Mantis Posted February 17, 2022 Share Posted February 17, 2022 I do get that offside is like the goal line in that you're either over it or not with no in between but unlike the goal line, there are so many more factors to consider that make it that much harder to adjudicate properly. VAR was originally sold as something that would stop clear offside goals being scored and overturn clear onside goals being called offside, and that would be fine, but it's been applied much more broadly and the VAR officials basically now have the power to arbitrarily pick and choose which goals they want to count and which they don't. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted February 17, 2022 Share Posted February 17, 2022 1 minute ago, Mantis said: I do get that offside is like the goal line in that you're either over it or not with no in between but unlike the goal line, there are so many more factors to consider that make it that much harder to adjudicate properly. VAR was originally sold as something that would stop clear offside goals being scored and overturn clear onside goals being called offside, and that would be fine, but it's been applied much more broadly and the VAR officials basically now have the power to arbitrarily pick and choose which goals they want to count and which they don't. Exactly. Take our one on Sunday, the reason it took them so long was because they were trying to pinpoint the frame in which the ball left the foot of Buendia (I think it was him), but we do not have the technology to provide definitive resolution as to when this is, now consider how marginal the call was - whose to say that one or two frames back they’re not level or Watkins is even onside, it’s all just bullshit and it’s really truly killing the game I think for a lot of people. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted February 17, 2022 Share Posted February 17, 2022 I think it would be better to go with the on field decision and then maybe give each team a set number of challenges. The PL seems to have its own flavour of VAR - where the decision to get involved appears random (or worse). And then we have sort of a mini show in its own right where pundits et all get to have a say. Contrast this with (I think ) the most recent euros - where decisions were reviewed very quickly and without the drama. Perhaps the PL and sky think the drama is part of the game. I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May-Z Posted February 17, 2022 Share Posted February 17, 2022 I just get frustrated about these tight offsides being given due to 'gaining an unfair advantage'. In our case, has Watkins really gained any sort of advantage from that extra mm? In my opinion, he hasn't, so it shouldn't really be an offside. I'd go for something like a block that is taken across the pitch from the last defender's torso. If you can see the attacker's hips past that block, then it would be offside. (Or a slight variation on this definition) This image is about right. I'd want this to be onside as the left hip is behind the 'wall'... but would be one of the tightest examples. Lets give more benefit to the attackers. We should be encouraging goals, not finding reasons to disallow them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turvontour Posted February 17, 2022 Share Posted February 17, 2022 1 hour ago, hippo said: I think it would be better to go with the on field decision and then maybe give each team a set number of challenges. The PL seems to have its own flavour of VAR - where the decision to get involved appears random (or worse). And then we have sort of a mini show in its own right where pundits et all get to have a say. Contrast this with (I think ) the most recent euros - where decisions were reviewed very quickly and without the drama. Perhaps the PL and sky think the drama is part of the game. I I think it should be a ten second review window. If it takes any longer then you stick with the original decision. Its surely to stop ridiculously wrong decisions, not to referee tight calls retrospectively. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Pongo's Socks Posted February 17, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted February 17, 2022 Just f@*k it off. Absolutely no place in the game for it. So refs and linesmen occasionally make mistakes that cost teams points? Big deal. I've watched football for 40 years, and the biggest culprits of game-changing mistakes have always been players and managers. But we can't replace them for a more efficient alternative, can we? It's a sport played by humans, watched by humans and adjudicated by humans. Mistakes will happen. VAR has as much place in football as an automated corner-taking machine that puts the perfect ball into the box every time. 11 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WakefieldVillan Posted February 17, 2022 Share Posted February 17, 2022 5 minutes ago, Pongo's Socks said: Just f@*k it off. Absolutely no place in the game for it. So refs and linesmen occasionally make mistakes that cost teams points? Big deal. I've watched football for 40 years, and the biggest culprits of game-changing mistakes have always been players and managers. But we can't replace them for a more efficient alternative, can we? It's a sport played by humans, watched by humans and adjudicated by humans. Mistakes will happen. VAR has as much place in football as an automated corner-taking machine that puts the perfect ball into the box every time. This Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjw63 Posted February 17, 2022 Share Posted February 17, 2022 4 hours ago, bannedfromHandV said: It’s all just bullshit and it’s really truly killing the game I think for a lot of people. Indeed. No way I'm ever paying thirty or forty quid again so some word removed with a ruler and pen can cheat my team out of a goal. Ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turvontour Posted February 17, 2022 Share Posted February 17, 2022 14 minutes ago, rjw63 said: Indeed. No way I'm ever paying thirty or forty quid again so some word removed with a ruler and pen can cheat my team out of a goal. Ever. Well this is it. 3000 villa fans paid about £100 each Sunday, probably travelled for an about 8 hours each, sacrificed a full day, to half celebrate a goal, and then have that goal taken away minutes later. Same as at Old Trafford in the cup a few games before. Was interesting to watch the villa on tour guy on YouTubes video in the away end at Newcastle. He says "subdued celebrations" straight after Watkins goal. Thats the whole reason you commit the time and the money, the ecstasy of an equaliser or winner away from home. What a farce. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted February 18, 2022 Share Posted February 18, 2022 The way it's applied in the PL, for every wrong decision VAR corrects, two more controversial ones are created. Quite frequently the referee will make the right decision on the pitch, VAR will intervene with their **** lines and bullshit, and then the referee will then implement an incorrect decision. It's absolutely killing the game. I barely even celebrate half our goals because there's always the looming threat of it being arbitrarily ruled out. The VAR officials control the game now, and I despise them. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted February 18, 2022 Share Posted February 18, 2022 It's almost like the PL thrives off the controversy and drama... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaParkAvenue Posted February 18, 2022 Share Posted February 18, 2022 On 15/02/2022 at 13:46, turvontour said: I know this isnt important, but why is Watkins goal awarded, added to the scoreline, players lined up to take kick off etc. And then its removed. Why isnt it goal pending? I think it’s because the authorities want to give the impression goals being disallowed is something rare. Openly admitting it’s now usually premature to celebrate goals would mean admitting VAR is killing the game. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted February 18, 2022 Share Posted February 18, 2022 1 hour ago, villa4europe said: It's almost like the PL is blatantly corrupt Yep fixed for you 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo_b Posted February 18, 2022 Share Posted February 18, 2022 I think eventually as more and more fans finally start reaching breaking point with Var there will finally be a backlash against it. I can’t believe there isn’t one petition out there to get rid of it out there?! I want it gone! I’d take getting screwed over in the cup final by United not getting a player sent off any time over Var for a full season. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted February 18, 2022 Share Posted February 18, 2022 34 minutes ago, Zatman said: Yep fixed for you Politer way of saying it might be purposefully engineering their product towards what they perceive their target audience to want Both in terms of the drama it adds and who it benefits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted February 18, 2022 Share Posted February 18, 2022 4 minutes ago, villa4europe said: Politer way of saying it might be purposefully engineering their product towards what they perceive their target audience to want Both in terms of the drama it adds and who it benefits I think Mike Ashley owned Newcastle wouldn't have had the intensive ruler out Few weeks back United scored a similar goal and the check was about 10 seconds Premier League have favoured teams and people csn say sour grapes but I don't remember many bad referee decisions this season that I would say we have got in our favour 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted February 18, 2022 Author VT Supporter Share Posted February 18, 2022 9 hours ago, turvontour said: Well this is it. 3000 villa fans paid about £100 each Sunday, probably travelled for an about 8 hours each, sacrificed a full day, to half celebrate a goal, and then have that goal taken away minutes later. It was offside though. If that had happened at the other end of the pitch and not been overturned then you could say those fans paid £100, travelled 8 hours each to see their team lose to a goal that shouldn't have stood 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted February 18, 2022 Author VT Supporter Share Posted February 18, 2022 14 minutes ago, Zatman said: I think Mike Ashley owned Newcastle wouldn't have had the intensive ruler out Few weeks back United scored a similar goal and the check was about 10 seconds Premier League have favoured teams and people csn say sour grapes but I don't remember many bad referee decisions this season that I would say we have got in our favour I think this is nonsense to be honest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turvontour Posted February 18, 2022 Share Posted February 18, 2022 4 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: It was offside though. If that had happened at the other end of the pitch and not been overturned then you could say those fans paid £100, travelled 8 hours each to see their team lose to a goal that shouldn't have stood But you dont need it to be right, it never was, or atleast you dont need it to be that right that it takes 3 minutes to decide. Even after the 3 minutes, nobody knows definitively. It's still guesswork. Having travelled around the country to away games I am far more interested in being able to enjoy those rare moments of equaliser and winners freely rather than worrying if tight calls arent quite correct. If you said to the 3000 there Sunday would you take the Ings goal at old Trafford to be given and Watkins goal to be given, but that means that maybe when say Joelinton scores and his heel is offside in the build up that that's also given. I think pretty much everyone would prefer that. To me it kind of draws a parallel with the European super league idea in that again it is the actual dedicated fans that would suffer. It really doesnt matter if you're watching on tv from a distance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted February 18, 2022 Share Posted February 18, 2022 48 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: It was offside though. If that had happened at the other end of the pitch and not been overturned then you could say those fans paid £100, travelled 8 hours each to see their team lose to a goal that shouldn't have stood Your staunch defence of VAR is getting as tiresome as the thing itself. Can you not see how it’s affected the game, honestly - did you celebrate the Watkins goal when it went in? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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