Ramsey, he too is going to get better and better and can see him becoming a full England international soon, so again we're lucky that we still have so much young attacking midfield quality still at the club, both in terms of potential with Aaron and with Jacob who has already proven so much but also still has a lot of potential too, as good as Carney can become he will be doing well to to match Jacob.

[useless]

The only reason we'd entertain the idea of letting him go for £20m now is because we risk losing him for much less in January and presumably he himself wants to leave. So not only will he be worth much more than £20m, he probably already is worth more than £20m, because can guarantee that if he had longer on his contract and he was happy at the club there's no way we would accept a £20m bid.

A lot of this thread just shows that many Villa fans are completely and utterly oblivious to how good he actually is.

[TRO]

19 minutes ago, useless said:

There's a lot of really ███████████ ████████ in here, people basing their judgements of him on a few minutes here and there in the Premier League, it's not even if he's been bad in those appearances, got a very good assist against Norwich, played his part in the comeback against Man Utd, do people not stop and think that they might be wrong about him and there's a good reason those that watch youth football rate him so highly and all these big clubs are interested in him.

People talke about it's only potential that he has, but with Chukwuemeka it's more than potential, some academy players are so good that it's obvious they're going to make it and become very good players, unless something gets in the way like poor decision making or injuries, Grealish was the same as an academy player, it was obvious that he was going to make the step up to first team football.

Given the circumstances and if we must lost him £20m would be a good fee, but chances are he will be worth much more than that in the not too distant future, so I don't think we'd robbing anyone and certainly not if we got £10m, I'd be surprised if he's not a full England international within the next few seasons.

As I've said previously the thing that most softens the blow of us potentially losing him is that we've got another player in Aaron Ramsey who has shown that he can play at a similar level to Carney, and is actually better than him in some respects, scoring and creating goals, at least at academy level, with him I think the biggest issue is probably size, but has brilliant technical ability, can do things none of our other academy players can do, losing Chukwuemeka will be a big blow, but we're lucky that we have him and his brother as very talented young attacking midfielders still at the club.

so what would you do....pay him what he wants?

[useless]

Well I don't know what he wants so I don't know if I'd pay it, but if he's asking for ridiculous money then I wouldn't pay it as that then means all the other promsing youngsters will want similar. But I would be offering him an attractive deal as possible with the possibility of him being able to get more should he live up to his potential, but I wouldn't just pay him what he wants now, same for any player young or old.

[useless]

11 minutes ago, useless said:

As an encore to the above post as much as I rate Chukwuemeka and think he has, a very very good chance of being a top level footballer at the highest level, I think the same of Jacob Ramsey, he too is going to get better and better and can see him becoming a full England international soon, so again we're lucky that we still have so much young attacking midfield quality still at the club, both in terms of potential with Aaron and with Jacob who has already proven so much but also still has a lot of potential too, as good as Carney can become he will be doing well to to match Jacob.

  Yes if Jacob Ramsey's contract was running down and it looked like he might not sign another deal, then I think there's an high probability that some of the 'elite clubs' would be trying to sign him too.

[TRO]

6 minutes ago, useless said:

The only reason we'd entertain the idea of letting him go for £20m now is because we risk losing him for much less in January and presumably he himself wants to leave. So not only will he be worth much more than £20m, he probably already is worth more than £20m, because can guarantee that if he had longer on his contract and he was happy at the club there's no way we would accept a £20m bid.

A lot of this thread just shows that many Villa fans are completely and utterly oblivious to how good he actually is.

Don't tell me.....show me.

He isn't going for 20m or anything like it.

All these interested clubs, have nothing to lose, so it could be a gamble worth taking....depends what he wants.

Until we know what his demands are, we are all ****ing in the wind.

I still don't think he has done enough to be making demands.

[TRO]

2 minutes ago, useless said:

Well I don't know what he wants so I don't know if I'd pay it, but if he's asking for ridiculous money then I wouldn't pay it as that then means all the other promsing youngsters will want similar. But I would be offering him an attractive deal as possible with the possibility of him being able to get more should he live up to his potential, but I wouldn't just pay him what he wants now, same for any player young or old.

I have every confidence, that the people running our club, will do the best they can in such difficult circumstances.....if thats selling so be it.

I am not close enough to the club, to know the lowdown....but I'll bet those that are, have an interesting insight to it.

We are trying to build a mentality in this first team.....and this can't be helping.....hence him being removed from it.

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

28 minutes ago, useless said:

, as good as Carney can become he will be doing well to to match Jacob.

This is slightly confusing, as the way you and others aggressively speak about how brilliant he is, he shouldn't be " doing well to match Jacob" in the near future , he should be blowing him out the water?

This is Jacob, by the way, who has been humble, worked hard, not even had a fraction of the hype Carney has had, and is now an integral senior player who signed a lucrative deal, just a year after breaking through properly....

Reports ( Yes they could be total Bollox ) suggest he wants wages in the region of what JJ/Bellingham are on already, which is a pisstake by any stretch, for a multitude of reasons.

I'll take a JJ type over Carney all day, I'm sorry, and I don't care how good he might go on to be.

I see that you are passionate in your backing of.him, but just calling it how I see it. Always disclaimer that I could be totally wrong.

Edited July 16, 2022 by JAMAICAN-VILLAN

[TRO]

2 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

This is slightly confusing, as the way you and others aggressively speak about how brilliant he is, he shouldn't be " doing well to match Jacob" ok the near future , he should be blowing him out the water?

This is Jacob, by the way, who has been humble, worked hard, not even had a fraction of the hype Carney has had, and is now an integral senior player who signed a lucrative deal, just a year after breaking through properly....

Reports ( Yes they could be Bollox ) suggest he wants wages in the region of what JJ is ok, which is a pisstake by any stretch, for a multitude of reasons.

I'll take a JJ type over Carney all day, I'm sorry, and I don't care how good he might on to be.

In terms of character alone....The Ramseys seem a better bet.

[fruitvilla]

More or less agree, but what we can reasonably surmise:

1)  Carney's "agent" seems to be a non traditional type, perhaps parents, church, god type mix.
2)  Carney's ask is so high that the Villa management seem to baulking at the price.
3)  That Villa have a lot better understanding of Carney's valuation than does team Carney.
4)  A lot better understanding of othe situation than the peanut gallery here.
5)  Does not seem like an acceptable offer for Carney has come in (ie no one wants to beat the rush in January).

Of course the Villa management team may have got it all wrong.

Edited July 16, 2022 by fruitvilla

[jacketspuds]

£25m?

**** off.

If we thought he was worth £25m, with a year left on his deal, we would be offering him £100k / week easily. Pretty sure his holiness wouldn’t be telling Carney to turn that down.

[OutByEaster?]

24 minutes ago, fruitvilla said:

More or less agree, but what we can reasonably surmise:

1)  Carney's "agent" seems to be a non traditional type, perhaps parents, church, god type mix.
2)  Carney's ask is so high that the Villa management seem to baulking at the price.
3)  That Villa have a lot better understanding of Carney's valuation than does team Carney.
4)  A lot better understanding of othe situation than the peanut gallery here.
5)  Does not seem like an acceptable offer for Carney has come in (ie no one wants to beat the rush in January).

Of course the Villa management team may have got it all wrong.

There's another potential theory to this - based on:

Quote

1)  Carney's "agent" seems to be a non traditional type, perhaps parents, church, god type mix.

And that what whoever is representing him isn't asking for anything - that in their mind, the longer they let his contract run down, the better it is for him - Villa's offer is on the table, but they 're just sitting on it and seeing who else is going to offer them things. 

In this situation, 2. and 3. don't really come into play - Carney's team aren't asking for anything, they're just sitting on their hands because they feel it will benefit them.

The problem in this situation is Carney - he gets thrown under a bus because he's in a sort of limbo while they wait - there's no football thinking in it, just a wait for larger and larger contract offers.

I don't think an experienced agent does that - I think an experienced agent looks after the boy, an experienced agent plays a longer game and knows that a successful Carney will make plenty of money over a long career and doesn't risk that career for the nearest horizon.

Just a theory, but I'm not sure this is about what Carney's people are asking for, it's rather that they aren't asking any questions at all.

 

[KentVillan]

 

Apologies if already posted, but just been watching through the videos in this thread.

Best performances are probably Leicester, Norwich, Man Utd, Leeds, and he was ok against Liverpool. That's just going with my eye, doesn't quite line up with the WhoScored ratings, but those seemed to be the games where he kept possession and made a few things happen.

Watching this back I think we've given him a decent amount of game time for a 17/18 year old. The pace of the game surprised him, especially early in the season, and he kept losing the ball because he was too casual in possession. That did improve as the season went on, but you can see he was used to having a lot more time in the youth setup.

His strengths are obviously his short passing, tidy feet, and that little yard of pace he has on the turn that opens the pitch up a bit. He's good at progressing the play up the pitch. Quite reminiscent of Grealish at times.

Is that enough to be a really top drawer Premier League midfielder, though? I feel like he needs to add something else if he wants to start more games for us... better range of passing, more vision, more goal threat.

[nepal_villan]

Just cant see us getting 20M for someone who is 6 months away from signing a pre-contract and will not immediately start for any big club.

[Zatman]

3 hours ago, CarryOnVilla said:

Do Barcelona have £20m?

 

yes but its not legal tender

[MasterVillan]

For a young lad, with very few minutes under his belt, he and his agent just sound like trouble.

we’ve worked hard on our youth system and I wouldn’t sacrifice that for anything.  If he doesn’t want to sign, I’d be shipping him out.