Dean Smith

[terrytini]

1 minute ago, TRO said:

Not really no......After Spurs equalised I said to the mrs We have lost this......we were out pointed Terry in the second half in boxing terms.

but I see the reasons for losing in the game or the reasons for not negating the 2 errors and coming back with 2 more goals.....i can't just dismiss that as ok, when its not....i can't relate to that.

If Liverpool get spanked next week, do you think the scousers will say its ok, we have just won the European cup......they will debate the reasons why.....that all we are doing.

But we aren’t Liverpool !!!! That’s the whole point ! 

We are a Play Off qualifier.

They often go straight down

Most fans don’t debate why they get hammered by Man City.....because they recognise the gulf ......there’s a hierarchy of teams, and we are around 19/20. So we celebrate over achieving ( winning) but are tolerant and calm in defeat.

And it’s the debate content. I debated our use of wingers with a guy today, and our Striker with another. But I didn’t go on about us not doing this, not doing that, lacking this, needing that..

( as for Spurs, Agree we were, but they were very worried at 0-1 80 odd minutes.)

 

[TRO]

1 minute ago, Tomaszk said:

I was wrong, it wasn't at 2-0, it was at 1-0. We pressed ferociously after our keeper had given away a penalty after 90 seconds, we were all over them. The first 90 seconds nothing had happened.

Did you see the game? Honestly, I'm just wondering. We worked so hard that first half trying to right wrongs, can't believe anyone would say we weren't pressing. Think we paid for it at the end to be honest, lacked a bit of bounce last 10 mins.

I was there, I seen us attacking .....pressing for me is squeezing the opponent like Man City do closing down and denying them any space to work.....We was just attacking, that to me is a difference.....maybe we are interpreting things differently.

 

[terrytini]

4 minutes ago, TRO said:

so you didn't think we would beat Bournemouth?.....with our full stadium and the new league bounce....I'll bet they was not relishing coming to us, they even said they had to nullify us, such was their game plan.....but a bit of early tenacity and muscle and our gifts, set them on their way.....we had ample time to reverse it.

I thought we might. I thought adrenaline might help us...but that was knocked out by a 45 th second penalty and a deflection..

......what on Earth is a “ new league bounce “ ? If there are stats to back that concept up I will acknowledge it, but as far as I know about one side every couple of years manages that.

Point is, you EXPECTED 3 Points, I HOPED for 1.

That, not the way we played, explains our different degrees of contentment.

Which is what I said before the game when you said all that matters was the Win.

You are automatically going to find stuff to criticise at least 15 maybe 20, 25 times this season !!

I don’t see the fun in that, I don’t see how it helps, I think it’s a result of misplaced expectation, and I don’t think it’s the same as actually debating games, it’s just starting with being disappointed and building from there.

[terrytini]

10 minutes ago, Tomaszk said:

I was wrong, it wasn't at 2-0, it was at 1-0. We pressed ferociously after our keeper had given away a penalty after 90 seconds, we were all over them. The first 90 seconds nothing had happened.

Did you see the game? Honestly, I'm just wondering. We worked so hard that first half trying to right wrongs, can't believe anyone would say we weren't pressing. Think we paid for it at the end to be honest, lacked a bit of bounce last 10 mins.

There’s people who think we worked hard, did some good stuff, made mistakes, fought well.

And there’s people that don’t think so.

It baffles me, too.

[TRO]

2 minutes ago, terrytini said:

But we aren’t Liverpool !!!! That’s the whole point ! 

We are a Play Off qualifier.

They often go straight down

Most fans don’t debate why they get hammered by Man City.....because they recognise the gulf ......there’s a hierarchy of teams, and we are around 19/20. So we celebrate over achieving ( winning) but are tolerant and calm in defeat.

And it’s the debate content. I debated our use of wingers with a guy today, and our Striker with another. But I didn’t go on about us not doing this, not doing that, lacking this, needing that..

( as for Spurs, Agree we were, but they were very worried at 0-1 80 odd minutes.)

 

are we just to lie down and die.......are these "most fans" not interested in how they can improve and investigate why, I don't think Arsenal fans are very happy in general.....what are we all working for? shall we just send them the points in the post and cut out all the hot air.

why can't we debate our shortfalls without ****ing on anyone chips, why do we have to raise mitigating circumstances in doing so to satisfy the debate, like "we have only just come up".....We have spent £140 odd million and Norwich have spent diddly squat.....we played them at the end of last season with half a team and only just lost and they have just turned Newcastle over and played some impressive football to boot......so when do we just call the game as it is?....I didn't think we played well enough to win today sorry...irrespective of the why's.

[terrytini]

8 minutes ago, TRO said:

I was there, I seen us attacking .....pressing for me is squeezing the opponent like Man City do closing down and denying them any space to work.....We was just attacking, that to me is a difference.....maybe we are interpreting things differently.

 

There’s those unrealistic expectations again. 

Theres maybe two ther sides in Europe that press like Man City do.

Get that wrong, do it. too often , get the timing wrong, and you are slaughtered.

Which indeed happened against QPR and Norwich in Deano 2nd and 3 rd games last year.

Lets meet up and rewatch the game, I will point out the (10, 12, 15 times, I can’t recall) when we pressed effectively, and you show me all the times we failed to, when it was the right option.

[Tomaszk]

12 minutes ago, TRO said:

I was there, I seen us attacking .....pressing for me is squeezing the opponent like Man City do closing down and denying them any space to work.....We was just attacking, that to me is a difference.....maybe we are interpreting things differently.

 

Yep, I mean pressing an opponent when they have the ball and we don't. We did loads of it for me.

We also aren't Man City.

[terrytini]

2 minutes ago, TRO said:

are we just to lie down and die.......are these "most fans" not interested in how they can improve and investigate why, I don't think Arsenal fans are very happy in general.....what are we all working for? shall we just send them the points in the post and cut out all the hot air.

why can't we debate our shortfalls without ****ing on anyone chips, why do we have to raise mitigating circumstances in doing so to satisfy the debate, like "we have only just come up".....We have spent £140 odd million and Norwich have spent diddly squat.....we played them at the end of last season with half a team and only just lost and they have just turned Newcastle over and played some impressive football to boot......so when do we just call the game as it is?....I didn't think we played well enough to win today sorry...irrespective of the why's.

That’s beginning to sound a bit “ I want I want I want”.... that we get from some younger fans.

Now you are saying “ we’ve spent xyz” as if the reasons behind it are unknown to you. That money, as all Villa fans know, was to attempt to catch up to a starting level.....and to replace an entire team. Norwich were 20 points ahead, with no stupid contracts ending for aging players, I could go on all night. 

Fans of other Clubs point to a historical sense of entitlement amongst us lot...and that’s why. We finished miles behind Norwich yet some of our lot actually expect ....not hope, expect...that we will match or better them. 

No, we don’t lie down and die. But most fans don’t get their k inkers in a twist over analysing defeat by Man City, and very rarely actually criticise their club for such a defeat. But then maybe the have realistic expectations.

[terrytini]

Everton. 

Expectations ?

I expect us to lose.

Because I expect them to play well, and us to play well, and at this moment, if that happens, they should Win.

 

[TRO]

9 hours ago, terrytini said:

I thought we might. I thought adrenaline might help us...but that was knocked out by a 45 th second penalty and a deflection..

......what on Earth is a “ new league bounce “ ? If there are stats to back that concept up I will acknowledge it, but as far as I know about one side every couple of years manages that.

Point is, you EXPECTED 3 Points, I HOPED for 1.

That, not the way we played, explains our different degrees of contentment.

Which is what I said before the game when you said all that matters was the Win.

You are automatically going to find stuff to criticise at least 15 maybe 20, 25 times this season !!

I don’t see the fun in that, I don’t see how it helps, I think it’s a result of misplaced expectation, and I don’t think it’s the same as actually debating games, it’s just starting with being disappointed and building from there.

Pepe said I quote "Aston Villa are a team I am glad we will avoid in the first fixture such is the momentum teams coming up gender"......my interpretation Terry ...."New league Bounce".... you know what I mean.

Despite my comments I am not unduly down, I am slowly coming round after their 2 goal flurry.....do I think it will be more difficult than I initially thought?   ....yes I do.

No I am not automatically going to criticise the losing games, I notice flaws in winning games too, but my....I couldn't mention them could I?

Like we have rainy days and sunny days.....I appreciate the sun because of the rain.......I love the winning, because of the losing...but I like to comment on both with equal fairness.....I cannot turn a blind eye to shortfalls just to satisfy my lust for winning, its not fair.

Edited August 18, 2019 by TRO

[TRO]

3 minutes ago, terrytini said:

Everton. 

Expectations ?

I expect us to lose.

Because I expect them to play well, and us to play well, and at this moment, if that happens, they should Win.

 

On the evidence of today....I don't expect to win, maybe a draw.

If we get the improvement, I am looking for .....We can win.

We need to be at it down the flanks, the wingers need to be taking the game to them and not pussy footing.

[TRO]

20 minutes ago, terrytini said:

That’s beginning to sound a bit “ I want I want I want”.... that we get from some younger fans.

Now you are saying “ we’ve spent xyz” as if the reasons behind it are unknown to you. That money, as all Villa fans know, was to attempt to catch up to a starting level.....and to replace an entire team. Norwich were 20 points ahead, with no stupid contracts ending for aging players, I could go on all night. 

Fans of other Clubs point to a historical sense of entitlement amongst us lot...and that’s why. We finished miles behind Norwich yet some of our lot actually expect ....not hope, expect...that we will match or better them. 

No, we don’t lie down and die. But most fans don’t get their k inkers in a twist over analysing defeat by Man City, and very rarely actually criticise their club for such a defeat. But then maybe the have realistic expectations.

blimey, Terry you are jumping from one extreme to another.....a sense of entitlement? I seen some very average performances today from many of our players......without Tyrone Mings aerial domination it could have been more.

We was probably close to Norwich's points haul after our 10 game winning run.....The second half of our season was much in keeping with theirs.....we made a good account of ourselves in the 1-2 defeat with half our first team missing.....Don't make Norwich out as some kind of Man City in terms of expectations.....but equally, we don't shove the ball around and work the lines like they do.

Dean in my humble opinion and I like the guy very much is not emulating the style and the pass and movement he managed at Brentford....that's just my Opinion......I see flashes, but not as sustained as they managed under him.

Good Night mate

UTV

Edited August 18, 2019 by TRO

[TRO]

27 minutes ago, Tomaszk said:

Yep, I mean pressing an opponent when they have the ball and we don't. We did loads of it for me.

We also aren't Man City.

i'm talking about what they do not who they are.

[abdulaziz1]

We made it tough to ourselves, playing Everton next week makes you wonder how can we nick a win.

How should we approach the game? To me I think we shall play a diamond with Wesley and Trez upfront as I’ve said in another thread. With Targett and Guilbert starting so we could have support from the width.

[villalad21]

37 minutes ago, abdulaziz1 said:

We made it tough to ourselves, playing Everton next week makes you wonder how can we nick a win.

How should we approach the game? To me I think we shall play a diamond with Wesley and Trez upfront as I’ve said in another thread. With Targett and Guilbert starting so we could have support from the width.

Don't think it's a good idea to go away from what Smith knows and practice.

That's the sound of desperation. We just have to stick with this and get behind the team.

[abdulaziz1]

18 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Don't think it's a good idea to go away from what Smith knows and practice.

That's the sound of desperation. We just have to stick with this and get behind the team.

We’re behind the team anyway, its just our main strength is midfield. So we should get as much benefit as we could from it.

To be honest our performance yesterday reminded me about couple of games last season in December and January. Hull was one of them. While we’re beginning bad and losing 2-0, we somehow carry momentum and get back to the game. You feel some potential but you could see a lot of things missing.

[AVTuco]

6 hours ago, terrytini said:

Everton. 

Expectations ?

I expect us to lose.

Because I expect them to play well, and us to play well, and at this moment, if that happens, they should Win.

 

Do you have a date in mind when we should win a game too?

[Villarocker]

8 hours ago, TRO said:

• really.
• No we didn't....We don't press anywhere near sufficiently or regularly enough....and in contrast WE get closed down too easily.
• By doing the disciplines that give you a chance of surviving in this league......Did you watch Norwich, you might get an insight of whats required....that's what passing and moving is and playing between the lines....is Pukki finding his feet, settling in to the new league?
• Observation Terry, Observation....not criticism.....are we not allowed to observe shortfalls when we lose, at what point is the honeymoon over?
• I think to be where we are after 10 months is marvellous.....but what has that got to do with errors and shortfalls in today's game.....and you are wrong, we don't press teams and its a fault of ours....john McGinn is the only one, it needs to be groups who press.
• 3

Terry, I understand that things take time with so many new players, but equally we said all this with the french boys......We have to do the things that win football matches. Its no good just blindly saying it will come, it might, but equally it might not......I am not all doom and gloom, but I am not as confident as you it will all be ok......I seen enough things today to give me the eebie jeebies.

 

The thing about Pukki and Norwich is continuity. They had a youngish side last season that clicked and won the league. They've not changed it and gone on this season with the same way of playing and it's working for them. 

On the other hand, we had an ageing squad that required lots of changes and we lost two key players in Axel (looks to be replaced by a star in the making and Abraham, whose replacement needs time. 

We will be OK once our players settle down and gel together. We just have to hope all that happens in time for us to gain enough points to stay in this league. 

[Villarocker]

2 hours ago, villalad21 said:

Don't think it's a good idea to go away from what Smith knows and practice.

That's the sound of desperation. We just have to stick with this and get behind the team.

I like the new positive version of you. Maybe you could send a few lessons to Screwdriver! 

[Sulberto21]

It’s going to be at least until October/ November until our players are able to carry out the pressing passing football Smith wants. We just have to nick as many points as possible until we can implement his plans. It took Klopp a while to get his ideas across. 

If we were always a pressing team then we should be ready, but we never have been.

Edited August 18, 2019 by Sulberto21