The Video Assistant Referee (VAR)

[Stevo985]

11 minutes ago, Phil Silvers said:

Then you are being naive.

Patronising.

I really don't think I am. One whistleblower and that's the biggest scandal in the history of football. It would already have come out. Paying officials to deliberately manipulate results through VAR? 

Do you know how big the coverup of that would have to be?

[tomav84]

1 hour ago, Zatman said:

I also dont celebrate goals anymore, you know the enjoyable part of the game that people get excited about. Even if the goal was allowed how can Watkins celebrate 3 minutes later as the moment is gone

i've said this before, but i don't get this mentality, i really don't. and i know you're not alone

i celebrate every goal as if it's going to stand

because if it gets chalked off, what's the worst thing that happens? VAR is not the reason why you don't celebrate goals. its a choice you've made that's all

[bannedfromHandV]

14 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

Patronising.

I really don't think I am. One whistleblower and that's the biggest scandal in the history of football. It would already have come out. Paying officials to deliberately manipulate results through VAR? 

Do you know how big the coverup of that would have to be?

You’re making it sound like it’s a back-alley deal with someone handing over a bundle of cash.

This is a systemic issue, it may not be quite as direct as two or more people having a conversation about whether or not they should cheat someone out of a goal, or gift someone a penalty or whatever the situation may be during a match but rather an overall leaning toward ensuring a positive outcome for a select number of teams - it’s just another mechanism for ensuring that those in favour triumph over those less desirable.

For what it’s worth, I think they are all in on it, to some extent or another, FIFA/UEFA, the Premier League, FA, PGMOL, the media…..it benefits all of them in some way or another to gift Liverpool a dodgy penalty or to pull the replay back one or two frames to ensure the United player is just on onside……

[tomav84]

32 minutes ago, Phil Silvers said:

Then you are being naive.

saying theres some big agenda favouring the big sides is quite an accusation, and frankly giving referees too much credit. how do you believe this comes about? a meeting at the start of the season with refs agreeing on a list of teams to favour? agreed sums of money per penalty/goal awarded? as someone else said above, it would be the biggest scandal in english football history and would've come out by now. its a ludicrous suggestion

i really do just think they're hopeless. the reason the repeated calls for fans to hear what the refs say have fallen upon deaf ears is because they don't want everyone to hear how incompetent they are. at the moment it's pure guesswork as to how refs come to their decisions.

[Phil Silvers]

19 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

Patronising.

I really don't think I am. One whistleblower and that's the biggest scandal in the history of football. It would already have come out. Paying officials to deliberately manipulate results through VAR? 

Do you know how big the coverup of that would have to be?

The more people that support them and try to justify its existence the easier it is for them.

We need a Dominic Cummings. Big businesses leave nothing to chance, chance plays a big part in sport and they are doing everything to stop it being competitive, the big companies and the organisations running the game will do anything to stop anyone dipping into the gravy train.

 

 

[Phil Silvers]

2 minutes ago, tomav84 said:

saying theres some big agenda favouring the big sides is quite an accusation, and frankly giving referees too much credit. how do you believe this comes about? a meeting at the start of the season with refs agreeing on a list of teams to favour? agreed sums of money per penalty/goal awarded? as someone else said above, it would be the biggest scandal in english football history and would've come out by now. its a ludicrous suggestion

i really do just think they're hopeless. the reason the repeated calls for fans to hear what the refs say have fallen upon deaf ears is because they don't want everyone to hear how incompetent they are. at the moment it's pure guesswork as to how refs come to their decisions.

It's a possibility. Why isn't it more transparent? Why can't managers and players say a word without being fined. 

We've got ref watch on sky that agrees with everything the ref and var have done every week and vaguely justifying blatant mistakes. No one in the game, or fams will ever say the big teams are not being favoured.

It's just my opinion Tom, it's how it makes me feel, I cannot rationalise blatant favouritism and just shrug my shoulders at the injustice. Why is it happening, what is the motive? Follow the money.

[Mantis]

24 minutes ago, tomav84 said:

i've said this before, but i don't get this mentality, i really don't. and i know you're not alone

i celebrate every goal as if it's going to stand

because if it gets chalked off, what's the worst thing that happens? VAR is not the reason why you don't celebrate goals. its a choice you've made that's all

It's not really a conscious thing though. Before VAR you'd celebrate a goal because it'd almost always be given, or at least chalked off within seconds. Now I'd say the majority of goals have a good chance of being removed within a couple of minutes due to VAR meddling. It's perfectly natural to not celebrate many goals as fiercely because you know there's a good chance it won't even stand.

[Rds1983]

Dodgy or not it doesn't change the fact that it's taking enjoyment out of the game by being too slow and too pedantic. Having been to League One games recently the atmosphere is so much better, genuine enjoyment when goals go in and the instant reaction to it all. It's what football is meant to be and what the top flight used to have. As time passes I'm getting less enthusiastic about the top flight due to all the issues. 

[Stevo985]

21 minutes ago, Phil Silvers said:

The more people that support them and try to justify its existence the easier it is for them.

We need a Dominic Cummings. Big businesses leave nothing to chance, chance plays a big part in sport and they are doing everything to stop it being competitive, the big companies and the organisations running the game will do anything to stop anyone dipping into the gravy train.

 

 

Saying that there probably isn’t a massive conspiracy to influence officials to deliberately manipulate the results of matches is not “supporting” them

[turvontour]

38 minutes ago, tomav84 said:

i've said this before, but i don't get this mentality, i really don't. and i know you're not alone

i celebrate every goal as if it's going to stand

because if it gets chalked off, what's the worst thing that happens? VAR is not the reason why you don't celebrate goals. its a choice you've made that's all

Maybe it's down to the individuals mindset.

I watched the man u away cup game, everton away and newcastle away on tv at home and didnt celebrate either of the ings or Watkins goals as my instant reaction was that this will probably be ruled out. I celebrated the Buendia header at everton as that's very unlikely to be disallowed straight from the corner.

It's kind of case by case isnt it, like I fully celebrated all the goals at home to Leeds as they were flowing moves. Its about likelihood.

[Stevo985]

I celebrate most goals but when it's obviously going to be a marginal offside call then I am reluctant. Although I would say this seems to be a thing when I'm watching on TV. At the ground everyone goes mental regardless.

But it's definitely one of the big drawbacks, and I think offsides are really the main culprit. If we could move to that new instant offside decision that was shown a few pages back then I think that would be the best of both worlds

[Stevo985]

54 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said:

You’re making it sound like it’s a back-alley deal with someone handing over a bundle of cash.

This is a systemic issue, it may not be quite as direct as two or more people having a conversation about whether or not they should cheat someone out of a goal, or gift someone a penalty or whatever the situation may be during a match but rather an overall leaning toward ensuring a positive outcome for a select number of teams - it’s just another mechanism for ensuring that those in favour triumph over those less desirable.

I agree with all of this, my only point was that I don't think it's explicit corruption. I don't think officials are DELIBERATELY fixing matches via the manipulation of decisions to suit the bigger teams, and I don't really understand why they would do that unless those specific teams were the ones paying them off.

But is VAR something that enables the bias towards bigger teams to be wider spread? Absolutely it is. I thought VAR would make that better due to refs being given more time to consider decisions rather than go with their gut which is more likely to be influenced. But I don't think that has been the case, unfortunately. I still think the biggest problem with VAR is its implementation in the Premier League rather than the technology itself. However they go hand in hand, so as it is I don't think it's fit for purpose.

 

57 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said:

For what it’s worth, I think they are all in on it, to some extent or another, FIFA/UEFA, the Premier League, FA, PGMOL, the media…..it benefits all of them in some way or another to gift Liverpool a dodgy penalty or to pull the replay back one or two frames to ensure the United player is just on onside……

This is the bit that I think is nonsense. That there is actual, conscience, manipulation of systems to ensure big teams get decisions. I just don't think it's the case. For any number of reasons, but primarily given the amount of people that would have to be involved in a conspiracy like that, in an industry that has more scrutiny than most, it would be virtually impossible to not have whistleblowers all over the place

[Mantis]

The thing about VAR is that they've effectively made goals that are level illegal, so it's understandable why people are more reluctant celebrating goals that aren't more than a foot onside.

[Phil Silvers]

The only tiny doubt I have that there is corruption here is the incompetence of the people involved. 

The big clubs are bent, have to be. Look at the fines for the sly implementation of a super league, very lenient and then overturned, do people not think brown envelopes were being passed around.

VAR and pgmol have become worse since the collapse of the proposed super league, just coincidence?

I remember a weekend this season when Chelsea, Liverpool, citeh and ManU needed a penalty to either win or draw to stay in the top 4 in their matches and they got it, theres a bit of .... just get in the box and run into someone, go down and I'll give it.

Our players get kicked relentlessly without caution, we clip someone and the cards are out. 

There is so much see, so much that points towards corruption. But it just sounds ridiculous without proof, I can dig that. 

 

 

[hippo]

6 hours ago, Tommo_b said:

I think eventually as more and more fans finally start reaching breaking point with Var there will finally be a backlash against it.

I can’t believe there isn’t one petition out there to get rid of it out there?!

I want it gone! I’d take getting screwed over  in the cup final by United not getting a player sent off any time over Var for a full season. 

OK - you want Action :- 

https://chng.it/PpczfbKSVP

 

 

 

Edited February 18, 2022 by hippo

[StefanAVFC]

46 minutes ago, Mantis said:

The thing about VAR is that they've effectively made goals that are level illegal, so it's understandable why people are more reluctant celebrating goals that aren't more than a foot onside.

Yeah i didnt consider this but it's completely true.

Level no longer exists.

You're either in front or behind, based on mms.

[hippo]

21 minutes ago, Phil Silvers said:

The only tiny doubt I have that there is corruption here is the incompetence of the people involved. 

The big clubs are bent, have to be. Look at the fines for the sly implementation of a super league, very lenient and then overturned, do people not think brown envelopes were being passed around.

VAR and pgmol have become worse since the collapse of the proposed super league, just coincidence?

I remember a weekend this season when Chelsea, Liverpool, citeh and ManU needed a penalty to either win or draw to stay in the top 4 in their matches and they got it, theres a bit of .... just get in the box and run into someone, go down and I'll give it.

Our players get kicked relentlessly without caution, we clip someone and the cards are out. 

There is so much see, so much that points towards corruption. But it just sounds ridiculous without proof, I can dig that. 

 

 

Not just because I support Villa - but the chalked off goal at old Trafford says it all. They scrutinised the whole build to try and find a way to dis allow the goal. They told us it would be used to correct 'Clear and obvious errors'  - they lied 

[Phil Silvers]

8 minutes ago, StefanAVFC said:

Yeah i didnt consider this but it's completely true.

Level no longer exists.

You're either in front or behind, based on the name of your team.

FTFY

[sharkyvilla]

'We need a Dominic Cummings'.  Never thought I'd ever read that sentence!

[sharkyvilla]

I agree with @Stevo985 there would be too many people involved in a cover up to make this kind of corruption possible, a bit like with the moon landings.  The simplest explanation is that the refs are just incredibly shit.